A question for maggie...

I've worked with babies with really tight frenulums who could nurse, with little pain to mom, and other babies with just a little frenulum tightness who could not latch withouth mom going through the roof with pain. The severity of the toungue tie has little to do with how the baby does, they need to judge it on how THAT baby is feeding.

I get so angry when I hear that a mama couldn't get a frenumlum clipped. It is one of our biggest struggles as LCs. Most doctors don't even know what to look for anymore. What pisses me off, is they will cut the end off of a baby boy's penis for NO reason at all, and NOT clip a frenumlum, even if it might mean the difference between the baby nursing or not. I have to keep a list of doctors and dentists who will clip frens by the phone, so I can refer people.

YEP! We feed really sleepy babies with a cup or a syringe so they don't dehydrate, and have mom pump for a day while the baby wakes up. There is a LOT you can do with a sleepy baby to get them to feed, too. Sage came home at just about 5 lbs and she nursed FINE. I've seen 3.5 lb babies nurse fine, and 8 lbs babies who haven't gotten it down yet. Weight has little to do with ability to nurse.

NO baby was "born to botttle feed." They were all born to breastfeed. If only mamas could all get the right help at the right time, many many more babies and mamas would be able to experience nursing without pain and panic.

Blessings to all you mamas and your hard work. So many of you have worked SO hard to do what is best. It sometimes can take months, especially if you can't get the right help right away. HippyFreek, prayers and love for you and your little one, the odds are, things will go very well. Go to the birth prepared and confidant.

So many people spend most of the pregnancy worrying and preparing for the birth, which is VERY important, but breastfeeding is a process, and takes place over months or years, and too many mamas don't even think about it, until after the baby is born. Mamas need to prepare themselves with knowlege and expose themselves to other nursing moms, so they will have less problems.

I applaud mamas who tried so hard.

 

Yeah, I should have gone with my gut instinct to clip it myself, but DH had a total freak out when I mentioned the idea to him, and I was suffering PPD and PTSD and who knows what other psychological issues at the time... it would have been so much better than pumping and supplementing for that long!


Before DD2 was born, I had it all lined up to have her tongue clipped before we even took her home should she be born with a tight frenulum. When my midwife asked me if I thought we should, I decided not to since she was nursing just fine. She does, however, have a speech impediment and delay which might be related.

 

You have to be careful with clipping. There is a very important vein and artery which runs RIGHT through the tongue, if you nick it, the baby could heomoragge. I've been tempted, but, I'd lose my registration and certification for practicing medicine w/o a license, so I have to refer. Also, getting a totally sterile field is nearly impossible in your home. Even most peds won't do it, as it is considered a "surgical procedure" as is circs. The peds in our area don't do either, they always refer to either ped surgeons, ENTs or pediatric dentists.

I used to know a non Certified LC who used to clip frens in her home. It always scared me. I was always afraid we'd see her on the news, and we'd all be in trouble.

A lot of pediatric dentists will do it, if your next baby needs to be clipped.

 

You know, my FIL and DH both have slight speach impedements and my DH's tongue is like Jim's was before we clipped it so, I wonder if that's why? Interesting! And the clipping isn't so bad really. He only cried for a moment and it had healed by the next day.

 

Yeah, when my clients are reticent to clip, as the mom says she doesn't want to "hurt" the baby, if the baby is a boy, I always ask "Is he circumcised?" Often the answer is yes. I ask her, "Do you think the circ hurt? Was it neccesary for him to be able to nurse properly?" Of course it hurt, and it was NOT neccesary. Then I tell her, truthfully (AFAWK) that a frenulum clip is about 3 times or more LESS painful than a circ and actually serves a purpose for babies who have to have it done.

It never amazes me what people think "hurts" babies and then other things they do that makes your hair curl with fear.

Jazz, tongue tie runs in families and can cause speech impediments. Often people will talk "baby talk" or sometimes sound a little like Elmer Fudd. Years ago, when I was a baby, they would just snip any baby who even looked like he or she was tight. It was often done at the same time as the circ (poor baby) but, it was out of the way, and the few babies who nursed then had few problems with tight fren. There were also less problems with this certain type of speech impediment. I am surprised your FIL wasn't clipped as a baby. It was done often when he was young (I am assuming he was born in the 50s or maybe 60s.) He most likely was born at some modern "progressive hospital" which had stopped doing the regular clips like other hospitals did a decade or more later.

Jazz, keep an eye on your next baby, if it runs in your family, your dh, fil AND first baby all had TT, then the chances of the next baby having it are high. No big deal, just get it clipped immediately. Don't let someone tell you, "Let's wait until there are problems." Because, you'll be cracked and bleeding and the baby might not be getting enough milk before they see "problems" as you probaby know.

I was interested, how did you find out Jim was TT?

 

stop watching tv! especially all of that stressful baby related stuff

there are some traditions that believe that the emotions mama feels while she's pregnant will shape the personality of baby. it's not really that far fetched, either. when we experience emotion, we release neurotransmitters systemically that affect every single cell in our body (and baby's body too! including that forming brain)

so...long story short, stay in a mellow state and only bring healthy nurturing energy around you! ...no more stressful tv!

ps, you're going to be one of the best mama's ever!

 

my daughter ADORED those birth shows. it really helped her understand what was going to happen. i also had a phases of pregnancy picture book that we'd read together. by the time i had the baby, she'd been trying to be my midwife or coach for weeks. so precious. she'd hold my hand, rub my belly or head and tell me to push, or to breathe in her little mommy voice.

 

My FIL was born in the early 30's and my husband in '69. He's 13 years older than me and his father was in his 30's when they had him. My FIL's mother was a farm girl so maybe that's why he wasn't clipped? I've been around breastfeeding mamas all my life, I knew he wasn't latching properly even when the hospital LC said he was. Especially when my nips started to blister and bleed! The two LC's at the hospital didn't find it but when my MW came for the home visit she watched us nursing, saw we were having a problem and looked in his mouth. She instantly knew he was tongue tied. The next day our awesome Ped clipped it so easily. Through the rest of that day Jim healed and learned to nurse and by the next morning he had it down. But by then my nipples were damaged and the nursing would aggravate it, took weeks to heal and by then the thrush had set in! So nursing has really been a labor of love for me. Interestingly enough, I visited a friend who has a four year old yesterday. You can barely understand him when he talks and when I mentioned in conversation that Jim had been tongue tied, she had him stick out his tongue, and he was ten times worse than Jim! Should I recomend that they clip him? My friend is a bit of an F-up and isn't interested in getting him in speech classes, perhaps the idea of a quick fix will appeal to her. *shrugs*

 

I am so glad you were intuitive enough to get Jim clipped immediately, and that you have such a great ped!

As for your freind, once speech begins, clipping may help, but the bad habits are there, and kids who have speech problems form a TT ALL need speech therapy, with or without a late clip. One more thing, the frenulum thickens as the child gets older. Most newborns can be clipped in the office or even in the hospital after birth. An older child may actually have such a thich fren that he may need a general anesthetic to have the surgery, and there is usually more pain and bleeding with an older child. The child will still need speech therapy if the clip is done now, as he is already talking and the muscles of the tongue have not worked properly for FOUR YEARS. It is even harder in a boy, because the speech sounds so infantile, the teasing iis terrible. I hope she gets him the procedure, and the therapy.