They ARE concentration camps

Let's just cut to the chase here. These immigrants are fleeing conditions in their counties. Let's start with Honduras. Who is responsible for the conditions in Honduras? Specifically, what role does the U.S. play in creating those conditions?

You can naively insist that something must be done, and then try to shame everyone into agreeing with you, but short of opening the borders and letting everyone in, there is no solution. You have not thought this through AT ALL. And neither have you considered that your solution would necessarily set a precedent for all troubled peoples of the world to come to the U.S. where they will be welcomed. You can welcome all the people as fast as they can come, but the truth is that unless you remove the cause for the inflow of illegals, you're going to be faced with a flow of effects.

So your homework for today is to put your emotions to the side and look into the U.S.'s role in creating the conditions from which these people are running.

 

I'm way ahead of you. The major factors causing the immigrants to flee lie in political conditions in their home countries. Trump's response is to cut back on assistance to said countries, making the situation worse. I have no desire to see an open borders policy where all immigrants are welcomed, but I do want to see that they are not actively abused. Your homework for today is to get a heart and some common decency.

 

No, you are not way ahead of me. Nor did you put your emotions to the side. Instead, you pulled out the shame tactic . . . again. Now, let's try this again, but without you dodging the pertinent question that was put to you. What is the U.S.'s role in creating the conditions from which these people are running.

 

immaterial, incompetent and irrelevant. But now that you ask, we can start with the coup that overthrew Arbenz in 1954, fully backed by he Eisenhower Administration at the behest of United Fruit Co. The U.S. also funded counterinsurgency efforts in Honduras, and use the country as a staging ground for the Contras (see Reagan's Iran-Contra deal). Death squads flourished, tens of thousands died and the society collapsed. The U.S. also backed El Salvador’s protracted war with the FMLN,he U.S. organized and funded El Salvador’s long war war with the FMLN. Then the U.S. deported gang members released from our prisons there, where they took control. Try that on for starts.

 

Let's be more precise.

American companies built railroads, established their own banking systems, and bribed government officials at a dizzying pace. As a result, the Caribbean coast became a foreign-controlled enclave that systematically swung the whole of Honduras into a one-crop economy whose wealth was carried off to New Orleans, New York, and later Boston.

The Reagan years also saw the construction of numerous joint Honduran-U.S. military bases and installations. Such moves greatly strengthened the militarization of Honduran society. In turn, political repression rose. There was a dramatic increase in the number of political assassinations, “disappearances” and illegal detentions.

The Reagan administration also played a big role in restructuring the Honduran economy. It did so by strongly pushing for internal economic reforms, with a focus on exporting manufactured goods. It also helped deregulate and destabilize the global coffee trade, upon which Honduras heavily depended. These changes made Honduras more amenable to the interests of global capital. They disrupted traditional forms of agriculture and undermined an already weak social safety net.

These decades of U.S. involvement in Honduras set the stage for Honduran emigration to the United States, which began to markedly increase in the 1990s.

Agree, or disagree?

 

Like those rape trees. It sure isn't Americans setting those up.

 

If we know who is responsible, they are within U.S. jurisdiction, and we can track them down, absolutely--that is, if there actually is rape involved. Of course, that's often hard to prove. See Kavanaugh hearings and Trump's accusers.

 

What a weird response. Rape is not difficult to prove in the age of DNA. A sample should be taken from everyone caught sneaking across the border. Cross comparisons will yield family connections that aren't even documented.

What's really sick is that they are raping children and in too many cases they are killing them afterward and leaving them for the coyotes (the 4-legged kind, not the assholes who smuggle people across the border, for a price).

But it seems like you wouldn't want anyone to look too deeply into such matters. It could make it seem like some of what Trump claimed was correct. And we can't ever let that happen can we. Even if it is true.

Really man, "if there actually s rape involved"? Are you trying to be glib about this? Or do you have some other agenda? I'd sure hate to think so.

I don't care if you answer, you're off to clicksville as far as I'm concerned.

 

Yes, I agree with what you say so far, restricted as it is to Honduras The first paragraph is lifted from Cornell historian Walter LaFeber's Inevitable Revolutions, the U.S. Role in Central America, p. 43. I'd go back to 1911 when the U.S. backed the Bonilla military coup in return for concessions to United Fruit, making the country the prototypical banana republic More recently, the U.S-backed trade liberalization tied the economy to global capital, hastening rural farm migration.
The US role in the Honduras coup and subsequent violence
Here's How The U.S. Sparked A Refugee Crisis On The Border, In 8 Simple Steps | HuffPost

 

Well, in the case of Trump, it seems to be difficult to prove. I'm not up on rape trees, but from what I gather from sites that are, like InfoWars and Breitbart (Are there any reliable ones?), the term refers to trees or shrubs along the USA/Mexican border that have been decorated with panties and bras thrown on them, supposedly by Hispanic "coyotes" who transported women illegally across the border. I have no difficulty believing that women and girls in the company of criminals might be victims of sexual assault and even murder by them. Rape is a horrendous crime, but you see in a rape case more is needed by way of evidence than panties and bras on a tree. Is there further evidence? A corpus delicti or testifying witness might be helpful. Making a case on the basis of DNA alone is not feasible without a showing that penetration occurred and the victim, if adult, did not consent. Cross comparisons of DNA from apprehended undocumented aliens won't do the job without more. In my part of the country, charges of rape against minority men were often the prelude to lynchings, to keep the "horny bucks" in line.

Methinks your indignant reaction masks an effort to use this as a means of discrediting my other comments and/or to distract attention from the topic of the thread: conditions in detention facilities for migrants. In terms of relevance to the topic, do rape trees have any bearing on the treatment of asylum seekers, including women and children, in detention facilities? My "agenda" is to keep red herrings from distracting attention from that.

 

But again, let's address the cause of the flow of immigrants; that is, if you really want to nip this problem in the bud. Despite the atrocious violations of human rights in Honduras, why have the past Administrations increased aid to that government? I can't think of a better way to help promote that flow of immigrants.

 

Past administrations have increased aid to the various Honduran governments for a variety of reasons: economic benefits to U.S. corporations, Cold War strategy in controlling insurgency in the region, etc. Cutting off the aid would presumably risk making the economy worse, since it's become dependent on the U.S. assistance and the elite is usually last to feel the effects of economic sanctions. US cutting off humanitarian aid to Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador The Trump administration’s recognition of President Hernández’s re-election, after a process marked by fraud, violence and irregularities adds political insult to economic injury.

 

United Fruit and the CIA murdered all their Fruit Picking labor leaders, because the poor locals wanted $1.27 per hour instead of the meager 38 cents.

 

Why not just go with aliens?, the little green men kind that is, only slightly more ridiculous than saying the CIA has been killing fruit pickers

 

When I was in Berlin an old German told me a "joke" or whatever you would like to call it. If there is one Nazi at a table and 10 people are sitting with him you have 11 Nazis

She openly supports Trump which makes her part of the problem. She is part of the Nazi/ white power movement since he is.

I guess I'm just shocked on a certain level considering what I saw of WW2 in Germany and how she chooses to approach it. FOR SURE not how most will handle it but that's how a democracy works and Germany is a democracy.

 

Easy answer

Some sort of true path to citazinship and we mean it. For example we can say if you are illegal yet have a home here come forward we will give you a social security card and you will also be entitled to better pay. This means you pay tax which cons seem to focus on. They somehow get "free" stuff. With my plan address the illegal issue and don't need camps. We do not need to punish people who work hard and their only crime working illegally. An American hired them. If you don't like this then you do want punishment. Trump voters are clear on this. It's not enough to send them away we must punish so others are afraid to try.

If you as an American are concerned someone like this can take your job it is you have failed and you blame others. You must truly have no education or job skills (not even trade school or trucking) this is why someone who does not speak English can take your job. You must have to work really long hours at jobs that don't need any skill but the physical strength to go for 13 hours. I have never had to deal with this since I went to college. But the same people who hate Mexicans also hate education and they think a 13 hour day is how real men earn a paycheck.

The gangs get their drugs here without walking. FACT
So there is no increase in crime if immigrants come.

The most common illegal immigrant is an English speaking Canadian. FACT

So there is really no reason for what goes on now but a combination of racism and people who blame others for their own life. Is that not very un-American? Take care of yourself and don't be mad when the free market passes you over. No one owes you a job since you are a white and born in Texas and they feel different.

 

So, when you were in Berlin a make believe German woman told you a Nazi joke, and said she was a Trump supporter?

Thus all Trump supporters are part of the "Nazi/white power" movement

???

 

He was pretty real. I don't know I had not taken any LSD or anything. He was involved in the the memorial system they have there I think.

Yes, all Trump voters are part of this ideal for society. They endorse the goal and welcome those who find the number 88 important into their ranks. yet they also claim it's democrats who are racist. They don't consider why modern racists like them.

Complicity is as bad as the dead.

 

If you cant remember if it was a he or a she, yeah, id say it was the LSD

 

I don't think I said it was a women did I? You are reaching.