After the eighth school shooting in seven weeks – some gun control proposals

Nothing evasive about it. That's a different question from murder. You are the one that chose to change it to murdering cops. An oversight (maybe) but the context is markedly different.

So for me I'd consider taking up arms against them if they attempted to trespass upon or take my land.

If they attempted to enter my home without a warrant or my permission to.

If they attempted to prevent me from leaving my property without a court order or proper cause.

If they attempted to act upon me with a false probable cause. ie. Deciding to take me from my home because they think I did something but have no proof.

If they were corrupted and attempting to eliminate their foes simply because they are foes. ie I was a black sympathizer in the times if the KKK activities.

That should cover most that I can see may apply to me and that addresses your specific group of my local police dept. question.

 

Unless you are accused of certain things.

Just add taking guns if you might be insane to the list of certain things.

 

Yep. Its the most common tactic used to try and turn an argument into a different outcome. And yes in the past 8 or 9 years it has become the new norm. So many just shut up. It isn't worth it trying to talk to them. They think its successful. In reality all it turns into is they just agree with themselves that they have won, because nobody wants to oppose them anymore.

 

We'd absolutely LOVE to make this place a better place to live. But we are in the minority in how we feel that needs to be done. It has been brought up by myself and quite a few others that guns have been around for hundreds of years. Access to guns has been roughly the same for all those years.

The irrational argument is we don't have an increased crime problem and we don't have different demographics than we had in previous years when we had a better society and less crime. You can argue what you think is rational or not. You look just as irrational in our eyes as we do yours.

I'd rather we just go back to each group will seek out each other, support each others common lifestyles, and do everything we can to prevent the opposing views to take over ours. It has become clear to me that the other side thinks they are smarter, so I will choose to sit back, let the country continue on its path to being a shithole nation and let the smart ones figure out why that's happening.

I lived in London myself for a time. Earlier than this posting by about 15 years. During that time it got regularly bombed by the IRA. Hundreds killed. They were at war with each other. The Brit cops walked the streets in full combat gear. Until such time as they rounded up the enemy and made them disappear. Lets see if the liberal agenda allows that to happen in this country.

 

You bring up an excellent point!

Lets discuss ADHD. I remember not paying attention as a kid. I remember it because I got my ass whipped when I didn't pay attention. It solved my ADHD problems. Now we call it ADHD and lets medicate. This is certainly a changed demographic in our country that has occurred within the past decade or so.

 

No doubt. And the culture that now we shouldn't discipline our children by laying a hand on them.

 

I've been on ADHD and anti-depressant meds before The patient prescribed to this stuff needs to take it every day in order for it to work effectively. Causing a chemical dependence. Once you're chemically dependent, and you forget to take your pills one morning, then you're really messed up and mentally nonfunctional to get any task done. When this happened to me, it made me believe that I literally could not function in life without one. But what I didn't realize was that I was chemically dependent on this shit. And this mentality is how big pharma diabolically profits by giving medications to people who don't need it.


More than 20% of boys aged 5-18 get diagnosed with ADHD and put on these brain destroying drugs. Cultural Marxists have declared war on "toxic masculinity" by putting young children on behavior controlling drugs at a very early age. No, they don't want boys to be boys.

 

I'd draw the line at anything that makes an unskilled shooter into a lethal menace. Guns in their purest form aren't the issue: it's the technology that enhances them. If you can aim in the general direction of a mass of people and just spray into a crowd and take out 50 of them in a matter of seconds, that's a problem. If you need fully automatic weapons with magazines holding 30 bullets and a laser targeting device, shooting isn't for you.

It's a skill. And like all skills, it's perfected through practice. And if you practice with something dangerous, you are going to respect it for what it can do to a fragile human body. But modern technology has taken the skill out of it. Bump stocks, sighting devices, magazines that hold an unnecessarily large amount of ammunition...This is the stuff that has made mass killing easier. So that's where I'd draw the line. If you need a laser scope and more than five shots to drop a target from 20 feet away, you shouldn't be anywhere near a firearm.

 

Its worthy to consider all possibilities, but i think its a minor part of the cause. Same with violent movies or video games. It just doesn't seem to be it. It could be an extra influence on an already troubled person, sure. But so can a lot of other stuff, like being yelled at or who knows. It's not the main cause or a reason to totally get rid of it.

A bigger influence seems to be the adult gun culture and propaganda. I've seen some ads. Fearful people are made seriously scared just to buy a gun it seems. And of course every guy who has a sense of protect the innocent and values their right as a Merkin is betraying himself and his country if they don't get a gun lol. Quite pathetic all in all. Not really worth a lol but still

It seems the habit of perscribing all kinds of people all kinds of (sometimes dangerous) pills for their head is indeed part of the problem. Not beating your kids probably not lol. It all matters where you hit (slap) a kid and why (rare occasions only and make sure why its done). What i find great, in retrospect only , is that my father also always showed he really disliked disciplining me that way. It was one of the best ways to teach me a much needed lesson. I don't think a lot of people adhere to the culture of not physically disciplining your kid. They're either for or against regardless.
But the medicines to easily deal with all kinds of mental issues is more likely a part of it (It seems to played a significant part in that mass shooter known as 'the batman killer'. Great doc about it. It definitely wasnt due to the parents there). A bigger part than flawed gun control and a majority of citizens who have been duped into believing it can't or shouldn't be improved? Arguable.

Some people in this thread act like if its not a shortterm solution its not a good solution. That also seems a wrong way to conclude things. Just because the best options for eliminating or strongly limiting the chances of mass shootings, other needless gun violence and of course all the gun accidents may be hard to accomplish doesn't mean that isn't the way to go.

 

I agree! That 'improved' shotgun example was great.
Improve the quality of what the gun was supposed to do, not the options of what can be done with it (which generally places it in another category. Which pisses of people who feel anyone should get it. Its a win win staying with the original purpose of different kind of guns. Who needs an option to spray bullets for hog hunting? A good or a bad hunter?).

 

It seems like your reluctant to see the

You mention a lot of the things that I would like to see addressed, like the bump stock for example (and it's already been illegal here for some time). It seems like you aren't in agreement about assault weapons though. I think it could send a really strong message to the NRA and gun culture if we address that particular weapon. I'd like to see them on board with all of these resolutions, as it seems you are one step away from being. I don't know enough about the technical aspects of an AR15 vs a beretta 9mm, say... or some other semi-automatic rifle. I guess the question I need to ask is what is so dangerous about a semi-automatic rifle? I feel like it's really good that you realize there are some weapons that are too dangerous for civilians.

 

I agree. But I think Call of Duty or Rainbow Six or what have you can play a more significant role depending on earlier socialization. If we focus on this early socialization we may be addressing some of the concerns about mental health that have been voiced. I don't know where it would begin though. I mean, good luck saying football is too violent. Or karate.

 

I'd like to touch a few things in your polite and well thought out post. For one thing, I totally support background checks. I'm not sold that more gun laws will solve this problem, but I've never once advocated getting rid of existing gun laws. I absolutely support background checks. And, for the most part, the gun show loophole is closed. Not legally, of course, but something like 90% of firearms sold at gun shows are through licensed dealers who have to do background checks. Also, many private sellers elect to do background checks. So while some firearms are purchased in a more peer-to-peer fashion, it's not really the biggest factor. And gun enthusiasts tend to self-regulate more than most people know.

Also, I do agree that it's cultural. That's what I've been saying. I was watching this show last night that was talking about how media has cultivated a culture of fear. We're constantly being told that the world is evil, scary and closing in on us. That'll make anyone gullible want to sleep with their finger on the trigger. And it made me think back to Bowling for Columbine. Wasn't that Michael Moore's exact thesis statement? That we're more violent because we're convinced everyone around us is out to get us? If there is any truth to that--and I believe there is--then I totally agree because that's absolutely cultural.

I agree that confiscating guns just...can't happen. It will set off the very conflict the Second Amendment was set up to protect us from. But I take that less seriously. The anti-government folks who think their right to bear arms is so that they can go toe-to-toe with he federal government are laughable at best, dangerous at worst. Do they really think a few guys with AR15s are going to resist cluster bombs, tanks, jets, artillery cannons, and the rest of the might of the American military? So, while I recognize that the Second Amendment was written with that in mind, I also recognize that it wasn't written with modern warfare in mind. The government could squash an uprising with a few drones. So that argument is almost moot at this point.

 

I really don't think agressive sports or violent video games have to adapt to people who are against violence or agression. They should simply keep their kids or themselves away from it. Isn't karate always taught with a strong ethical code already? Seems a great sport to me in all aspects. Especially for kids.
Authorities spending the effort on changing video games, gangsta rap, Ozzy Osbourne (historic example where he got blamed for a kids suicide comes to mind) but not on the real issue are actually part of the problem imo.
But like i said: everything is worthy to look at. I just don't think these things are it. Gangsta rap has increased street and (wannabe) gang culture though.

 

I don't know much about the AR myself. And I don't address assault weapons for two main reasons: One, I've never, fired, owned, or had the desire to own, one. So, in that regard, I don't know what I'm talking about. Two, the definition of that constitutes an "assault weapons" changes depending to whom you're speaking with. I don't even know that an AR is an assault rifle to be honest with you. And if it is, what makes it so? But any semi-automatic rifle that can be loaded with 30 hollow point bullets is ridiculous. People who say they need that to hunt are full of shit.

 

Not always. I used to take my little brother to karate and was disappointed when I saw how his class was run. It was all about fighting and competition. I thought the ethics and culture would be part of it. It wasn't.

I guess I was expecting Mr. Miyagi, but that's just the movies I guess.

 

That would be a good starting point, but it would have to be voluntary. I don't listen to it so I don't really know the degree of the problem.

 

I've always agreed with Michael Moore on that. And I do think the nonstop media coverage following mass shootings does help to fuel subsequent mass shootings.

I think I've touched upon this before...there is an unspoken rule in journalism to avoid reporting on suicides because there is a correlation between suicide rates and media coverage

It would be interesting to see if there would be drop in mass shootings if the media didnt give the subject such frenetic coverage

 

I feel like there is a MMA steel-cage aspect to it though.. lol. I see what you mean though. It's just that we're being taught in sociology that boys are raised and socialized into a more violent persona.

 

The movies also showed the other (bad) example but yes, its disappointing it (still) happens at karate schools irl too.
But that fighting and competition plays a role is understandable and not bad by definition of course! But i guess it was only about that. Unfortunate indeed.

 

I can't agree with this statement enough. I am very curious to see what would happen if the media stopped reporting on this. Or, at the very least, didn't mention the shooter at all. Let's stop making martyrs out of psychopaths and giving would be psychopaths iconic role models to emulate.