Richard Dawkins - The God Delusion

There seems to be a spate of books like this out at the moment. I can't decide whether to buy it or not. It sounds like he makes his case well. But I want to believe more, not less. Even when I know that's a silly argument to make. But anyway, has anyone read it, and what do they think?

 

Hello Son,
If it is truly the case that you want to believe more, I would stay well clear of anything written by Richard Dawkins, he is one of those rare talents that is both an excellent scientist as well as being able to put hard science into language understandable by all. I am unfamiliar with this work you reference but I do know, quite well, one of his other works, "The Selfish Gene", and in my opinion should be absolutely required reading for everyone between the ages of 12 and 16. One is so much better equiped to answer the question "Who am I?" if one has already an accurate answer to "What am I?" In the selfish gene, Dawkins makes it very clear just what kind of thing the human animal would be as a result of survival of the fittest in an environment with limited resources. It is in my opinion the epitome of paradox that the thing that is the most wonderous about being a human being, i.e., that we know we exist, that we have "consciousness", was, in a manner of speaking, evolutions big mistake. Untold thousands of years between a handheld piece of flint for a chopping tool, and the notion of using some of that groovy hemp to tie a handle on it, less than 500 years from bows and arrows to thermonuclear weapons. In my opinion the idea of god, is currently one of the most dangerous threats to the survival of humankind.
It relieves us of responsibility to the future, after all "let Gods' will be done"
It may well be the case though that the future is already out of reach, so if you want to keep God, stay away from Richard Dawkins.
sine cera

 

Thanks for your thoughts, VCR. Some interesting points there.

I've only discovered Dawkins recently and I'm open to reading what he's written. I agree with you - he has that unusual gift of being able to make complex ideas accessible.

I've heard Dawkins himself describe this existensial phenomenon rather well by saying that: "many people make the rather circular mistake by reasoning that, if God does not exist, then my life is meaningless. My life surely is not meaningless. Therefore God must exist."

I'm not sure about this bit. Secular regimes have historically been at least as vicious as God-fearing ones, I'd say. And is it not rather easy to turn that theory on it's side any way and suggest that, if you believe in God, then you are likely to behave yourself better? As this implies that you believe that you will ultimately be held accountable for your actions. If, however you do not believe in God, then why rein-in your behaviour at all if there is no final judgment on your actions?

 

- SonOfTheRock

Yes, I know this is an old topic but I think that it requires more input.

Well, why do most people behave well? Is it because of the fear of eternal punishment? Is it because we're raised that way? Is it just because we're"good"? From my understanding it seems that a large part of our morality is due to our evolution.

I think we can all honestly agree that evolution is very real in every sense of the word. Well, that means that a large part of me is very much the same as a large part of you. The same applies to our species (and actually many other species) so most humans are going to have some pretty similar characteristics.

A not too old study shows that the vast majority of people (who were tested) will give by and large the same answers to questions of morality as others of different nations, races, and religions. Atheists, Christians, and so on from several different countries.

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:Yb9UuicoZHUJ:www.psych.ucsb.edu/research/cep/papers/incest2003.pdf+Morality+biological&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1

I believe that was the source used in the book. This question was addressed in the book . Moving on though.

If someone is good only because they are afraid of "punishment" then maybe that person is in need of a doctor. I do not believe in a "high power" and I think of myself as a very kind and moral person.

I believe in doing good to and for other people. I dislike violence and don't understand why you would want to hurt someone under normal circumstances. Why am I good? Because I believe that we're all we have for each other. We have to help each other out. That... and it's just who I am.

If you have any questions, are unable to find more information on the topic yourself, or just want to discuss the topic just feel free to post a response or send me a PM.

I will reread the book and post a review on it later on sometime during the next week. I do highly recommend you all get it right now though.

 

'The root of all evil' video is on youtube, its pretty good and similar to the god delusion.

 

Heres an interview about the book and Richard Dawkins views:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWL1ZMH3-54&mode=related&search=

 

I haven't read 'The God Delusion', although I have read other of Dawkins works, and I saw a two part documentary he did for british channel 4 tv last year where he put his case in no uncertain terms.

I have a divided view of Dawkins. There is no doubting his honesty and integrity, nor his intelligence and scientific credentials. He has enormous communication skills too. And up to a point, I agree with much of what he says in so far as it refers to mass religion, organized religion, dogmatic mon-theism and such things.
However, I don't discount the existence of a higher intelligence in the universe. If it does exist, then I concur with Dawkins that religion certainly hasn't any inkling of it.
At least, the traditional western religions. No doubt Dawkins is correct in saying that most of what they believe is dangerous nonsense.
There may well though be non-dogmatic types of spirituality which are not bound up with political power games and brainwashing..Dawkins seems not to see this.
Overall though I like Dawkins, and I think his ideas, agree with them or not, are certainly worth looking into.

 

I agree with your point of view here.
I think the best way to approach 'higher consciousness' is certainly not through taking on board some more or less arbitrary belief system. In fact, the more one looks into different such systems the more one is struck by the fact that each one claims exclusivity for what are very over-constructed sets of dogmas about reality and our place in it.
The kind of attitude that's needed is more as you say, to do with actual methods of expanding consciousness. This can be seen as scientific in the true sense of the word. It is clearly not wise to believe in that which cannot be verified experimentally and experientially.

Anyway, welcome to the forums - nice to see some intelligent comment.

 

The nature in human nature is Mother Nature and the mother of nature is the garden!

 

I would say go ahead and read it. There's no case for the non-existence of God in that book.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=433628&in_page_id=1770

http://www.alternet.org/mediaculture/47052/

Sums up my feelings about the book and Dawkins nicely.

 

As far as I'm aware, Dawkins is not actually making a case that God does not exist - as a scientist he fully understands that it is impossible to prove a negative. You can't disprove 'God' just as you can't disprove Zeus, Thor, the Tooth Fairy, The Flying Spaghetti Monster. The point he is making is not that these entities can be proved not to exist, but that it makes absolutely no sense to believe in them given the total absence of positive evidence for their existence and the fact that the things attributed to spirits and gods can be far better explained by other means.

Incidentally, would you recommend *not* reading it if you thought there *was* a "case for the non-existence of god" in it?

 

emile_jenson please write me with some of your thoughts at g-spotspecialist2001@yahoo.com

 

I almost bought "The God Delusion" the other day, but it was a bit pricey.

And I also just made 0% of a contribution to this thread. Rock!

 

Do you think god has a book called "the dawkins delusion"

 

Actually yes...



Not actually by god, just a christian who obviously doubts the existence of Richard Dawkins...

 

i didn't read the hole book .. but i've read enough 2 know that the author has a strong argument & he can conveince the reader ..the way he wrote his cases was very smooth ..but we don't have 2 believe in every thing he wrote ...only 2 have a position in our religion & try 2 find some answers 4 the questions that he mentioned

 

If anybody is interested, check out the link in my profile to see my review of The God Delusion.

 

Yes I've read it, it's pretty well written, and kind of funny at times, and it will make you believe less.