What Are You Doing On...

Well it depends how you judge things. Do you respect someone for standing firm in the values or beliefs and sticking true to who they are or do you respect someone for what they believe in? I read some of her memoirs whilst researching my dissertation and found my opinion completely changed. She was an intelligent, witty, strong woman and and not a "weathercock" as Tony Benn puts it. And her intentions, on the whole fit in with many "accepted" values, as in giving people freedom and wealth etc so just because people might not agree with how she went about some things isn't showing the whole picture maybe.

 

I don't think I would respect someone for standing firm in their beliefs if I disagree strongly with those beliefs. Belligerence is not something, in itself, to be respected. Her interest was in protecting the rich and helping the poor as little as possible, as is the concern of all Conservatives

 

I'd just play the old classic


"ding dong the witch is dead"

 

Again, I'm in agreement with Lithium. Although consistency is a highly regarded trait in influencing majorities, I still maintain the right to dispise her for the policies which she consistently represented and for their devasting effect on the working class population of Britain. I respect her intelligence, in a way that I do not respect George Bush's, but internationally she was equally as dangerous. She participated in a project of global neo-liberal reform that has objectively brought misery to millions of the poorest of the world's people. That is the cost of economic 'freedom' - market tyranny....

 

She's still better than Tony f*cking Blair, even now she's near to karking it. Although she is directly responsible for him being in power, damn..!

 

I think Labour has been an improvement domestically. It's not everything we wanted granted, but working families tax credits and the minimum wage are two examples of very strong early policies. Indeed I sometimes forget we didn't have a minimum wage before the present government. Blair also did a brilliant job in Northern Ireland. Internationally he was a star, right up until George Bush took over in the White(hall) House and since he's been a train wreck....

 

No, the only good thing that i can see that they've done is to make the Bank of England independent of Government authority. Mo Molem did all the work in Ireland as far as i'm concerned, i don't know a great deal about these tax benefits for working families, that sounds good, but what about all the encouragement they have given to NON-working families? They've encouraged this chav nation we live in now, let's face it, at least under the tories everybody still wanted to work, even if they couldn't.

As for "international star", i'm not sure exactly what you mean. You mean that the rest of the world hate us almost as much as the US thanks to Tony Tony Tone sucking up to them? That's not the sort of attention i appreciate us getting as a nation, frankly.

 

Yes Mo Molem did a lot of good work in NI, but give the devil his due, she was a minister in Blair's government and he himself put a lot of effort into the process. Unemployment is a fraction of what it was under Thatcher. Part of that is die to the state of the economy. Part of it is due to incentives for returning to work. Tax credits are one of those incentives, they top up low wages so people get a fair pay for a day's work. How do you mean the government have encouraged a chav nation?

I said an international star up until he became bed fellows with Bush. Since then, yes, he has brought Britain a lot of problems internationally and he has made us a terrorist target. I couldn't agree more. Don't get me wrong, I hate Blair, I can't wait to see the back of him, but I wouldn't put him in the league of Thatcher. Blair betrayed the labour movement, Thatcher betrayed the world's poor....

 

Well lets not pretend that the Tories were wholly responsible for that. You know that the country froze under the previous labour government, noone was working then either, cos everyone was striking. The UK was actually known as the "Poor Man of Europe" under labour, so really the Tories didn't create mass unemployment, it was already there, only labouring (pun intended) under a different label.

I'm not saying that the poor weren't right royally screwed by the Tories through the eighties, but to be fair to them, John Major implimented loads of the positive policies and actions the Labour government claim the benefits of. And we were in a massive mess as a country, Thatch got us out of that mess, even if she managed to destroy the British industry doing it.

As for Chav nation, well i'd be careful about taking the Government's unemployment figures as corrrect, they've plenty of times been proved to have played around with figures, and got them wrong before. But that's an aside, really. Have you not noticed the sheer volume of people who are having children now just to claim benefit and not work for a living? Are you aware of how easy it is to cheat the benefit system? Even now, after all the publicity, kids are being brought up to believe that they don't have to work, that they deserve benefit all the time, not just when they are not able to work. I see this very much as a repercussion of the labour government. But anyway, i think i've said all i'm interested in saying now.

 

She's my Iron Lady..

And my Major Blur


Going through a very rough time, but just about ok..


........



Did we admire Margaret Thatcher because she had the power and presence to earn the title of Iron Lady? Strong until you saw that look as she left office with the wave?

I suspect she always made sure she didn't utter the words "I'm in this to do a job to the best of my ability, not to make friends", but I think that was what drove her...

Count how many outragious things she did in her time at No. 10, and I don't think she was so bad afterall..

 

I would be very interested to see your evidence for such a claim!

 

What's more worrying is the amount of Eastern Europeans who come over to England and immediately start claiming benefits, when British nationals have to go through an extremely harrowing process just to get £90 fornightly!

 

Yowsers this place has suddenly gone all Daily Mail!

Migrant workers are not entitled to claim welfare benefits at all until they have been working for 12 months. The immigrant workforce is a net contributor to the economy.

Sheesh! Less of the rightwing propaganda

 

if they're working, yes.... but not if they're claiming. If you state you're coming here to work, then work! If they went to France, Germany etc they'd have to and we do when we go abroad to work.

I certainly don't intend to stay in the UK for longer than is necessary, don't get me wrong... I love Devon. However, the tax system is unfair and benefits such as Education Maintenance Allowance and Jobseekers etc are dispersed unfairly too. My parents have paid enough tax over the years, but my sister wasn't allowed to claim EMA, I mean, wtf is up with that?

Much rather give the government of Japan my 5% of my incomes rather than 34% or whatever it stands at currently over here, knowing that it's not actually going towards NHS and other public services.

 

Try walking around with your eyes open for once, if you don't believe in benefit fruadsters. I know a few personally, and i bet you do too if you are honest with yourself.

Less with the Daily Mail insults, it makes you look small-minded and foolish, particularly as i don't read the Daily Mail, and also, unless you do, how do you know what the Daily Mail is like? I never once mentioned immigrants either, so pay attention to the argument!

It's nice to be an idealist, but try not to let it turn you into a fantasist.

 

Open your eyes man, there's all the evidence in the world staring in front of you! Go to a job centre, walk round an estate, listen to people, know people, or just watch any TV or read any newspaper.

 

he was talking to me then, I think. So much for freedom of speech huh?

 

Ah, i need to open my eyes too then! Must have read it too fast.

But yes, assuming things about others is a surefire way to get yourself into trouble. I have no idea why peope think that most situations have a black and white answer. Humanity just ain't that simple i'm afraid..!! Never mind, maybe he'll go and do a bit more research now, or at least learn that other people are entitled to their own opinions!

 

What percentage of mothers got themselves pregnant solely for the purpose of claiming benefits? This was your claim. What are your figures? Which studies show this?

Anecdote is really not good enough if you intend to make such outlandish claims!

 

Go to Butts Park in Crediton or Cullompton or Willand, they're all in Devon. Ask the majority of women there.... I think they'll help to prove cere's point