i don't even know where to start with you, so i'll break it up line by line. i hope some of this gets through/makes sense, if not i'm happy help. "...extracting...if you believe in ethics..." ok, so quick definition of ethics here. basically, ehtics is a theory of right and wrong based on tradition, or "tried and true", mehtods as opposed to morals, which is the weighing of good and bad consequences of each instant choice. ethics are thought by philosophers (read: people who aren't me) to be a higher authority, basically because whichever decision seems to have worked for whatever reason and we shouldn't worry our pretty little selves with such big thoughts. now, extracting is bad "if you believe in ethics." no. i'm guessing you're reffering to years of practice of eating or making a tea, but i'm also guessing you haven't considered the marvels of chemistry. firstly, san pedro isn't a drug, it's a plant. second, there are many "drugs" in it, chemicals that will alter some form of your perception in some way. you can google alkaloid contents if you're curious, some are psychoactive and some aren't, but one that need be mentioned is the ephedra like compounds. ephedra is basically a stimulant in a natural form. keep this in mind, read on. extracting is a process of reducing/eliminating extra or unwanted chemicals through some means (google teaches these methods.) it may leave you with a powder, or maybe some crystals, but it is arguably now less of a "drug" as a whole as it no longer contains the other spices that add to the experience. there's personal reasons for doing cactus to begin with, so it's easy to say that there are personal reasons for, say, not wanting the ephedra to stimulate your experience. now, i'm no chemist myself, but i am old enough to know that preventing my natural sleep cycles can be unhealthy at times. so perhaps someone who has decided to eat cactus has also decided to go to bed at a reasonable hour. it's going to be hard with those stimulants coarsing through the body... if only there were a way to enjoy cactus without staying up all night... someone should come up with a way to keep the beneficial effects while getting rid of the undesired ones... if only the good could be "extracted" from this mess... as far as ergot, plenty of shit kills you. be careful. and lsd is not "in" ergot, the ingredients to synthesize lsd are there as well as other sources. i don't know much about this, though i have read that if you get ergot poisoning and don't die, a common side effect is multiple loss of limb(s). that being said, take a break right now and go google for, "ergot cold water extraction" and check out the forum listing on "ergot wine". a nine or a ten on the crazy shitometer. "an all natural type person." -no offense, eat shit. chemicals are natural. you're made of them. so is ergot, so is cactus. in fact, there's a lot more in a "plant" than an "extraction." so now given this knowledge, it is safe to say that any psychoactive plant in itself is "more of a drug" than some single compound extraction. "all natural" is often, and almost always, a mental failsafe for comfort. don't be afraid of knowledge, but certainly don't create subjective details in such an extreme. it doesn't matter how you get chemicals, as long as it's a clean product. the important thing to remember is effective dose responses. let's use pedro for an example: in the "natural" mind, dose might be decided by length*diameter, or for those who have excepted the "'unatural' science of measuring substances by means of gravity" or "weight". some natural people would be weighing the cactus matter fully, while others would weigh only the skins. the only differences in this thinking that i am asking is the awareness of what you are measuring. if you've extracted a nice bit of pure, recrystalized mescaline hcl or whatever, don't measure in length or size of pile, but instead use weight. this is where the varying amounts of mg's come from for threshold through mind melting experiences. everyone's different in their psyche as well as their diet/biochemical makeup, so it'll be slightly different for each person. consider that people have been extracting mescaline for almost a hundred years (i think it was synthesized in a lab before it was found in cactus, 1920's vs 1940's respectively) in fact, the chemistry of ethnobotanicals (plantdrugs) have been investigated so thoroughly that sources/guides have been developed (read: erowid) to establish a database for this knowledge. some of this information is based on personal experience, lab trials, etc., but regardless this is all documented much better than the specifics of the rituals from 1300bc or whatever you want to base tradition centered morals (see: ethics) off of. as far as "method of ingestion" and the "journey" found there to be neccesary, for sure. eating acid is one of the least enlightening experiences available (until, say, 30 minutes later?). anyone can eat a sugarcube, not everyone is willing to brew some tea. (by the way, making tea is a form of an extraction as you have effectively "extracted" the chems from the solid plant matter.) consider this: it sucks drinking cactus juice. it's an experience that builds character, allows you to pay your dues before enjoying yourself, etc. now consider how much character it will build to go through each step of the acid/base extraction. this is, in effect, the journey that you refer to as important from ingestion, but now the journey is completely in preparation. anyone can have a cup of tea, not everyone can preform an a/b extraction yielding clean product. "was it really ever supposed to be consumed?" were poisonous snakes "really ever supposed to" bite us in the face? i sure hope not, that doesn't sound like a nice time at all. maybe this is the same for "poisonous" plants. those who don't exercise caution by way of informing themselves in some manner, get bit in the face. maybe some snake out there has the cure for canceraidsbirdflu in its venom though we haven't taken the time to understand it or haven't been lucky enough to stumble upon it, because the poison just seems to kill people when they get bit. so maybe "it" (not just ergot, but whatever) wasn't meant to be consumed until humanity or the individual human has mastered the knowledge to live through the experience in a healthy way. the only ethical attitude here is the seeking of knowledge in all forms. those who came before would agree, that's how they came up with a way that worked for them. we should see this, use this, and consider or develop a way that works for us. there's "something to think about." i can't speak for venoms or for ergot, both are incredibly dangerous. cactus though, i agree with you about cactus. it is good for you. everyone needs to grow cactus, or at least get some friend to start propogating it with you. it has the ability to destroy the underground economy/black market/"money for nothing" that's been created through the war on drugs, as long as you don't sell it or create a market for it. share it, trade it, but don't debase it to the level of money. this is abuse. it's an experience that's better if it's not bought or sold, best if it's earned. you know, before raves had mdma, they had mescaline. but x doesn't make you puke, so now it's the favorite party/hug drug. mescaline makes you nauseous at times, and thusly protecting itself from over use. be safe, but above all, breath deep and fly high.
woah spark that was a lot to read but it's totally right. If you think that just eating the cactus to get high gives you an intimate connection to the spirit of the plant that's leaving a lot of wisdom you turn your back on. You still get fried but aren't you naturally cuious HOW and WHY you feel the way you do? Psychedelics always have encouraged me to seek the truth and learn. If anything the process of obtaining the mescaline from the plant is just a groovy thing to think about while tripping that'll blow your mind. ... Ergot kills you. LSD does not harm you. Think for a moment about all that music made because of that creative catalyst. If not for the alchemishts and shamans of this modern age we'd probably just eat morning glory seeds and throw up.
What about the theory of preparation. The Shamans take their cactus cut it up and boil it down for many hours and gather the liquid. its simple yet uneffective in the modern age. unless you got that kinda time and your family doesn't trip on you. we have vegtable juicers that works well if thats your thing. That only takes half an hour to prepare. The extracted mescaline is supposed to be cleaner due to less non active alkaliodial substance to be ingested and only the good stuff. reduction of nausea. Like the prep of morning glories. crush em in your coffee grinder and soak in lemon juice for 30 min. add some juice and strain through a reusable coffee strainer and bam pure LSA potion no nausea unless you drink alcohol with it.
