Prayer

i'm interested in how you pray;

do you just silently chat to god, 'hey god it's kevin... thanks for, may i please have, etc' ?
do you recite a usual prayer, 'our father, who art in heaven...' ?
do you not speak at all but sit in quiet mindfulness, contemplation of god?

i've been practicing meditation for the last couple of months; have studied it and read about its forms for a long time but only begun putting knowledge to practical use. i find it very interesting how closely related meditation is to prayer. there is a christian man who attends classes with me and spends the time meditating on god, which he considers prayer.
the only difference between him and i is that he considers 'god' to be a distinct, describable being external from himself, and i consider 'god' to be synonymous with the state of ideal oneness, nirvana, samsara, et cetera. something that is not external or internal, having no place and no description.
to him, 'god is...', 'god said...', 'god did...', 'god wants...'
to me, 'what am i?'


love,

 

so when you pray, you sit cross legged with candle and incence, as meditation?

do you speak to god, or try to still your thoughts and maintain silence?

i must be really sheltered in some aspects because i've never before considered christian prayer to possibly be so similar to meditation. when i used to pray as a christian i never practiced stillness and silence, but actively spoke out and thought about god, like i was speaking to a parent. meditation strikes me as much more self - ish, subjective, if that makes sense, but i am seeing that it can also be objective. switching your focus from self to god.


love,

 

Its completely up to you how you pray. Praying is making a personal connection to god, therefore the only way to gain that connection is through your mind and your ideas.

 

Hey there, lady... Those are good questions. I think they all have their purposes... Different methods for different situations.

The first type can be used to express gratitude, but more often, I think Christians use it as more of a "therapy" session, if that makes any sense. I hate to admit that, but it seems we're always asking more than we're giving thanks.

The second I only use when I can't think of what to say, and I'm too frazzled to still my mind. It's not one of my personal favorites, 'cause it seems less edifying to me.

The third is my favorite! I tend to be more of a Quaker, and that's how they worship, mostly. Silent reflection and meditation. If someone feels moved to speak because of the revelations of their meditation, they do so, but otherwise, Quakers respect that each individual may be there to hear their own message. They're not so self-important that they'd impose on their neighbor's personal time with G-d with their own thoughts and ramblings.

 

i will recite a simple praise to God, ask for his will to be done, then as for forgiveness...
if im going through somethign that has just got me worried or worked up, i wil pray for you know, strength, wisdom, but for God's will to be done
and i will also just be there, silent, kneeling on the ground...

in anyone session, i can do all 3, usually it starts with a short silent period, then i move into my regular thing, then if i am going to pray for specifics, id do it now...and while i am doing that, i may just stop talking, contemplate what i am saying, contemplate God, and Jesus...i may or may not add more on to the end after...then i wil probobly ask for God's love, and forgiveness by God's grace, and Amen.

 

thanks hippielngstckng .. i was just reading about quaker meditation actually, that's really interesting. also forms of gnosticism tend to place more emphasis on meditation to reach god.

thanks burbot, that seems a lot more like what i generally considered prayer to be. by meditation i mean, not just sitting quietly thinking about god, but complete focus and single pointedness of the mind so that eventually stray thoughts cease to arise and you experience (god).

if it's not being way too personal, have any of you had any... revelatory experiences with your form of prayer?


love,

 

well i can't say that when i just go silent my thoughts cease, in fact, that is probobly when i do most of my thinking, but it isnt simple like "hmm...hi God" thouhgts, i cant really explain it...ive just done it

but no, i don't think i have had any revelatory experiences, at least none i can pin down

 

I would say sincerity is the most important thing, and knowing what to be sincere about is a close second, if a prayer is meaningful and helpful. Asking for wisdom will get you farther than asking for selfish things. You will find your purpose in life when you realize that the world is made up others much like yourself, who are also in need of a sense of purpose. Living life in a manner that will ensure the next generation and generations will keep carrying on in peace.

 

This is IMHO the most significant and far-reaching issue yet raised in my short time hereabouts.
Traditionally in the christian sense, prayer has become a form of beseeching, begging, wailing, pleading, confessing etc etc, but I don't believe that was it's original intention. I believe the intention of prayer is the same as that of meditation ~ to connect one to the highest creative potential, and that creative potential exists withing ourselves. Substantiation of this can be easily found in the NT bible for "those with eyes to see, those with ears to hear." Call it "god" if you must or will, or call it "self" as I do, it makes no matter. What does matter is that it is connected with, because it is an omipotent creative force that brings into being aspects of reality that await your command and otherwise would remain dormant.
It is my ardent belief that our destiny in life is to discover this attribute of "self" so as to transcend attachment to material life. By connecting with "it" one is freed from dependance upon fate, chance, and suchlike, and becomes master and creator of personal destiny. Those who choose not to are forced to search for "it" by the repetition of negative experiences generated by the absence of the creative input. However even negative thought patterns are creatively potent, so the pain or pleasure of experience becomes the guideline by which one makes necessary adjustments to the interactive creative process (prayer/meditation).
Prayer and meditation are but methods of training the mind to remain in contact with the creative component of "self"and may (and more often do) take many years of dedicated practice. As a hypnotherapist, I recognized that such a process can be dramatically accelerated, and went on to create my subliminal CD business, which is itself the result of the creative process of mind.
Consider the biblical saying "I am that I am". It has real meaning when the mind is opened to it's full meaning. It is something one should meditate/pray or open one's mind to the true meaning of. It says "I am, that I am" in a way that suggests three things ~
1] That the creative force/principle (god if you will) is stating the fact that it comes into being so as to experience itself
2] That "I" (my "self" individually ~ you, me everyone) am that same thing
3] That what one consistently focusses one's mind upon becomes into being (manifests) through such focus (prayer/meditation/thought/imaginiation)
That's why the Christ principle says "I tell ye, ye are all Gods" amongst other things that substantiate my beliefs and that christianity dumbs out on.
So meditation/prayer IMHO is a way of attaining that which one desires, and is done in such a way that allows the mind freedom to open to that which is well above and beyond it. To do this one must trust in one's "self", let go, and let..............
Hope this helps you find that which you seek Sophia
Blessings

 

I look to myself and others instead of some invisible Sky Daddy or some force that I think connects everything.

I don't worry about what I can control, because I can control it.
I don't worry about what I can't control, because I can't control it.

However, I do concern myself with freedom, happiness and the welfare of myself and others and will do everything in my reasonable power to achieve these things.

Human willpower, Compassion and Reason are my "bible".
I am my own "god".

 

*nods* I was studying gnosticism for a while, too. I liked a lot of what I found... It helped contribute to my interest in Liberal Quakerism.
Good luck, and enjoy your studies...!

I dunno. I found little things that meant a lot to me while practicing meditative prayer. Like the breath or spirit G-d imparted to each and every one of us is all from the same source. So, all of us, no matter what faith we ascribe to, are but a fraction of this one source, and because our individual consciousness is conceived by that source, we all have access to it. This also means that since we are all but a fraction from the one source, we are connected to one another in ways I've not fully come to understand yet. More meditation is necessary. This might be second nature to some... It was a new thought to me, though.

So, in light of that, I don't necessarily feel that Christianity is wrong or incorrect. By saying that "we all have access," I'm denying the old Christian argument of predestination... No one is made for the specific purpose of going to hell. We're all just brothers and sisters travelling through life, trying to make it to the one destination where we can shed off this old "Ball and Chain" (the body) and come together as a whole again. If we disrespect one another, we disrespect ourselves as well as the source.

I wouldn't yell at someone because they don't think my "directions" to get to the "destination" are right, nor would I impose my "directions" on someone who says they know where they're going. If I ask somebody, "Are you lost?" and they say no, it's fruitless to argue with them, even if they are standing there in a ditch scratching their head.

Though I must admit, I can't even count how many Christians I've found in that ditch, looking at their "roadmap" upside down.

 

thank you barry! yes, it just sort of struck me that day how universal meditation and the desire for self transcendence is - and christian meditation as prayer is something i'd never before considered, made me think of christianity in a bit of a new light. rather than my subjective focus (self as all), it is possible to have an objective focus (self as a part of God)....if that makes sense. it probably doesn't, i'm still musing over things.
i will contemplate the phrase you gave, thank you......

& libertine, you say you look to yourself for control, not to some force that connects everyone. maybe not some dodgy talk like zeno's 'world soul' but what of simple life itself? i imagine life as a pulsing self-conscious mass, spread out here on earth or the universe and feel compassion and wonder for us. anyway, i think that we have similar, reasonable views even though i am currently experimenting with placing the word 'God' into different places. haha

hippielngstckng, i like your philosophy and compassion for brothers & sisters. and if you come from god, then you are made of god, even if only made of a small part of him. justin wrote that every philosophy, even pagan philosophy, is worthwhile because every human being has the seed of god's Logos, so essentially, like you said, everyone has access to god, and it is possible for a person to follow christ even if they've never heard the message, because they come from god. i hope that makes sense.
thanks for your responses,

love,

 

prayer is simple, i just tell god to do something and he does it

 

wow, so who is really god then, you or him?

 

as importantly.................just who does whose bidding?

 

prayer only works if you love god... it doesn't work if you don't love god

 

i jsut talk to god!
sometimes in silence sometimes outloud!
i dont think it really matters how we pray but i tihn that some people mistake prayer for a shopping list

 

Amen, girl. And if we love G-d, we'll love all of His Creation too. Even those we find to be pests...! After all, pearls are made by irritation...

*mushy, lovey, cavity-causing grin*

 

I just talk teh Him.

Alot of it's out loud though 'cuz I talk in tongues.

But I do 'meditate' on Him aswell, talking to Him because I'm to lazy to open my mouth. He knows my thoughts, so He knows what I'm thinking.

 

I've been around people doing that. It freaked me out. I don't go back there anymore.