Capitalism creates material inequality, which leads to many evils society faces today.

Can we all agree?

 

I'll nod my head to that.

well said

 

I'm actually unsure these days. Capitalism offers a few kinds of freedoms that couldn't be possible under socialism or other types of givernment.

HOWEVER:

- There needs to be huge tabs on what people like Bill Gates are able to earn. The gigantic rich/poor divide is comparable to middle age feudalism
- The working class needs more rights and should have more control over their own industries and jobs.
- Unlimited profit needs to be removed from areas where capital gets in the way of common human decency such as the pharmaceutical/public health industry.
- Basic human needs like banking, water, electricity and health services should stay public, which sort of ties in with the above (but this offers some questions about freedom)

Thats all i can come up with at the time being...I think we need a compromise with the freedom of a capitalist democracy and the equality of a working class dictatorship. I'm not sure though. I'm currently re-shuffling my whole view of politics. Perhaps anarchism could compensate for the loss of capitalist freedoms.

Feel welcome, anyone with different/more knowledge and experience to comment on my now hazy ideas.

 

Oh so it's capitalism which does that? I was under the impression that it was because not everyone is exactly the same.

 

capitalism works.

 

Like what?

 

Economic freedoms

 

Like what? and anything else?

 

Freedom to choose between private and public healthcare, schooling. Freedom for everyone to be educated instead of "illiterate peasants" though this might not be a capitalism thing. Freedom to work little for nothing and more for a lot.

Just a few....I can name a million freedoms which capitalism does not provide us, but between me and you i would think they're too obvious to mention. Perhaps you can for the benefit of others here.

 

Yes, but poorly, and not for the benefit of ALL PEOPLE.

 

Actually, if you're referring to utopianism. Capitalism, like most other ideologies depends on all people being exactly the same. Why do you think so many Americans are in jail?

 

Uhhh... Huh..?

 

But, you can only enjoy such freedoms if you have money, which makes these freedoms only enjoyed by a select few not the goal of socialism.

It is one thing to have a freedom, but if you are not able to enjoy that freedom what it point of that freedom?

 

What needs explaining?
1. Capitalism depends on a central government to apply the same laws to everyone. Which makes sense how?
2. Capitalism depends on people using their economic freedom responsibly which they so obviously don't, therefore making capitalism a utopian idea.

Capitalism doesn't work now because its a utopian idea.

Get it?

 

Have you even read my posts man?

Thats exactly what i'm trying to say. We need the kind of freedoms capitalism provide with a communism like equality. That could well be interpreted as democratic socialism but admittedly I don't really know a lot about modern demo-soc because old-school socialism has been rammed down out throats here for who knows how long.

 

well said.

 

Thanks....I feel really passionate about this one. It amazes me that among conservatives there is some mystical belief that capitalism is somehow exempt from the same "utopian" qualities as socialism, when in fact it depends wholly on people being "perfect".

 

The free market, and market forces cure everything is the typical answer, what they fail to realize is someone is creating those market forces they do not happen naturally or by themselves.

At least under socialism you know who the central planners are and could hold them accountable if wrongdoing is done, but under capitalism it is a guess who game.

 

Perhaps. But i'd like to see self-determination and responsibility tested more thoroughly.

I honestly see the capitalist lets "assign" responsibility and hand it over when its not wanted way very disgusting.

 

But it does work. Maybe not for you.. But that doesn't matter for those it does work for now does it? And as far as the original topic.. It's people who do that shit, not some idea.