I feel so cut off from the jump and flow of life. I am totally disconnected from almost every part of my life. I have never seen the plants or animals that produce my food (save for my little home garden); I don't usually even know what country they come from, let alone what specific farm or farmer produces them. I do not know where my water comes from, where it has been, or where it goes beyond a vague notion of a river around here that I may have driven over on the highway (where you see nothing but asphalt and rear bumpers). I don't know the people who made my tools, furniture, clothes, or electronics, I don't know the trees, plants, and mineral deposits where the materials came from. They show our leaders on the television, but I've never met them. I've never met any of the musicians or authors whose work I enjoy (except for the singer for the Verve Pipe ). I do not know where my urine or feces goes, or what is done with it. I've also never met any of the people who I've met online through these forums or elsewhere with whom I've had so many discussions. In short, I don't know the sources or makers of most of my food, water, entertainment, home and furnishings, clothes, or tools, and I don't know where all my garbage and waste goes. This seems to me to be a very unusual situation in which we find ourselves, though we've gotten used to it. For much of history (5,000 years) and all of prehistory (100,000+ years) people have seen their food alive before they harvested or killed it, they knew who made their tools and clothes (often they did it themselves), and they knew where their waste went (hole in the ground, or where ever they threw it down). They drank straight from the streams. Even when trade became common, most of one's goods and food were still locally obtained. You could walk down the street and talk to your blacksmith, your carpenter, and most people were farmers. But it's gotten so bad, that I can't even name the living things that have died so I could eat them and live (as I often do before I eat, as a thanksgiving). Food no longer even resembles it's origins. I have to look at the ingredients, and who knows where half those chemicals came from. In bread you have corn syrup, who would have figured it, corn there in my rye bread (which is mainly made with wheat!). There is just something about all of this that feels very... wrong to me. All the continuity is gone. Well, just some thoughts i've been having, wanted to get it off my chest. Your reactions are welcome of course
You're in good company along with the rest of us Bozos on this Bus. It's no coincidence that the one word most often used to describe the condition of Civilized Man is ALIENATION. How does one live a more authentic life, a life more alive to the spontaneity of the present moment? I wish I had the answer, because every step I take in that direction alienates me all the more from all those going in different directions. The Buddha guy said, take the Middle-Path; Neither submit nor resist. I got the no submission part down cold, but it's that no resistance part that always trips me up. I hope you fare better than I, or is it better than me?
Your in for the long haul bro, enjoy the ride, LOL. Once your eyes open, their open and your constantly gonna be looking at the many injustices of the world and just wondering why they have to be? Why can't we all live in harmony with each other, or simply do a better job? Why do millions, maybe even billions, yourself included, have to suffer so all these pricks can make a buck and spiritually devolve? Why can't we be satisfied with our progress and value the nature that sustains our life? Just do your part, to be aware where it counts. Evolve where it counts, teach where it counts. Listen to your heart and feel for God's will, when you do that, you can work for what he wants and though it may not be the change you see as necessary for the world, it is the change that IS most necessary. And you very may well find yourself in a position to make some change in this world that corrects(what you see right now as) important injustices and imbalances, many people do, and many people are. It's just a lot harder to tear through a wall with bare naked hands than to just accept it and give up and work around it. People do puncture the wall though, with precision and careful planning and intent, and a lot of WORK. There is a lot of work to do to get back to the garden where nature as well as man and his spirit thrive, and were very far off and it is not looking likely that we will even make it close. So I guess save your own soul while you have the opprotunity, and take a few others with you if you can. But even then, why does God need more souls? He's God, isnt that enough? To say this world is wrong and needs fixing is to claim the knowledge of right and wrong. It's often a ballbreaker to realize we DONT hold that knowledge, even though we may have spent our whole life thinking we have it all figured out, but have been totally wrong. Its then that were free to really maneuver in our consciousness and in this world. All reality is merely a perception. However, a lot of suffering is unecesary and unfortunate(on more levels than just starvation, war, rape, etc..,many levels) and there are things we can do to fix them, so it would only make sense to do what seems right. But its still good to remember, that were just doing what we THINK is right. And we could all definatley try to do it a little more and tap into our TRUE potential to love. It aint always a fun process, and the heart has to prepare for love which can be a painful emotion in this world, but its the process to true liberation I think. If we all took absolute responsibility for ourselves, just ourselves, our individual impacts on this earth..on each other, and just did our part, the world would be a LOT percievably better. I guess that sounds cliche, but its true....
Wow. Listen: it's progress to see that you can actually name this dilemma and put words to it. Many people can't even go that far, or are completely ignorant of this fact of alienation.
MN (Majjima Nikkaya) 63 Cula-Malunkyovada Sutta ... "It's just as if a man were wounded with an arrow thickly smeared with poison. His friends & companions, kinsmen & relatives would provide him with a surgeon, and the man would say, 'I won't have this arrow removed until I know whether the man who wounded me was a noble warrior, a priest, a merchant, or a worker.' He would say, 'I won't have this arrow removed until I know the given name & clan name of the man who wounded me... until I know whether he was tall, medium, or short... until I know whether he was dark, ruddy-brown, or golden-colored... until I know his home village, town, or city... until I know whether the bow with which I was wounded was a long bow or a crossbow... until I know whether the bowstring with which I was wounded was fiber, bamboo threads, sinew, hemp, or bark... until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was wild or cultivated... until I know whether the feathers of the shaft with which I was wounded were those of a vulture, a stork, a hawk, a peacock, or another bird... until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was bound with the sinew of an ox, a water buffalo, a langur, or a monkey.' He would say, 'I won't have this arrow removed until I know whether the shaft with which I was wounded was that of a common arrow, a curved arrow, a barbed, a calf-toothed, or an oleander arrow.' The man would die and those things would still remain unknown to him. ... http://accesstoinsight.org/canon/sutta/majjhima/mn-063-tb0.html _______________________________________________ MN 131 Bhaddekaratta Sutta ... "And how, monks, does one chase after the past? One gets carried away with the delight of 'In the past I had such a form (body)'... 'In the past I had such a feeling'... 'In the past I had such a perception'... 'In the past I had such a thought-fabrication'... 'In the past I had such a consciousness.' This is called chasing after the past. "And how does one not chase after the past? One does not get carried away with the delight of 'In the past I had such a form (body)'... 'In the past I had such a feeling'... 'In the past I had such a perception'... 'In the past I had such a thought-fabrication'... 'In the past I had such a consciousness.' This is called not chasing after the past. "And how does one place expectations on the future? One gets carried away with the delight of 'In the future I might have such a form (body)'... 'In the future I might have such a feeling'... 'In the future I might have such a perception'... 'In the future I might have such a thought-fabrication'... 'In the future I might have such a consciousness.' This is called placing expectations on the future. "And how does one not place expectations on the future? One does not get carried away with the delight of 'In the future I might have such a form (body)'... 'In the future I might have such a feeling'... 'In the future I might have such a perception'... 'In the future I might have such a thought-fabrication'... 'In the future I might have such a consciousness.' This is called not placing expectations on the future. "And how is one taken in with regard to present qualities? There is the case where an uninstructed run-of-the-mill person who has not seen the noble ones, is not versed in the teachings of the noble ones, is not trained in the teachings of the noble ones, sees form as self, or self as possessing form, or form as in self, or self as in form. "He/she sees feeling as self, or self as possessing feeling, or feeling as in self, or self as in feeling. "He/she sees perception as self, or self as possessing perception, or perception as in self, or self as in perception. "He/she sees thought-fabrications as self, or self as possessing thought-fabrications, or thought-fabrications as in self, or self as in thought-fabrications. "He/she sees consciousness as self, or self as possessing consciousness, or consciousness as in self, or self as in consciousness. This is called being taken in with regard to present qualities. "And how is one not taken in with regard to present qualities? There is the case where a disciple of the noble ones who has seen the noble ones, is versed in the teachings of the noble ones, is well-trained in the teachings of the noble ones, does not see form as self, or self as possessing form, or form as in self, or self as in form. "He/she does not see feeling as self, or self as possessing feeling, or feeling as in self, or self as in feeling. "He/she does not see perception as self, or self as possessing perception, or perception as in self, or self as in perception. "He/she does not see thought-fabrications as self, or self as possessing thought-fabrications, or thought-fabrications as in self, or self as in thought-fabrications. "He/she does not see consciousness as self, or self as possessing consciousness, or consciousness as in self, or self as in consciousness. This is called not being taken in with regard to present qualities. ... http://accesstoinsight.org/canon/sutta/majjhima/mn-131-tb0.html
Darrel, so all this is stupid to be worrying about? I see your point and don't really disagree. But you know, there are ways of life conducive to happiness and peace, and ways of life that are NOT conducive to happiness and peace. I am convinced our modern way is one of the latter. Think about it; being so cut off from all the things I listed is a great way of shedding responsibility. "I didn't poison that stream, the waste treatment plant did. I didn't tear the mountain down, the mining company did. I didn't clearcut that forest for wood and farmland, the loggers and farmers did. I didn't start that war, those politicians did." But of course it all comes back full circle and we feel the horrid effects (environmental, political, and social). Yes, in the end it comes down to personal responsibility. And I'd really love to walk away from the system, live simply. But what about everyone else? As a social species, we act socially as well as personally. We're all connected (however severely we may feel cut off). Shit, I don't even know where I'm going with this right now. Maybe I'll come back and edit this when I figure it out.
thats why i want to take up hunting, whatever i kill on my own, ill eat . I dont like to eat things such as loaf bread from markets either because its all mass produced in some distant industrial bakery somewhere. Each loaf should be baked with love. Its not that way when you buy the smooshy perfectly shaped bread from stores.
Trippin, you should watch the movie Crash. In the beginning of the movie, there is a car accident, and Don Cheetal (sp?) says something like: "You know, we're all rushing around this society. I think sometimes we crash into each other just so we can touch each other." And it's a great movie.
Colours, that's right man, my mom's, or my grandpa's, breads are SO much better than market bought ones. I think, honestly, that the care and love that goes into making it has a tangible effect. I'm not much of a meat eater, but I do like having my own garden. The occasional fish or other wild meat would be good though And yeah, Molly, I saw that movie, it was pretty good.
of course,as the novelty complexity machine that is humanity gaines in its novelty momentum,it becomes more and more what it wasnt,more detailed,more highly saturated with a wider variety of rarer and stranger elements,this is the technological revolution,we are headed towards becoming the freak aliens of movies,complete alienation from primordial,primitive states but dont worry,as seen with most systems,they are created,grow,peak,begin to lose energy input,begin to dwindle,slowly peter out and are destroyed. everything is cyclic,large scale,small scale,really small scale,and really fucking big scale round and round ya go unless life is the ultimate system the universe was "looking" for... fuck..it makes me sad to think i will never know the future destination of humanity does it continue its quest forward?find an infinite energy source and in effect achieve an immortal system? or is it reduced to ashes?
If we continue on this current line of progress, with an infinite energy source found, life will no longer be worth living, because we'd have destroyed or despoiled everything good in getting there.
most people live life without any real appreciation. rich people because they're blind,and poor people because they have nothing but pain. worth will never be more important than life system's main objective,Survival! humanity's heart is infinitely insecure,no emotion generates a greater reaction than fear. humanity will desire knowledge,power and control to the ends of the universe because it will always need more,and more,and more,in order to feel security through domination. we have intelligence because it gave us the upper hand in survival of the fittest,not because it has the added quality of being able to appreciate this world
appreciation is seperate from searching for appreciation just like someone who still seeks and acts is not truly satisfied the law of satisfaction states that once you are there,you want NO MORE if you seek beauty you are not satisfied with the beauty you are experiencing at that moment,thusly lacking appreciation most people are seekers,most people dont appreciate very much humanity is about improvement,getting more,life is about this living is about greed,greed is the opposite of appreciation another breath,another bite,another fuck
