After the eighth school shooting in seven weeks – some gun control proposals

Man has this thread gone off track. Ok so yes there are definitely some well armed anti government groups that have been building up in different parts of the country. Both anti left and anti right groups. They have stayed constitutionally protected. I am remembering recent events where the rancher and the govt got into a disagreement and an armed anti govt group whose name I don't recall and won't Google right now, came to his aide. It was an armed stand off and the government backed down. That isn't an attempt to overthrow a government but it starts a process of a slippery slope.

As to the question of what is a bad govt. I'll use this example. Let's propose that we believed Trump was in fact anti Muslim. All Muslims as it has been stated by the Dems.

Now let's say that Trump deputized his Christian followers and says "Go get em". Would you propose we arm the Muslims or not?

While it isn't in recent history, I will remind you that this is pretty much what The Crusades were about in Europe. The King and the Church banded together and essentially put to death anyone that wasn't their religion. Was that an example of a bad tyrannical govt.?

There are for fact in this country Christian extremeist that feel that if you don't feel as they do, you should be sent to hell. Now add Muslims who some extremeist feel the same about other religions. The ingredients are here. I will protect Muslims that are being unjustly persecuted as much as I will a Christian. And I am neither Christian or Muslim. And in the end I may need to protect myself from either of them.

 

Not

Sorry this is a real mess – what is your point – that you want to have guns because you think Christian’s and Muslim’s want to kill you but you would defend them but you are frightened ‘the king’ and Trump are going to send medieval crusaders to attack the Muslims and then turn on you and Cliven Bundy….

And that's why you think people need guns and shouldn’t support gun control?

LOL

Anyway it seems to me that Americans should begin to realise that those that are opposing prudent gun control regulations are virtually all delusional fantasists or cynical lobbyists being paid by the arms manufacturers so they can sell more guns.

 

In other words, if the President scrapped the Constitution and proceeded to take illegal action against American citizens, would we take up arms against the armed mob that is carrying out his illegal orders? (who are probably the NRA fan club? I think we'd be at the point of civil war, and I hope you, I, and others would take action to defend the Constitution against a Fascist takeover by the Prez. We'd be in Martin Niemoeller's "First they came for the Jews..." situation facing the beginnings of a Fascist takeover by the Prez. My questions are: (1) is that scenario likely enough to happen for us to accept the side effects of letting the gun situation in this country continue (8 school shootings in a week and the rest of the current gun violence, not to mention some crazy militia group showing up to blow me away because they found out I'm doing anti-gun or anti-Trump posts on HF; I see this question as comparable to: if you found out that your wife bought an AR and was planning to use it on your kids would you arm them); (2) how is it that other free countries like Australia get along without these worries? (3) might it be possible to come up with reasonable restrictions that would limit access to rapid fire rifles by nuts while allowing normal people to keep their hunting rifles and handguns?

 

People want to buy a gun? Fine, but they should have to buy liability insurance along with it.

 

Well the left is claiming that Trump is in fact violating the Constitution. So who knows how that will degrade.

And while I personally don't think I will be affected by it, many others do feel it necessary to prepare for doomsday type scenarios. I used to think they were nutcases but I have learned to understand their views better.

I was merely responding to the inputs that some on the left believe that gun owners somehow want to overthrow the govt. instead of the other way around. I have said before that these doomsday guys make me nervous, but they are well within their rights to feel the way they do.

Getting back to stopping the school shooters. Go ahead have a crack at making guns illegal. Go for it.

 

ONE MORE TIME: I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT MAKING GUNS ILLEGAL!

 

There are far too many poor people that their supporters will scream penalizes them from owning a gun if you make them have to buy insurance. Now these poor people are being discriminated to the ability to keep and bear arms.

 

Maybe you specifically aren't, but this has been the suggested hope. Even myself included thinks we need to make an AR15 illegal. I just don't see it happening is all I'm saying.

 

one has to have insurance to buy a car.

 

No, one has to have insurance to drive a car.

 

Not

More muddled and rather passive aggressive jibba jabba – you seem to say you think the survivalist gun types are nutters but then say you agree with them – you think ‘the left’ should realise that ‘the government’ is really trying to ‘overthrow’ you and America although they are not doing it yet but that’s why you think people should have guns although people with guns make you nervous.

It’s a bit confused

And what do you mean by saying – “Go ahead have a crack at making guns illegal. Go for it”

Is that a recommendation, a threat or what?

Again I would wish the anti-gun control people would look at what they say and realise how irrational or confused it seems.

 

To repeat -

Gun control proposals

I thought I’d put together a couple of lists that MeAgain and I have presented in the past (I hope MeAgain doesn’t mind) of things we think could be done in relation to gun control–

From MeAgain

Educate people about what the new legislation is about and would entail (Not taking away all guns, the goal is to reduce harm by limiting easy access to the criminal and irresponsible)

Reinforcing, enhancing, and mandating back ground checks.

Immediate destruction of any weapon, ammunition, etc. used or acquired illegally.

Limiting the amount of legal ammunition that can be bought and retained.

Buyback programs - to get rid of or lower the number of midnight specials, assault weapons, etc.

All gun owners would need to pass a test of competence and responsibility to get a gun licence (part of which would be to pass a psychological evaluation)

A gun owner would need an up to date licence and insurance to carry on owning a gun.

Mandatory records of all sells or transfers of all firearms and immediate destruction of any that are discovered to be not recorded.

From Balbus

Any gun kept at home or place of work (including businesses that involve guns) would have to be held in a secure manner (eg safe or other secure locking system). People that didn’t have an approved system would not be allowed to own a gun

If a person looses or has their gun stolen, and it is shown that they did not show due diligence in securing their weapon they would be subject to a heavy fine and/or banned from owning a gun.

Any guns would have to be presented for inspection 6 months after purchase then again one year after purchase and then every five years after that. Not presenting the gun would mean losing the owner’s gun license and being banning from owning a gun. If the gun has been lost or stolen and that has not been reported that would result in heavy fine and/or custodial sentence.

*

These would be national laws the same through all the states and a department would be set up to monitor them and make sure they are been enforced equally throughout the country.

 

Holy hell. Here is what said in the post exactly. "I used to think they were nutcases but I have learned to understand their views better.

Now you assert that this means I agree with them. You skipped right over the fact that I said they make me nervous. And this why its hard to expect that opposing sides can ever come to terms with compromise. I am an independent voter. I have both left and right leaning friends. But ALL of them are civil and thoughtful in the way they present their views. And we learn to learn from each other better. None of them have a hard time understanding plain English. We don't try to put words into each others mouths The extreme rights or lefts always seem to have a hard time understanding each other. As plain as I state "I have learned to understand their views better" it becomes what you know you want me to say to make me out to be one of them.

Then make it better by asserting psycho babble name calling to attempt to denigrate any of those that oppose you.

It a pretty scripted routine that everyone has grown very used to.

What the hell ever. Whatever Go For IT means to you....GO FOR IT!

 

GO FOR IT!

 

America is not peaceful - its leadership recently overthrew govts in Afghanistan , Iraq , Libya and Ukraine ; tried
but failed in Syria . The spirit of war comes home . The AR15 happens to look like a military weapon . And yes ,
an avenging spirit of war is mental illness and has no rules of engagement .

What does a peace march look like , has it the voice of anger ? It may have power without authority .

 

Go for it

It can depend on context – in simple terms

‘Let’s end slavery’

Go for it – and see what happens (those that support slavery)

Go for it – yes that seems right (those against it)

‘Let’s bring in gun control’

Go for it – and see what happens

Go for it – yes that seems right

*

The first in the US ended in war

 

So if you care to view this link, and listen to the African American Anthony Brian Logan thoughts afterwords maybe this will help you keep things in perspective.

And as we all know Liberal logic= If he is black and he is opposed by a white they are racist. So you will need to consider your decision to disagree with him with the same logic. I have no idea what his political leanings are, and don't care. But I agree with this man.

 

Yeah. Either way it was to prevent deception.

 

So current gun control laws prevented this man from getting a gun. Good.

The argument is that current laws dont go far enough and more needs to be done to reduce the number of guns in circulation and to ensure that gun owners are more responsible with the guns they do own, as well as prevent guns from being sold to people who aren't stable enough to own them. The journalist was denied a gun but plenty of people who shouldn't be buying guns do purchase them every day. How can you agree with this guy that current gun laws are enough when mass shootings are a normal occurance in the US and dont seem to happen anywhere else on a regular basis?

But wait, you've said repeatedly that you agree we need more gun control.

Hmm. So what part of the video do you agree with, the long rant against liberals filled with pointless generalizations ? Yay for divisive rhetoric right

The thing you said about racism is just idiotic and doesn't deserve to be addressed.