I just don't understand... why does anyone care? I look at my 'self' and... well, I guess I think real awareness of oneself and the nature of of how oneself works should naturally cancel out natural or social 'truths', even the will to live. It hasn't done that for me completely. But I have sometimes felt myself slipping closer. I'm now on antidepressants actually which is pretty much directly related to that, I think. My psychologists don't really understand what I mean though. Well, when I was first put in the psych ward they actually had group sessions kind of like AA I guess where part of the recovery is to accept that God is going to do what's best for me. Thats the best they have for me? I haven't believed in god for years.. so obviously that wasn't helpful. call me closeminded if you want, but faith has just never been enough for me. I certainly can't believe in any of the western religions. And eastern spirituality like buddhism can have some metaphorical meaning and wisdom but i cant believe in literal 'spirits' or reincarnation or karma. And there are countless other attempts to guess why the world is how it is. Everything I look at it seems i see right through it. In the end, I think being aware that in the end death is inevitable, and nothing truly matters or means anything, is just really good at lowering my will to exist. And when I find myself in times of struggling, and stress is nearly killing me itself. Suicide often becomes attractive. so for example, is there something I am missing there? Ok, I wrote a lot about that, but i didnt really intend this to be all gloom and doom. A more common problem I have is.. there isn't anything I really want. I try to care about things. I've been a vegetarian for about a year now except for the past few weeks.(but im back on it now as of like 2 days ago) I do it for 'ethical' reasons because i generally hate killing. but recently i just kind of broke down. i let other things go too. Then there are also of course some nice things about not caring. Many things about my character that I enjoy and that other people like are from this view. It does leave me feeling lonely though when it's hard to find people who agree or even really understand what I'm thinking. Most of me is still based on the idea that somethings have value, because i dont know how else i could really be. but deep down, i think differently, and i guess it mostly just affects rare decisions and deep thinking. I don't know anything else to say. but i've just been kind of rambling in a disorganized way... but I just want to hear what people have to say. why care? There's obviously the natural instinct to care about things just for survival or whatever. but in my mind consciousness (or at least a critcal and honest consciousness) should be more than that. Is there a real reason to care at all? Tell me i missed something, i see something wrong, am im just a complte idiot, or maybe right but irrelevant.. i dont know. whatever.. -peace
Why care? If you don't believe in a spiritual reality? Even if you think this world is ultimately pointless, you still have to live your life. Life can bring pain, and it can also bring joy and pleasure. So you might as well try to maximize the positive side, even if it's only passing and won't go on forever. Myself, I do believe in a spiritual reality, but still it seems to me that it is only natural to care, whether one has spiritual beliefs or not. And from what you say, it seems you muct care a bit, or why would you become a vegetarian and dislike killing? If your feelings were purely and totally based on 'instinct' then it would seem more logical to eat meat as man the hunter has done for millenia. I'm sure if you sit watching the TV news and you see some horrendous disaster with people suffering ect it must move you at least to a feeling of sympathy. What you say about your experience in 'therapy' is quite disturbing to me. It is an abuse really for so called therapists to try to use religion in this way, and it's also a dangerous approach in my view. They ought to be properly trained to deal with patients only on a basis of psychology and medicine. I know that they've taken this on board from AA to some extent, but the AA model is somewhat aniquated to-day, and has been the topic of much criticism here in the UK. Also, the AA people are not supposedly trained mental health proffesionals. Did they give you any kind of other psychological therapy other than the group? For instance occupational therapy, art therapy, one-to-one counselling?
I never had anything but a week of group therapy and medication. maybe i should do something about that. since my medicine pretty much stopped me from being suicidal, i figured i have time to figure out my mind on my own. maybe thats not the most effective approach though... heh anyway... why maximize positive? Why not maximize negative? why anything? I'm not talking about what I'm going to end up doing. I'm talking about what can be logically justified. you know? Like, feelings of positive and negative are just based on the survival instincts. so yeah, I usually will end up wanting to survive or wanting pleasure or whatever the case. but i mean... really beyond humans and beyond spirits maybe. I don't know if it makes sense that way... but im thinking maybe it will.. heh. Beyond us(people, gods, any other creatures or objects with spirits, etc), past that, there isn't any meaning right? so how does adding us in change that? Even a spirit, if its defined how i assume it is defined, is only meaningful relative to itself. Whether desires or any other traits are based in spirit or just a physical world, those are just desires of that particular person or spirit. but what they should do, relative to the entire universe, is just undefinable. what they, should do for themself is to survive and all that. but, for a hunter or a rival, it may be preferred that you die. By that other perspective, you should die. so there is is no real universal meaning. there is just our identity. It is what it is. and when we realize that, there is just this sort of... accepting what we are defined to do. or thats what i see most people do anyway. I guess me too. but I dont know if I want to. Like once we really understand who or what we are, if we have any integrity, shouldnt we be able to admit that we, and nothing else, really has any meaning or matters besides to these characters who we are. who we have to be... but its weird. because i know that i dont matter, but i kind of think of it the way i think adding an extra drop of water to my tea doesnt matter. but im not talking about tea or water. im talking about myself. and self is just such a bizarre thing to consider anyway. i mean, thats probably why most spiritual people consider spirituality right? you feel it as your self or whatever. i do even feel like that sometimes. but i mean i guess im not completely aspiritual. i just see spirits as product of the physical world, not the other way around. something like that. but anyway... i feel like im rambling again, but i feel like maybe i hopefully said something more meaningful in this post... you know.. the part of me that does care, i mean.
I don't think I can really offer any more comments here - Maybe you just need some time and maybe some more postive experiences to cheer you up. On the question of meaning though - either you accept some 'meaning' from others, or create your own meaning. There are various theories of the universe, from fundamentalist religion, though materialism, to less structured or dogmatic forms of spirituality. If you think the universe is what the fundies say, then 'meaning' is given - it's not a very satisfactory meaning in my view. From a materialist perspective, there can be only a kind of 'maximization' of the positive things. There's no reason really to emphasize the negative, it is not in our best interests, and to do so just seems to lead to a kind of emptiness. Really it's up to the individual to find or create their own meaning in life. Maybe though you wont find meaning through thinking or talk. Thats why I wondered if you'd had any occupational therapy - often doing things can take one out of oneself, and even give some feeling of satisfaction. Art therapy too - that can help bring out all kinds of things.
yeah. I can see how occupational or art therapy would give some form of meaning, but that doesnt really seem to answer what i was asking. anyway... today something really depressing happened and I don't think I'll ever care to talk about this again. so just forget it, i guess. :\ I feel sick.
