hopefully i can get my point across ok. looking back to gradeschool i remember there being a kind of overarching idea taught to me that women were just as good as men and could do anything we could do, etc. And i took it straight to heart. i used to daydream about this perfect girl that i could do everything with and be complete equals with. so life went on, i had ahighschool sweetheart that i was in love with (who was quite girly) and we dated for 3yrs, but i fell out of love with her and broke it off. from there things went downhill for me pretty much. circumstance and location and (lack of balls) all played their part in keeping me basically single for the last 6 yrs or so. but i kicked all the depressing shit out of my life just recently (say 6 months) and have been trying to meet women again. and here it is - i'm picking up a lot of chatter like "be a man" and "knows how to treat a woman" and all this stereotypical bs from the xx side of the fence. like females are reverting or something. perhaps people are starting to believe tv too much . Its like i didnt see the last few moves in the gender game, and now i dont know how to relate. anyway, what do you all see? where are guys going, and where are girls going? are we picking up each others worst traits? was the equality speech all a lie? should i just pretend all women are stupid (like i was once advised to do)? i know this is an inflammatory subject, but i'm kinda down right now, and felt like writing my thoughts.
Dude, what's happened is this. They thought they'd get something out of being more like men - like all that money, power and influence and control they think we all have. Then they find out having a job SUCKS, etc and decide they wanna be "kept" again but only if they want to.
yeah but thats a jaded opinion man. in my worse moments i think like that, but its more complex i think. i'm just mad because i spent all that time blasting the stereotypes out of my mind, and now i'm getting them kicked back in my face, and they're about ME. im not really a girly man either (altho i bet i'm sounding a little sensitive here).
i've had the same thoughts... like women abolished only SOME gender roles. not all of them.... like they're still the submissive or passive ones in the courtship game... That is agervating in a way... I see male/female being equal, but it's required of me to act a certain "part" in order to be taken "seriously"
Yeah, they abolished the stuff they didn't want, and insist on the stuff they do want. Wish we could do that, too. Oh, no - sorry sorry. Now watch me get jumped all over "I make more than my husband therefore you're wrong rant blah rant" but look at it this way - many women making fat ducats can't get a man, cause they're looking for men who make more money than them. Basically, the point is - if you're a girl, you can wear skirts or shorts, work or not work, parent or not parent, go into combat or not go into combat, get a free and freaky job (living off him) or a good corporate job (and get preferential hiring). If you're a guy you wear shorts or get beaten up, you'd better work or you'll stay single, you could parent but you're assumed to be too emotionally crippled to do so, you'll probably be drafted and shoved into combat without being asked what you want, and your job better be as good or better than the girl you intend on being with. Oh, and if she breaks your nose in an argument and the cops show up *bats eyelids* I'm just a girl, he hit me! If the car breaks down in the rain, it'll be your ass out on the highway in the driving rain changing the wheel. Feminism - what's yours is mine and what's mine is mine.
The mistake men have made is to buy into the feminist thing. I respect and appreciate women to the fullest, but I am man enough that I don't buy into the whole 'equals' thing in every way. The difference between the genders, on all levels, physically, emotionally, etc are there for a reason. To minimalize or worse yet, deny the importance of them is the mistake that has resulted in the confusion that most men are walking around with today. We're MEN dammit! And that's what a woman wants us to be, and that's the only time a woman feels comfortable being a real woman is in the presence of a male who exhibits masculine qualities. Until I learned the meaning of manhood, I never knew the place a woman should have in my life. I don't even consider women who don't know their proper role in a relationship viable prospects.
well I can only really talk about Britain but in my view the whole thing looks a mess. The "morality" used to be one good income per household and one "pin money" income. So that meant the guys with careers generally and the wives with the kids/part time/fitting round.Guys like a purpose( the "hunter") but women , Ive found prefer a "balance" ie work AND family. Nowadays its the middle class get proper jobs first ( thro their connected /well off families /private schooling/inheritance to set up a business /go into the family business etc)then the rest follow picking up whats left. So you have 2 good income earners in a mid middle class family and a working class /lower middle class male whos clever finds himself working in a call centre.Ofcourse thats hardly a man's job in the realistic sense of the word- so he marries ( or hopes to marry) a lot later than the 27 years avg of just 12 years ago. Even 35 year old guys are living with their parents because they feel "inadequate " re their income/status so they defer settling down. Women meanwhile are into all the career stuff and dont manage to find the men , who are themselves avoiding relationships while trying to get the house and nice car their fathers could get ( who didnt have the female career competitors). Add to this the fact that the male sperm count has dropped by 40 percent since the 1950s (pesticides , oestrogen in the water supply , E additives etc). Ask yourself why women are into kickboxing , weight training , getting shitfaced in pubs and fighting youve got to wonder where the whole things going. I see these American career women- deep voices , broadshoulders etc , apparently their clitorises enlarge due to the increased testosterone their environment has. ( see Hilary Clinton!: )then I see the amount of camp males around - who women say show "attractive understanding qualities". In England , farmed salmon are actually crossing gender -due to the poisons in our enviroment.Its a bit like a canary in a coal mine- an early warning system of pollution Maybe our offspring ( if we get to marry) will end up sterile and mixed type gender? Ok u might think that sounds crap , but there are scientists and "futurologists" very worried. Even insurance firms are talking about mass legal actions re impotence and hormone contamination.(Unilever foods are looking to take out massive cover like the ciggie companies did) Anyways , this is my view. Yes theres been a massive changeover in "gender values". Im all for having freedom for people to do stuff. BUT things just seem a mess for so many people. So many people seem confused. And I dont even think a lot of women seem happy with the situtation. To be honest while I might want to screw a fair number of British girls( I live in Britain) a lot of the time I just dont feel any "Synergy". They seem to want to behave like men.Loudness , aggressiveness , the girlish charm just seems missing.When I was travelling recently , the Slavic girls seemed just that ie "girls" . They were tough tough cookies leaving their homelands for the West. But it was like they knew what they wanted , what they were. They used words like "even tempered" ,"feminine" , "girlish" , "warm and caring". In Britain and the US the talk is of "modern21st century women" ,"assertive women" etc. InBritain girls will talk about a girl as "girlish" as if theres something unusual about her. What the hells that about? lol Talk about complimenting a lot of English girls on being "girlish" youd prob get a slap round the face and be accused of "sexism". In truth I dont fancy a lot of British girls as people , because theyre like men-even if theyre otherwise (physically ) attractive still Anyway , thats just my view. Queue the attacks from female council workers wearing dungarees. only joking , honest
Very intelligent observations, and I like the way you made mention of some of the ecological threats to males as well. It seems that the 'modern Western woman' has been sold a bill of goods (i.e. feminism) that has put them out of the market for those of us who value traditional gender roles. BTW, has anyone here heard of www.nomarriage.com ? It provides an interesting perspective on this issue. I am not saying I agree with everything there, but it's food for thought.
this here is your problem : none of us chicks want a man who isn't confident in himself, strong, and has balls as you so eloquently put it. Guys don't want a weak woman who constantly needs emotional support either. gender roles are confusing. Theyr'e different for every person. I still want a manly man, I don't want to be the pants in the relationship. I'd prefer that (if we ever got to the living-together point) he be the main bread earner, but that's just me. I'm weird like that.
Hmmm getting back to the original post , I think there has been a massive change BUT some things are still as before. It might sound jaded but its almost as if weve got the worst of all worlds nowadays. That nomarriage website was pretty sobering stuff.And I think it only looked at some of the problems. The problem looks real bad in America and Britain aint far behind. When you hear the lyrics to certain American songs like that "Scrubs" song and Beyonce talking about "The rocks Im rocking( diamond) I bought it" the average English guy just wants to say "shut the bleep up". I think the economic dynamic change between men and women has taken a turn for the worse.But the most worrying thing is that I actually doubt how much the sexes actually like each other now?How much is it they feel they have to marry so as not to stand out? ( My friend ( susccessful lawyer but unhappy in the few hours he spends at home)said to me "The only way I can see my wife getting pregnant is if I have a wxxk in the bath" Hmmm who said romance was dead?lol I went round our local lake on the weekend.Id have thought itd be full of young couples there.Nope mainly older people and people with kids. What happened to the "walks in the park , hand in hand"?Maybe the young couples just dont like each others company that much?Maybe the girls were off kickboxing and getting shitfaced in the pub , while the guys were home with Mother or doing a Sunday shift at the call centre?: )lol I dont know. One things true , there does seem to be a lot of "pick and choose" with "gender roles". Its a strange world...
you dont follow or believe tv?? Shame on you, thats where I get all my knowledge from.... im kidding obviously.. You shouldnt go this much into just finding someone you enjoy and being with them.. People make dating and relationships into like this big confusing gameshow almost.. and sometimes people focus on gender roles which this whole gender role is pretty stupid in my opinion.. You should worry yourself with all this gender nonsense cause it will drive you mad and its a waste of time.. Dont worry about all that bullshit.. just go out and enjoy people and if you enjoy their company and want a relationship, then be with them and dont worry about all that stuff cause I find that only makes for problems.. this probably made nosense so yeah...
RE: women kickboxing etc. Don't forget men waxing their eyebrows, using "product" in their hair, obsessing over finding the perfect (light) loafers, etc. eating Brie and drinking wine spritzers...
well, men used to be the ones wearing high heels. i think gender roles are pretty fluid in the minutiae.
lol. but it is an example. the little shit doesn't matter. i guess what we consider to be little shit does change, though. used to be that women wearing pants was a HUGE deal.
Its whatever you decide and what you decide you want to deal with. I've wanted alot of things but I've had all the responsiblity instead (The father of my children owes me $74,000.00 in back child support. He has paid about 5,000.00 in 16yrs. The support pmts were based on the 100/wk I paid for daycare) So I have alwys been the sole beast of burden. The more things change, the more they stay the same....I've noticed the same kinda trends, lets find someone to support me or at least take the responsibilty from me. If you want an independant, free thinking person, then find one, they are out there. But as long as men are foolish enough to fall all over themselves for a nice ass and a pair of tits, there will be some out there that will exploit it. How mush attention do the women that don't flaunt themselves get? Does anyone take the time to seek them out and get to know them? A great many women as well as men go unnoticed. As far as actual changes, there has been some but in many ways not really all that much in many respects, unfortunately, as long as people are judged by what they are and not on an individual basis, as long as we help perpetuate steroetypes, either by our actions or views, nothing will ever really change.
RE: Its whatever you decide and what you decide you want to deal with. I've wanted alot of things but I've had all the responsiblity instead (The father of my children owes me $74,000.00 in back child support. He has paid about 5,000.00 in 16yrs. The support pmts were based on the 100/wk I paid for daycare) So I have alwys been the sole beast of burden Er, you need to talk to a lawyer. They can take everything he owns, toss him in jail and give everything to you.
DCSE is a joke. They put a lein on his parents home after thay passed away, he sold it out from under the lein. I reported it and they said there wasn't anything they could do w/o that atty's name. Well, I told them it had to be in public records they could easily access since it was property that changed hands but they wouldn't persue it. I tried to have them send it back thru court to up the back payments of 20.00 towards the arrearage and that was in January when I almost lost my home and was unemployed for 6 months. I got a letter last week that they will hear my case in court soon... He has no assets and what he DID have, he hid. Hell, they didn't do shit for years till I tried to take it to court myself with a visitation case I was putting in. He always has had visitation but when he started dropping the kids off drunk, I fixed that legally. (I also literally kicked his ass down off my porch for it too. Planted a foot in his chest and launched his sorry ass down the steps) LOL! my whole point is tho, there are strong, independant women out there...just hang in, don't overlook some. Scratch the surface, there may be more to em than yah think! I've been called hard for having these qualities.Can't help it if I'm smart enough to also form my own opinions too, hehe
