UN set to vote on Israel barrier

And again Max, the religions can indeed live side by side as it is not the religions which have caused this interminable conflict but rather the IDEOLOGY of Zionism and its grasping intent to control the entirety of the region. Prior to the entrance of the Zionists, Arab Muslims and Arab Jews coexisted perfectly well and peaceably together and, if youve failed to notice, Israel has muslims living peaceably as Israeli citizens, albeit a small minority and one (like its Arab Jewish counterparts) which is relegated to second class citizenship.

The sole and real ongoing obstacle to a viable settlement of social and economic benefit for all present day inhabitants of the land is the rejection of the zionist dogma and its lies and machinations once and for all by Israelis in favour of a comprehensive and inclusivistic social model (as is the hallmark of any truly DEMOCRATIC society). Zionism and zionists refuse to allow any real consideration of the true constructive dynamism this would reinject into their wholly externally supported economy simply because it necessitates an end to the exclusivistic state envisioned by the founders of the zionist movement from the very start. Time to put the 19th century dogma in the grave of history along with all the other failures of that age.

 

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Exactly WHERE did I say that I supported Arafat??? Read again.

The wall will ONLY work if BOTH sides stay where they are supposed to be and Israel keeps it's nose OUT of Palestine. The Palestinian people are tired of Israel telling them they have to do this, but oh no you have to do that too, and expecting Palestinians to bow to what they say. It's a well known fact that the Israeli government classifies Palestinians as less than human, dogs in fact as stated by one government official on camera in English, but yet that same Israeli government expects Palestinians to respect it's wishes.

That land was taken over by Israelis from Palestinians. They may have built a Kubutiz here and there, but not ALL that land was desert. Popular myth that goes along with the one that there is no such thing as a Palestinian and that there was no civilization in the area before 1948. The way some people tell it you would think that all these towns and villiages and farms just magiclly appeared in 1948. If that's the case then Israel's biblical claim goes right out the window too.

The first step would be for Israel to get out of Palestine and stay out. If they did that there would be NO reason for Hamas and such to do anything.

It's quite ignorant of you to take my post and twist it into something that it wasn't. I never said that I supported Arafat or any terrorist organization, but yet your post leads others to think that is what I said. Just because I don't support the Israeli government doesn't mean that I support Arafat. Nice try though, and again smarten up.

 

You clearly said:

"The truth of the matter is that Israel needs to get out of the occupied territories, and leave Palestinians alone to build their own country in peace. I said in a post some time ago that Arafat was on his way out at the time of the uprising and didn't have much support from his own people. I also said that Sharon had given him back that support and power by holding him hostage in his Ramallah headquarters. Seems that support has waned again and he is probably about to be ousted by his own people. Nobody was really ever behind him and if Isreal would just shut the heck up about him attending this and that and let Palestinians decide for themselves they won't have to worry about him at all. Blame him for whatever you want, he hasn't had a say in anything for a long time. "

I understood it as you supporting Arafat.

The Israeli government classifying Palestinians as "dog"? Where the hell do you get that bullshit. It's depriving, I won't even comment on it.

My point is that the land was not irrigated. Ofcourse it wasn't all a desert, yet, it was not close to being as green as it is now, which is why the word "desert" is used in contrast.

Get out of Palestine? What do you think they're doing now? The wall doesn't only keep Palestinians out of Israel, it also works the other way around.

No reason for Hamas? The goal of Hamas is to destroy Israel, if you want Israel to just get up and live the country, then you truly are an idealistic fool.

I did not say you supported any terrorist organizations. Yet, you did make me beleive that you supported Arafat. If that is not the case, then please make your posts clearer.

Smarten up? Give me a break.

 

Have you ever been to Israel? Have you ever seeen the population destribution there?

Your so called "arab jews" make up less than 1% of the population, so it wasn't that hard for them to get along with thier neighbors.

How can Israel prosibly practice such strict zionism as you preach when there are hundreds of Arab cities in Israel, and these arabs don't have to pay taxes, the government is that kind! There are thousands uppon thousands of immigrant workers from Asia and Africa. There are alot of people who are half jewish, or not jewish at all who live in Israel. Your whole ideology is flawed. Israel has long ago let go of the extreme zionism. It only exists in the old war veterans, such as Sharon, yet he cannot run a country on it, and isn't.

You can blame Israel for wanting to keep a completely Jewish state when they throw all the arabs to the sea, bomb Palestine to destruction, and send all the workers back home. (Which would never happen).

If Israel's zionism would be as extreme as you say, then there would be no "Palestine" by now.

 

Where in all of that did you get that I support Arafat or any terrorist organization? I never said any such thing anywhere, nor did I even hint at it.

I really wish I could find a source for that incident, but I've looked all day and can't. It was on a special I was watching a couple of years ago, and I remember it because it shocked the heck out of me. I know that things like that are said in private, but I never expected to hear it on camera from an Israeli official. What happened was that he was asked about some investigation that was supposed to take place into the death of a Palestinian child and what he said was Palestinians are dogs and they all lie. I honestly don't know if the man realized that he was on camera. I'm sure the tape has hit the dustbin by now.

Why shouldn't Israel just up and leave. They have NO business there other than to stir up trouble. Perhaps I am a fool, but I know the difference between right and wrong. Something the IDF and the Israeli government could use a few lessons on. Who told you Israel was leaving Palestine? Sharon? LOL Please, the man lies just as much as Arafat.

The goal of Hamas is to destroy Israel and they've never lied about that. However Israel's goal is to destroy and or wipe out every single Palestinian on the face of the planet. They don't keep their views to themselves either. They constantly export them to the West and make sure that Palestinians are only thought of as terrorists and nothing else. I dare you to tell me that's not true. I have 4 kids who've been called that very thing at school no less, by other kids, brainwashed by watching and reading western media, and their parents. Just makes my day when my 10 year old comes home and tells me one of the kids in his class called him a terrorist. Israeli PR machine works well. So well in fact that over 1/2 of the West doesn't even know that Palestinians are people NOT terrorists.

Finally I don't support ANY terrorist organization, Arafat, Sharon, the IDF or the Israeli government. I don't agree with ANY of their actions and I think they like to play off each other. Sick game and innocent people are paying for it with their lives. I DO support the Palestinian people and their struggle to live peacefully in their own homes and be recognized for the proud and wonderful people that they are.

Also, you as an Israeli citizen have a duty to perform next year. HOW are YOU going to handle that, and what are YOU going to do when you see the innocent eyes of a Palestinian child at the end of your rifle?

 

Ok, this was just way to funny for me to pass up.

Exactly WHAT do you think the IDF is currently doing????????

How many times have they closed the checkpoints to Palestinian workers with jobs in Israel?

Those Apaches are not dropping confetti and balloons. As for the sea Palestinian fishermen are NOT allowed to take out their boats to make their living.

You're hilarious! LOL

 

I just want to put this across. There has never been a Palestinian state, There should never be one in the future. Both sides should stop fighitng and live together in one state (Israel) as equals.

 

Suuuuurrre. That's why my in-laws birth certificates and immigration papers say PALESTINE.

Wanna know what there wasn't? NO such thing as Israel or Isrealis before 1948.

 

GA, we actually agree on something. imagine that. Although, on the first part of your response you are indeed wrong as this published UN map from 1946 (regarding the British partition plan) clearly shows reference to "Palestine".

 

Israel has all buisness in the land. It's thiers,they live in it, they will never leave, get it.

I do not need someone to tell me that Israel is going out of Palestine, there is a plan of almost complete evacuation until November of 2005. I see less troops in right now, less attacks in Palestine... what more proof do you need?

No, that's where you're wrong. Israel's goal is to keep its citizens safe. Saying that Israel wants to kill all Palestinians is completely ignorant, because, frankly, if that was Israel's intention...there wouldn't be a single Palestinian alive in the middle east today.

That works both ways, I have also recieved ALOT of shit for being an Israeli citizen... c'est la vie... you get shit for whatever you are, there are idiots everywhere...

I will not go to the army, my papers of release are in the works, if they do not pass through, I will skip the army illigely. I will never fight for Sharon. This is a political war, and innocent civilians are dying because of it. I will never serve any of the sides, in any way. I prefer to not see my family in Israel for 10 years, then murdering innocent Palestinians, or at least knowning that I am somehow contributing to it. What Israel does in the territories is not always right, this is why I like this wall, it will keep idiots who actually think that all Palestinians are terrorists...who are dressed in Zahal clothing out of the land. You see, I am not a zionist murderer as some of you percieve me.