The Bible is true?

I started to read a little of the Evolution of the Bible, which was one source you gave me, it was published in 1888 and it's author was Bronson C.Keeler. I got to tell you, he might of convince people the bible was not true back in 1888, but this excuse for serious study sure would get an F today. It first starts out telling us that the Old Testament was the work of astrologers. I know the old testament, and there is no mention of astrology. The first five books were written by Moses.

The new testament was written as an allegory on the annual apparent motion of the Sun, Moon and Stars, which was the basis of Sun worship, which looked upon the Sun as the visible representative of the great creative, hence the Sun of God. You have got to kidding me, this person is demented, there is no other explanation for making these statements, outside of being drunk out of his mind. I'm thinking this has got to be a joke, you can't base your spiritual conclusions on these kinds of writings.

"I have given also another story pictured in the old testament of Uranus as the Son of the Sun God, which must not be confounded with the above."-Bronson C.Keeler

I got news for you, Uranus is not mentioned in the old testament or the new testament, because William Herschel discovered it in 1781, long after the bible was written. I can't wait to read the other secret texts.

The new testament was written to show what should be rather than what was, or as a beacon light to lead man on to a better life. What is this guy talking about? What should be, is what happened. I give up, I can only deal with insanity for short periods of time. If you had been living back in 1888, this guy would of been trying to sell you a bottle of snake oil, claiming it cured everything from sore feet to cancer. Hope he's not the one your looking to for spiritual truth.

 

True Christians focus on both. We are Christians first and foremost because we know that Jesus died for our sins. But if we aren't practicing how Jesus said that we must treat one another, then what is the point? Christianity has to be a well roundness of faith, and love for our fellow man.

God fill three offices. Much in this way.... say you are married with children. You are:
A. The son of your parents
B. A husband
c. A father

God is God - the creator of life. Jesus is God coming down to earth in flesh form. The holy spirit is the spirit of God that is given to live in our hearts.

 

I like apologetics. It's an in depth study into my faith. I think this here will sum it up for all of you if you will actualy read it.

AMEN!

 

Campbell, first I will say that those are just websites. They are just reports that others have done regarding this issue. If you read closely and in context to my earlier statements you would have read the appropriate citings of the Vatican conventions concerning biblical revision...that was the subject. So what if it was written that long ago, how long has the bible been around? And if you know so much. Why aren't you explaining to me the origins of the bible and how it was written instead of just trying to refute my claims. I'm not asking to see how well you debate I'm asking about the bible. Do you know for a fact how and when and by whom it was written? Do you know how many original books there were? Have you ever read the hebrew torah or the greek writing of Paul? Can you tell me how Moses wrote Genesis? These are the questions I ask. Please. I have seen this happen all too often on these boards, there is no real debate but just people mouthing off their opinions which is fine but we must remembe opinions do not equal truth.

 

"There is no objective evidence that the biblical text has been tampered with by the Jews or the early Church. There is no manuscript evidence, no archaeological evidence, no eyewitness--or otherwise--testimony, no support from the writings of the early Church, nor any evidence from the study of textual criticism to substantiate witches' or other occultist's or critics subjectively based claims of a tampered Bible."

This is one man's conclusion. He is saying that he couldn't find proof of tampering and he wont because records of those kind are not available to anyone except the Pope and top cardinals

let us remember the meaning of the words objectively and subjectively.

 

Here is one man's conclusion after years of being in the religion called denialism (denying all the proof of the Bible) he actually went out and search for himself the truth. He has seen the truth and he no longer cries wolf.

To the best of my memory, before I came to the saving grace of Jesus Christ, I did not believe the Bible was true. I doubted whether there was a God and believed that we were born, lived so many years, and then died. I owned a successful business and thought that I had succeeded by my own wits.
One evening, my wife and I heard some documentation that these were the last days before Jesus Christ would actually return. Not really wanting to hear it, I almost walked out. Something kept me there, and I listened. I was not convinced. I still had doubts whether or not there was a God. I doubted whether there really was a Satan, heaven, hell, or a judgment. Just to be sure, however, I decided to do a little research. My idea was to find out if the Bible was really true. Indeed, if I could find one contradiction, one error, or anything in the Bible that was not true, then that would be all that was needed to disregard it. (I wasn't necessarily interested in whether we were in the latter days or not, but just trying to find out if the Bible was really true.) I believed this would take a very short time.
As I have learned, the Bible has about 10,000 prophecies (verses). Nearly one-third of the Bible is directly or indirectly related to prophecy. This endeavour led me into far more research than I could have suspected. One thing needed, was to determine when the Bible was actually written. Because of this, a study of biblical history and archaeology was necessary. I found the Old Testament was indeed written before the coming of Jesus, as the Dead Sea Scrolls (containing parts of the book of Isaiah) were proven to have been written before Jesus came. The book of Isaiah includes forecasts of Jesus. Thousands of clay tablets have also been found, which confirm many accounts in the Bible.
I began studying the prophecies in the Bible. My wife would go to the library for me to obtain documentation from reference books to see if the prophecies really did take place. One day went by, then two days, and then a week. Every prophecy that we were able to get information on proved to be accurate. Two weeks went by. Then four weeks passed. My job became of secondary importance. Every prophecy that we were able to verify checked as being true. I was astonished, but far from convinced. I still had doubts as to whether there was a God, a heaven, or a hell yet I had to be sure. Later, there were people who would show me what appeared to be contradictions in the Bible, yet these were not contradictions at all, but only a lack of research on the part of those that said these things. I was searching to find if the Bible was true. My wife spent a lot of time at the library making copies of various reference materials, which I would check out against the Scriptures. Stubborn, that's me. Even after four weeks of intensive study, proving prophecy after prophecy was true, I was still skeptical and refused to believe. I began taking more time off from my business and investing it in study. One month turned into two, and two months turned into four. The more I researched, the more determined I became. It wasn't possible. The Bible could not be perfect. Thousands of prophecies, and every one perfect? No, impossible! Sixty-six books written by many people over hundreds of years and not one error? If I would admit that, I would have to admit there was a God, and I was not prepared to do it, even after months of research.
My studies also included various translations of the Bible, checking prophecies against reference books, archaeological discoveries, just to mention some. It became an obsession with me. My foremost desire was to know the truth. Four months turned into many months. I've never known anyone, before or since, that was willing to take this amount of time just to find out if the Bible was true. Finally, I had to admit I was wrong.
If you would walk across the street 10,000 times and never get hit, then you would walk across the street the next time by faith. So it was with me. Finally, after spending almost countless hours of research, I had to admit the Bible is true and is indeed the perfect Word of God. Anyone willing to take the time I did and do the same research, could only come to the same conclusion, if they are honest with themselves. I may have been the biggest skeptic in the world, but now I know. It did not come easy, but by God's mercy and grace, it did come.

 

I don't believe you.


Sorry, Campbell34, but I don't believe you did all the work and research you claim. Name just three "proofs". State the verse, then the proof. You can't name one that can't be shot full of holes with pure reason.

 

It is my habit to take things I read and hear with a grain of salt. This may, I admit, inhibit me from putting my whole faith in some things. I know the bible is full of prophecies. Have they all come true 100% Well, I believe that is a matter of perception. Am I questioning your faith in the bible? No. I am not. I really hope I don't come off as a Christian basher because I believe in the freedom to worship in his/her own way. My point I was trying to make (for myself if not for anyone else) is that over centuries of revisions and translations some books were excluded, some were lost. Logic tells me that if man (he who prints and revises the bible we might buy at a bookstore) is imperfect and erreonous that his creations will be too. In all of the centuries in the history of the bible (outside of its worshipful purposes) this book (it must be made by men for you and I to have one to read) is subject as well as the society that embraces it. These are the points I am making. I'm sorry if we don't agree but in my own bad habit I feel the need to keep on foot on the ground.

 

WoW..... did you even read the first paragraph.....

Here is one man's conclusion after years of being in the religion called denialism (denying all the proof of the Bible) he actually went out and search for himself the truth. He has seen the truth and he no longer cries wolf.

THAT IS NOT ME....


But that is besides the fact.... what kind of proof would u like scientifical, archaelogical, or prophetical. I would write them all out for you but I do not have the time..... please look at my website ...

http://r-campbell34.tripod.com/proof

There you will see many of each proof and links to learn more about them.... and if there is something that you disagree with please tell....I will be happy to explain.... but as of now I have to get packing for my trip I will return aug. 14

 

Man didn't just write the Bible on his own. It was the holy spirit working through man. Just like when the holy spirit works through you to speak in tongues.

"Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation. For prophecy never had it's origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit" - 1 Peter 1:20&21

 

your missing my point....does the Holy Spirit then work through the press that prints them? And the companies that sell them for a price?

 

Not all Bibles have been watered down. The Greek-Hebrew King James version hasn't been tampered with much. Most of the changes in Bibles are due to translation.

 

This is completely absurd. It is true that we continue to try and perfect translations, but the bible from the beginning was a collection of works with varying degrees of accuracy. Many biblical scholars (not anti-christians) agree that as much a 1/3rd of the bible is a forgery. Foer example... many books credited to an author have other authors who borrow a namesake to lend weiht to their writings. Of the Gospels, only John is original and the others and copies... differing interpretations of the same work. Naturally they sound alike.. they are the same document. When the bible was being assembled there were HUNDREDS of gospels and many were eliminated because they contradicted or were too outlandish to be beleivable. The bible was formed to sound accurate and discourage differing veiwpoints. Rome took a whole room of texts, versions and scrolls and baked them into one consice book and told you it was irrefutable, completely accurate, uneditable, and unchangeable and then they told you if you didn't beleive that they would burn you at the stake. Then they launched a campaign across the world to destroy any evidence that was contradictory. No wonder so many people beleive. Those who did not were killed.

Here are some interesting things left out of the bible...
Jesus probably married. He may have had offspring which fled to Gaul (france) after his execution. Jesus and Mary M. both wrote gospels, but they contradicted the divinity of Christ and were all but wiped form the earth. Jesus as a child had some pretty special gifts and he played with them as any child would. He and his family were run out of more than one village becasue he hurt and even killed playmates with his talents.

I think Jesus was a gifted messenger who came to give us an important message but that has been all but lost by:
A) Paul twisting the religion to spread it across Rome.
B) Rome twisting the message to pacify its populous/
C) Everyone buying into that without ever taking hte time to investigate history.

 

God often told men to write as they were being moved upon by his Holy Spirit.
(Exodus 17:14. Revelation 1:11, Luke 1:1-4)

examples:
God told Moses to write the ten commandments on tabletures
Jesus often said..."It is written".

Where is "it written" in account? In the Bible.

11 Timothy 3:16: "All scripture is given by the inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctorines, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."


"Doctorine: Instruction for the seeking
Reproof: Proof for the questioning
Correction: Direction for the straying
Instruction in Righteousness: Training for the disciple"

The Bible often says, "God's word". What does God say his word is? The Bible

 

Thanks POPthree13....I was bginning to think that I was being delusional since noone here have ever heard of any of these things.

 

It should be obvious that the Bible cannot be literally true, as it contains contradictions, and things that from a literal point of view are pure nonsense - for example, Joshua commanding the sun to stand still when it is not the sun but the earth that moves etc.

That is not to saY that it doesn't contain truth on a symbolic level, esp. the new testament.
It strikes me as a bit strange that people get so worked up about this. Also I wonder how reading the old testament can be uplifting - what with ethnic clensing and so on.
The absolutely critical thing is the story of Jesus life, death and resurection - that could be literally true - but not I think the OT.

 

Campbell34-
I've taken the time to read you site and links. As compelling as it can be at times, everything listed is easily disputable. Everything can be dismissed as either- "recorded after the fact", "self fulfilling prophecies", or "loose connections between criptic prophecies and actual events". From a pure scientific standpoint there is no proof, only enough evidence for theory.

 

HEY! I did that play in high school. That was (Henry Drummond) my line.

 

-Are you going to get a little more detailed than that? Maybe give examples. It's easy to make broad statments.....

Jesus is the only way.

 

-The Dead Sea Scrolls were written before the church so that rules out the thinking that they Bible has been changed or mistranslated.
The Scrolls meaning matches up with todays Bible giving Christians confidence that the Bible has not been changed.

The men that wrote the Bible(Moses, Zechariah, Paul, ect.) must have been Gods themselves because what they wrote, what they predicted has been prophetically or archaeologically confirmed. THE FACT IS GOD INSPIRED THESE MEN.