Trump Acquittal Thoughts?

Ain't got no time for that every fucking day. It all depends how one does it. Timing is important. He knows no timing. And I don't know when he really means something or not. So at some point his opposite game gets annoying and tedious.

 

Precisely.

And what is your point this time, to try and take attention away from Trumps tax cuts, which is what started this little side topic

 

Again, precisely. Well done hitting the nail on the head twice in a row.

And why is he going to win in November? Because when everywhere else in the world has shitty growth, cutting taxes, increasing government spending to stimulate growth is exactly the right thing to do


Hip forums isnt reflective of reality, in the political threads youve just amassed a half dozen folks that seeth at anyone wealthy than them.

 

Cutting taxes and increasing government spending is not exactly the right thing to do at a time of when the economy is at near full employment, especially when it's done by adding majorly to the debt .Is now really the time for massive tax cuts? I think it's reasonable to expect another recession, and the tax cuts will reduce our options for coping with it. Also, if you've noticed Trump's budget, there are massive cuts for Social Security and other entitlements--sure to hit those middle and lower income groups we've been talking about. Of course, goosing the economy can be politically beneficial for somebody who wants to be re-elected at all costs.

 

My point was to reply to SrGrene who challenged the claim that the rich got a disproportionate benefit from the tax cuts.

 

Whatever are you talking about?

1280 / 11034 = 0.1160

54316 / 169633 = 0.3202

315300 / 1000000 = 0.3153

Even given the numbers you present at face value (a dubious proposition), I'd say the least little bit of number crunching shows your claim to be bogus. And you manage to get people here who "like" your comment. Scary. As Albert Einstein reportedly said (but probably didn't), "The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.” Nonetheless, government of the people, for the people, and by the people can only tolerate so much of the former.

Am I missing something, or do you simply not have a clue what you are talking about?

 

Numbers without context and catty digs: The Forum.

 

You need to do more than call names and present dismissive generalities. Whatever are you talking about? Did you simply divide the the" federal taxes spent" by the "pre-tax household income"? Why would you do that? The idea is to calculate a percentage--the tax rate as a percentage of real disposable income--i.e. ,what's left over after subtracting the $2,000/mo. everybody needs just to get by. Reading the link I gave you might help. But the bottom line is obvious, and should not require extensive calculation to grasp. If a person earning $1 million pays one-third of his income in taxes per year, (s)he still has $500,000 left over. If (s)he needs $24000 for basic expenses, (s)he still has $476,000 left--which is multiples more than my net worth. The poor slobs in the lowest income groups who have enough income to pay income tax pay numerically a much smaller amount in taxes, but it amounts to a much larger percentage of their income. After taxes and basic expenses, they have little or nothing left. But the reality is even worse, since, as Warren Buffet told us, he's paying a 16.5% tax rate on his billions while middle class people working for him are paying 25%.

 

That said, the next question to consider is: is there anything wrong with that picture? Shouldn't Warren Buffet be getting a lot more than the middle class people working for him, cuz he's a genius when it comes to investing? Far be it from me to suggest that a ditch digger with a high school education should be paid anything close to what we pay an engineer or a physician or a computer programmer. Basically, I prefer capitalism to communism, and even the commies paid the "toiling intelligentsia" a lot more than the proletarians in the fields and factories.

However, from a political standpoint, it's important to recognize what's going on in our society. As I've said, income inequality in the U.S. today is the greatest it's been since 1928, & we all know what happened next. I remember my history teacher telling me that the main reason Communism never made headway during the Great Depression was that FDR was able to head it off with the New Deal. There were lots of Republicans at the time who decried what he was doing, but he may have saved their bacon.

I think the increasing political polarization in this country is a reflection of a similar trend. The stage is set for demagogues like Trump and others I could name to convince working class people that they have a solution to their plight. I have real concern about the way Republicans have hacked away at the safety net, and continue to use things like the tax cuts and proposed cutbacks in Social Security to favor the well-to-do at the expense of the lower echelons of society. Establishment Democrats who bought into neo-liberalism are also responsible. In the long run, it can't continue without serious political repercussions threatening to our democracy.

 

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I'm wondering at what point do the people of America revolt? At what point does voting become useless - or is it already?

Large media outlets will continue to sensationalize their opponent's shortcomings; I get that. It's how they monetize. But what will it take for Americans to band together, toss aside parties and work toward a common goal?

 

If the system is not really working for the majority of the citizens their vote surely matters less than it should. This seems to be the case.

See the other side as fellow individuals who simply differ in opinion on certain important matters, instead of stigmatising them as a malicious bunch of idiots. Ignore the nonsensical extreme sounding people in debate instead of letting them ruin it.

 

Okiefreak, post #610 -

Income inequality IS the greatest since the Great Depression days. And now even some CEO's are recognizing that fact and have met to discuss how to rectify the problem. ( As reported on several TV outlets.) Some even suggested a national "allowance" for all Americans!! The point is - they recognize that many, many Americans can't make ends meet and save for their futures even while working at a job - and many even work at 2 jobs - with meager pay and few or no benefits. It's affecting how many products or services they're selling to the public. How many people can afford $30,000 to $50,000 for new vehicles these days? Plus pay a mortgage, all the insurances we need to have, more and more out-of-pocket medical expenses and ever higher deductibles, food, clothing, school supplies (which used to be covered by our local school taxes), and then …………. have any money left to save for retirement and college for our kids??? !!! ( It's very sad, but in many parts of the U.S. $15/hr. is still considered "a pretty good wage" !!!! ) Just try raising a family on $15/hr. and see how far you get.

Trump and others who "say" they have simple, easy answers to very complicated problems are following in some very famous footsteps - Hitler, and Mussolini, to name just 2. Those tyrant dictators sold their people on simple solutions to very complex problems too - which they could NOT deliver on because some issues are just NOT easily solved. Republicans here always talk cutting taxes - but who got the biggest tax breaks?? Once again - the wealthiest. Even Warren Buffet decried Trump's tax plan as backwards. He said publicly, "People like me do NOT need a tax break! Get the tax breaks to the people who need it most and will spend it in the economy." Buffet further stated, "I'm not going to change my buying habits to make up for what others can't afford." It's basic math - if the majority of the public is struggling financially, and can't afford even some necessities, the whole economy will falter. Forget disposable income - for many folks - there ISN'T ANY ANYMORE.

Here's a silly question: How can the Republicans author huge tax cuts and then complain about the deficit?? Do you turn off your facet and complain you have no water?? Where do they think the money comes from to keep the country up & running? You can't keep safe roads, safe bridges, a strong military, necessary Federal agencies for environmental safety, food safety, air & water quality, etc. without tax funds. The Republicans' solution - cut Social Security benefits, Medicare & Medicaid ( you know, because people are paid enough to pay for all their retirement & medical needs on their own these days!! ), slash the budgets of OSHA, the USDA and all the food safety agencies, so more of those folks lose their jobs, and the EPA budget so there are less & less people watching over our air & water quality. More jobs lost. Give the REALLY BIG TAX BREAKS to the wealthiest 1% and then pass off the expenses of paying for the nation's necessities onto the middle class in sneaky, slimy, under-handed ways. "The states have to do their share!" they say. So our state and local taxes go up to make up the difference as they pat themselves on the back (Federally speaking) for being "tax-cutters." It's just a tax-shift onto the states. Ever wonder why so many states are having budget troubles these days?? Because the Feds turned off the financial faucet. So now - each state is forced to come up with more money as more and more businesses have moved offshore, eliminating paying - and tax-paying - jobs here.

Slash budgets & eliminate jobs. Slash budgets & eliminate jobs. Slash budgets & eliminate jobs. And where is the promised "rebuilding of American Manufacturing" ?? Where are all the new factories?? Some of the ones Trump has claimed he "opened" were - IN FACT - opened when Obama was President. More lies. The highly publicized "saving" of the manufacturing jobs at the Carrier plant in Indiana have moved to Mexico. OOPS. How many young people in the U.S. with college degrees can't find a job in their field of expertise?? Those former U.S. jobs are now offshore for $2/hr. poverty pay - and what does that do to our economy here??

I watched the news conference live when then-President Reagan - a Republican - said this. "We're going to change our economy from a manufacturing-based economy to a service-based economy." It all started then. The flood of "American" companies heading offshore to mainly Asian slave labor. And guess who was at the forefront of the race?? NIKE. That's right, the "just do it" folks whose products many millions of Americans wear everyday. Every time we buy a NIKE product, we celebrate and approve of NIKE'S leadership of eliminating Americans' jobs. (I own NO Nike products. NONE.)

I agree with you Okiefreak, that we're in a very dangerous time right now. Political division is at a dangerous high point and real hatred is rampant across the country. It sets the stage for desperate people to grasp at straws for quick answers to many complex problems - fertile ground for demagogues and scare tactics.

A quote from the Bible: "A kingdom divided against itself cannot stand." The quote is taken from ………………. Jesus Himself.

Maybe we ought to re-think what we're doing to ourselves.

 

Walkoflife, post #612 -
Great question. If we ALL banded together and eliminated the people who make their money from division - we'd be on the path to winning a good future. Loud mouths on "talking heads" on TV and radio stir the political pot for their own gain. And we end up hating each other …………… to what end???

 

To the end that a mentally ill fool like trump gets elected and 60 million people love it.

 

Trump has demonstrated that he's not changing his behavior after being impeached, using his presidential pardon powers to forgive the crimes of several people including convicted junk bond king Michael Milken (insider trading and securities violations) and former New York police commissioner Bernard Kerik (tax fraud and lying to White House officials) and commuted the sentence of former Illinois governor Rod Blagojevich (tried to sell or trade to the highest bidder the Senate seat that Barack Obama was vacating to become the president). Now we're waiting to see if he'll pardon Roger Stone (witness tampering and lying to investigators) who just got sentenced to 40 months.

It's a good time to be a white collar criminal in America folks!

 

From the numbers you supplied, I took what I understood to be the taxes they paid and divided it by the income for the group in question. THAT'S HOW YOU DETERMINE PERCENTAGE. IS THAT TOO COMPLICATED FOR YOU??

If your goal is to determine what percentage of income various groups pay in taxes, there is no rationale for subtracting $2000 per month. Moreover, that seems to be a consideration you just decided to bring into this conversation when I challenged your arithmentic.

I'm not sure I believe your numbers anyway- the lowest quintile "gets back" more from government than they pay.

Your Buffet example is quite biased- just the way you like it, I'm sure. Just for starters, I will bet a handsome percentage of Buffets income is capital gains, which, for pretty compelling reasons, are taxed differently than income (at least when they are long term). Another confusing factor is Social Security is a nugatory part of Buffett's income- for most of the rest of us, it represents about a 15% tax on our compensation (shared with our employers, who pay off) You simply lack the sophistication to make a meaningful analysis of the complex issues you continually spout out about. Rather than take the time to understand an issue, you repeatedly, and mindlessly parrot some deceptive party line. For anyone interested in a reasonable discussion of Buffett's highly misleading claim about taxation, you could do worse than read the Forbes link below. It's bottom line, which stormy doesn't want you to know about is,

In truth, Buffett’s assertion is completely inaccurate and is based on a fundamentally flawed analysis of basic federal taxation principles. In reality, he pays a much higher relevant “federal tax rate” than any of his office workers.


Informed discussion is impossible with you. As I've indicated, I have sixth graders who can assemble relevant facts and present a better argument than you can, or at least do: I am beginning to suspect your intent is to deceive.

Warren Buffett's Actual Tax Rate Much Closer To 31%, While His Office Workers Pay 21%

 

Nowadays we do not have full deductability for State taxes against the Federal taxes. Deductions are capped at $10,000.
Democrats are promising to restore full deductability of State taxes.

 

Please check out these New Jersey mansions with big property taxes.

If you care about equality, please keep the SALT deduction in place.

The 25 homes with the highest property taxes in N.J., from least to most expensive

Federal tax rates become immaterial with this type of deduction.

 

Lolz, I look at your health insurance costs in the US and Im like jesus christ, they pay how much?


But then I see something like that, 4 acres in Princeton with what looks like a 20 bedroom mansion on it. Man that would be $20 million in Sydney

And the stamp duty would be 7% of 6.27 million, $430,000 instead of $160,000