2020 Election

Whose to say they won’t take that $1000 per month and spend it on gambling, drugs, and prostitutes?

Yes, it would stifle someone’s inclination toward personal growth. Why would an individual fight and strive for survival and personal betterment if they’re gonna get subsidized for existing?

Regarding automation, society will just adapt to the changes and transitions. It always has, and it always will. Did you shed any tears for the business owners and employees when Blockbuster videos was phased out by video streaming? Did anyone fret for the travel agents who’s jobs became nullified by the internet and travel websites? I personally know a former travel agent who lost his job from the new ways of the internet He became a successful realitor.

 

Whose to say they would? You? Why?
Why do you think an individual would fight for personal betterment only when confronted with the possibility of homelessness or starvation? Why do you think making it easier to better oneself would suddenly make everyone lose ambition? I find that a rather silly, not to mention cynical, outlook.

I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of automation. It ain't gonna be like Blockbuster

 

if they DO want to spend it on drugs and whatever, they can anyway.
hopefully the society that we would build where this kind of thing was normal would mean fewer people wanted to obliterate their minds due to working in stressful meaningless jobs. but for the people who want to "waste" their lives.. that's fine. people should do what makes them happy.
i don't think they'd be enough of a problem not to tolerate.

 

and specifically, this kind of thing should only cover the basics of living.
i think most people would choose to work as well in order to pay for all the things we want but don't need.

 

You'd be surprised how many people take comfort in a life of sub-mediocrity.
And I find it a rather cynical outlook to believe that without government force, nobody will contribute to the assistance and betterment of the poor and destitute.

Without automation, we'd still have legal slavery. A combine harvester can do the work of 20+ field-working slaves in a day, for example.

Why?

Isn't the whole point of UBI to believe that everyone is going to use that money to invest in the betterment and survival of themselves? The reason why a lot of people are poor and continue to be poor for several years is because they have bad spending habits, addictions, and they just suck with finances. So why waste other people's money by spending it on self-destructive habits?

 

Exactly (in reference to drift's post)


Not to mention, UBI has been tried a few times in various communities over the last few decades and there's not any evidence that everyone just became lazy gambling drug addicts

 

the point is to make society functional and pleasant to live in for most of us.
we need to not care about our concept of "fair" and just tolerate and take care of the dysfunctional people, while also creating a world that doesn't exacerbate the problems (such as how right now addictions are wonderful for gambling companies, drug companies, etc)

 

The only way I'd compromise on a UBI idea would be to invest the funds into work training programs. Rather than a blanket subsidy for everyone. But Yang would rather bribe you with other people's money than agree to something like that.

 

Okay.
How is this relevant to our discussion

 

I mean, I'd like to ban 90% of advertising. Possibly all advertising. Definitely all advertising that is for a product that isn't necessary.
Some people have extremely poor impulse control. The current world takes advantage of that. This is going off the off-topic though.

 

All it requires is money, because the democrats collaborated with republicans to rig the entire electoral system every way imaginable. Academics have even remarked that the US has turned gerrymandering into an exact science. The democrats require commercial advertising and marketing people, not politicians. They comprehend Neo Nazis, how to advertise to idiots who think they know what they're doing, when the consistently demand everyone lie to them.

 

Because you seem to be complaining about automation being horrible without seeing it's benefits.

 

i thought she was saying it was a good thing

 

But that's the thing
It doesnt have to be horrible.
Distributing the profits of automation in a way that benefits all of society and frees people to pursue their own passions would be a great pinnacle of human achievement, I think.

 

even if their passion is sitting in a room on drugs and xbox.
i really don't see why we have the right to say that isn't the best life that person could live.

 

Again, why should we as a society be paying vast sums of money to fund someone's drug and Xbox habits?

 

Because it isnt that important in the grand scheme of things, because the number of addicts are minuscule compared to the number of people who want to be productive members of society and because there are better ways to address addiction that to just refuse to consider a program where a lot of evidence exists that it would have a positive impact on society, just because some people might use the money from a UBI for drugs

 

pretty much the same post as before, which you didn't respond to.

it won't be vast sums of money. it's the basic amount they can live on. if they want to eat poorly to take drugs instead, let them.
at least we look after these people. like when you have a family member who is a loser, but you obviously care for them because they're family.
we look after these people, and they remain part of society, and we make other changes to society to discourage these types of people coming into existence.
we create a world which encourages better minds than that.
if the world we've built wasn't so soul-crushing in many ways, we wouldn't have people even needing to drink like they do.

it doesn't effect the rest of us. we don't need to care what they are doing, so long as it isn't damaging society for the rest of us.

 

.

 

Yes it does affect the rest of us. You're taking food off of a working man's plate to give it to someone else who isn't carrying his own weight, or providing any societal benefits.

If you and Melania want to give your own money to someone who isn't gonna take the time to improve their quality of life, and use their skills to benefit the community, that's fine. But you might as well dump it all down a bottomless pit.

It's wrong to reward bad behavior through government force.