Indirect glorification of this war.

I'd like to throw a Wilson 3 out to all of you here at Hip Forums. A cousin of mine is home right now for 30 days r&r after being shot in Afghanastan.

My town held a gathering at the vets hall for him. He's a little private that was up on a roof repairing it when he was hit by a sniper.

Hundreds of people showed up to tell him what a hero he is. I never had a chance to ask him what he thought about the whole thing. But something about the whole ceremony made me uncomfortable.

If we hold every soldier up as a hero, and declare that by the littlest act they are securing our liberties, isn't this actually reinforcing the mindset that war is an answer to our security and world image problems.

I just have this feeling that this over-enthusiasm is going to be just as bad for our GIs as the resentment of them in the Vietnam war was not the answer either. When the war is over and their VA entitlements are cut by congress how are they going to be able to balance the difference of response?

 

yes, this sort of reminds me how dwight d eisenhower was made such a high ranking general even though he saw very little battle during world war 2. there was people who say way more battle than him and yet they never got such lofty positions of command. i agree with you, i don't see how getting shot while repairing a roof equates to heroism.

 

We all had to go thru the whole war hero thing a couple years ago, about that sweet young girl from Elizabeth, WV who was injured and then declared a hero and put up on diety level locally. Man, she just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, and honestly, she had no business there at all, and no commander in the military in their right mind should have put someone so tiny and young and inexperienced in such a dangerous situation. So the media turned it into a damn circus, she became more famous than Jesus Christ for a while, and it put a little one horse town on the map. I think they just do that so people will have something to think about besides stuff like torture or raping young Iraqis girls or no weapons of mass destruction.

 

A soldier's job is to follow orders. (An officer's job is slightly different.) Your cousin volunteered to do what he was ordered to. Our government (through the chain of command) gave him the orders that led to his injury. We (through our government, grumble about how representative it actualy is) are the ultimate source of his orders. Briefly, he volunteered to do what he was ordered to and we gave him orders that got him injured.

During Vietnam, the anti-war people made the mistake of blaming the soldiers for the war. During this war we are continuing the habit (acquired in the interveening years) of refering to any victim as a hero. Consider, that the people who died in the Twin Towers are commonly called heros without distinguishing between the firefighters, who heroicaly rushed into a burning building, and the workers, who did nothing more heroic than show up for work.

I blame advertising, but it seems that our society doesn't recognize the existance of "normal" or adverage. Things must be GREAT or LOUSY. Charlie Brown had only two choices "Hero" or "Goat".

Perhaps what he did was not particularly brave or heroic in the Audey Murphy sense. But he did volunteer to serve his country (whether his following orders was a good thing for the US reflects on the order givers, not your cousin). He showed up and got a piece of metal in his body. As someone who didn't volunteer and didn't get shot, I really don't have any problem with his getting a hero's treatment; he sacraficed more for his country than I have.

And yes, there is an impulse to look at his heroism and conclude that the orders he was following were right. ("We musn't waste the sacrifices of our fallen.") A proper responce is to see that the order givers think of your cousin's sacrifice and honor him BEFORE giving him orders. Your cousin sacrificed, therefore we must make sure that his comrades that are still in khaki get orders that make their eventual sacrifice a worthy one.

Still the PR types (that could sell snowballs to eskimos) will use his sacrifice to justify the killing of Afghani children.

P.S. They aren't waiting until after the war to cut the VA budget, close hospitals, etc. Heck, the Shrub tried to cut the soldiers combat pay right after Shock & Awe. They aren't waiting. Oh yes, remember to "Keep Shopping for America"

 

Yes. Many American soldiers signed up for service, with a pure heart of servicing our country, and protecting our liberties. Once they sign that piece of paper, reguardless of how just or unjust the war is, they follow orders. That is what they are trained to do. Is a man not a hero when he saves/protects his countrymen, if the government shouldn't have had him sent there in the first place?

 

Thanks everyone for being reasonable in your responses. I really thought I was going to be dumped on for even thinking the way I did. And I do value the servicemen and women. More than you know. I just think this is a slippery slope we are on right now. And I pray that they receive the support they deserve and need when this is all over with.

 

The soldiers are brave, and that cannot be taken away from them, but lets be honest, they are not protecting the US at all. Its not their fault, it actually increases my sympathy for them, they are out there dying for no good reason at all. Not only dying, but killing, getting legs blown off etc.

I guess it comes down to the question "are ones actions purely what makes them heros, or is it the actions combined with a noble cause?"

I wish all the blind supporters of this war would realize that actual people are being killed there, its not some football game. Already the brothers of 2 of my friends have been killed there.

 

Sorry for the loss of your friends. Everyone always says they are fighting for our safety and our freedoms. Sorry like you Seamonster, I don't buy that. I want them home all of them now. If you want to protect my freedoms and security put our boys along our border. Then maybe I'll pick up a flag and wave it.

 

Yea, exactly. The problem is that doesn't fit with the new American imperialist ambitions of taking over the Middle East for its oil, which is the only thing this war's about anyway.

 

was that Jessica Lynch or was it Lynn DeEngland ?

 

Most of you won't remember Lt. Calley during Vietnam. But this is what he said at his trial:

Of course, Calley never mentioned the fact that not one round of enemy fire was ever received at My Lai that day and no Viet Cong were ever seen or captured. There was no contact with the enemy whatsoever and Calley nor any member of his platoon ever attempted to make that claim. His platoon suffered not a single casualty and there was no battle, as some people believed.

He killed at least 22 civilians himself and he only spent 3 1/2 years incarcerated under house arrest (approximately one month for every ten Vietnamese killed at My Lai, the precise number killed varies from source to source, with 347 and 504).

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/vietnam/trenches/my_lai.html

Do we want our youth to reach the point where this will happen in the Middle East?

Side note: He now sells insurance. Need some?

 

I think you should look at it with a bit of proportion. Were they 'celebrating' war, or 'celebrating' the fact he [as a individual and member of the community] was home safe and well . From what you say it seems ''celebrating' because he was home safe and well''. If that is the case, i don't think they were indirectly gloryfing the war at all.

Every soldier is not a hero, if ones sent home in disgrace are 'celebrated' that would be a bad turn of events.

Maybe next time, ask him what he thinks about this question of yours [not said in a sarcastic tone].

 

I tried but he's always surrounded by reporters and local officials. Shoot he's even attended the Ladies Club Christmas meeting. It's a media circus. He leaves to go back to Walter Reed tomorrow.

As far as the "celebrating" goes I got a little tired of all the praise for him protecting our freedoms. The six year old kid who presented him a flower and thanked him for keeping us safe. These sort of statements were made and are still being made over and over again. I don't see our occupation of the middle east as protecting any of my freedoms.

Sure I am as happy as everyone else that he's home safe and well for the moment. But there's a rumor going round that he can choose to go back to Afghanstan, because he received a purple heart. It's not going to be his choice, it comes down to the evaluation at Walter Reed.

Now everyone will view him more like a hero, because they will think that he returns to combat duty by choice.

 

A bit late in the day then. Oh well hopefully he will be back. Ignore the response he gets, and then see what he thinks. I just hope you get the opportunity.

I can see it not going down well, with the type of feelings i have read from you.

That is your own point of view, others obviously disagree. Another reason it may make you slightly erm what is a nice word for it ?.. I'm at a loss. Lets say you are seemingly not best pleased with this.

Does he want to go back, is he wishing he was not going back ?. If he wants to go back it does not matter who decides. I think he may appreciate to a degree it is out of his hands. I'm not to up, on military ettiquete, as far as this goes. Neither do i know what he thinks. Have you any online press about him [at hand] ?.

Well i have not read he does not wish to go back, willingly or by not wishing to follow orders [going awol].

 

I hope all of you realize that those like Tillman who are injured or killed by friendly fire are not usually eligible for purple heart recognition. His family did receive one for him, but in many instances those shot mistakenly never receive any recognition of their injuries.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/09/25/MNGD7ETMNM1.DTL

mb I'll find you a link to some of the press Jake recieved when I get some free time.

 

Thank you.

 

Here's a link:

http://redbluffdailynews.com/searchresults/ci_4886854

 

Thank you. It says

''Because Jake will receive a Purple Heart, he won't have to go back to Afghanistan, unless he wants to, his mother said.''


You will have to let us all know if he goes back, and give him my best wishes [stranger - many thousands of miles away ].

 

Nice, he got lucky, that could have been a very bad injury. Good to hear that he's alright. I have a feeling that he won't be going back either.

 

He might, he may feel like he has not completed what he wanted to achieve. Maybe he wants to do more. I don't know though. We will hopefuly see in the fullness of time.