Free Tibet - Boycott China Olympics!

"the Dalai Lama has since condemned many of Tibet's feudal practices and has added that he was willing to institute reforms before the Chinese invaded in 1951" -From Wikipedia

I know that obviously sounds a bit suspicious, but with the worlds eyes on him, I very much doubt he would try and go against all he'd been saying for all of 40 odd years.

I believe the Dalai Lama should be given a position like the English Monarchs, being a Figurehead and effectively being 'owned' by the state.

 

Hi McLeodGanja, I can't answer this question because I have never broken Chinese law and stayed in a prison. But I do know prisons are not holiday hotels.

 

They are also not torture centres.

There is also a difference between breaking the law and breaking the law imposed on you by an invading country by protesting against their occupation peacefully.

 

With worlds eyes on them, Iraq people get their happiness? Worlds eyes, you mean western medias' cameras?

If Dalai Lama comes back to practice religion and don't touch politics, I think Chinese government will be very happy to welcome him back. But he asks much more than that.

Hi wait, Tibet now is already TIBET AUTONOMOUS REGION, the highest leaders and most of cadres of TAR are Tibetans. What kind of autonomy Dalai Lama wants?

Dalai Lama's autonomy middle way wants one quarter of land of China, including TAR, part of Sichuan province and Gansu province. He wants Chinese government pull out army and all other ethnic people who have lived there for generations. etc..

Here is a article about Dalai Lama's Middle Way details:
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2006-07/26/content_649545.htm

 

Hi McLeodGanja, I don't think you have read all the links I put on, here is one worth to read:

http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?t=68073

After reading, can you please tell me what you think about "invading".

About peaceful protest, please have a look here and see how peaceful those protester were:

www.anti-cnn.com
http://video.google.com/videoplay?d...plindex=0&hl=en
http://video.google.com/videoplay?d...plindex=1&hl=en

When you are watching western media, just remind you, Nepal is not in Tibet, Nepal is not part of China.

 

Thanks Ellenz, I don't really have time to read anything at the moment but thanks for posting those articles. I know the difference between Nepal and Tibet as well LOL I'll try to look into the history of Tibet later.

I think he is the one trying to reach a peaceful compromise, don't you?

Ask yourself this. If the Chinese occupation brought so many good things to Tibet, why are there so many refugees?

 

IF Ihihihihihihif China admits to it's abuse of human rights, stops it immediately, and tries to reverse the current socio-environmental trend towards extreme junk-capitilism THEN I might think about caring about what happened in Tibet a hundred years ago.

 

Hi I don't have time to fight here everyday. If you have time, could you please read the posts here, I don't think I can write better than this Mr. M.A.Jones.

http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?t=68073&sid=f457c4a4981a16bb7e337cd932c7edb5

He answered your questions in his posts. You can discuss about Tibet issue with him. Thanks.

 

...

 

2000-3000 Tibetans per year go cross the border to see Dalai Lama mostly for religion reasons or some for education.

Dalai Lama is the spiritual leader of "Yellow Buddhism" which is one branch of five in Tibet Buddhism. Dalai Lama is a living God and next lives' key for those Tibetans believe his Buddhism. Getting Dalai Lama's bless is those people's whole life dream. That's why they took risks to climb cross snow mountains to see him. Lots of people lost their toes during the journey. After getting Dalai Lama's bless, most of them returned to Tibet. Some chose to stay with their living God.

60% of the Tibetans went to Dalai Lama are young people. Their parents sent them there to get education in India. This is a custom in Tibet for long time. In old Tibet, upper class and nobles who could afford sent their children to India to get education.

About 80,000 Tibetans followed Dalai Lama fled to India in 1959. These Tibetans and their young generations can't get permanent resident or citizen status in India. They can't own houses or land. Their status in India is refugee. Lots of Tibetans transferred to the other countries all over the world. Those Tibetans normally are not refugees in other countries.

Dalai Lama is very important for some Tibetans spiritual life, that's the reason Chinese government had negotiated with him six times about his return to Tibet. Unfortunately, he wanted an independent Tibet and politics power or saying "middle path" actually "independent". Chinese government still open dialogue door to him if he gives up independent.

 

I seem to remember him vociferating his position on that recently, he no longer sees independance as an option. Who are the Chinese to dictate to Tibetans anyway on this issue, it is up to them to decide what they want.

 

The Tibet Human
Rights PsyOp

http://www.rense.com/general81/tibet.htm

The True Face Of
The Dalai Lama

http://www.rense.com/general81/faeeof.htm

 

Paragraph 1.

"This is a backgrounder of the struggle in Tibet and how the US has been building up Dalai Lama to pursue their ideological struggle. In the US many uninformed people had been awed by his philosophy on "peace" and "non-violence". This article will bare facts to the real color and intent of the Lama, why the US had given him a Nobel Prize and many more. - Kalovski Itim, The True Story of Maoist Revolution in Tibet, When the Dalai Lamas Ruled: Hell on Earth"

The US doesn't award the peace prize, it is decided by a committee based in Norway.

Should I bother to read on?

 

Paragraph 2.

"Tibet is one of the most remote places in the world. It is centered on a high mountain plateau deep in the heart of Asia. It is cut off from South Asia by the Himalayas, the highest mountains in the world. Countless river gorges and at least six different mountain ranges carve this region into isolated valleys. Before all the changes brought about after the Chinese revolution of 1949, there were no roads in Tibet that wheeled vehicles could travel. All travel was over winding, dangerous mountain trails by mule, by foot or by yaks which are hairy cow-like mountain animals. Trade, communications and centralized government were almost impossible to maintain."

Sounds divine, I wouldn't mind living there for a while myself, if the Chinese ever decide to fuck off and take their bullshit capitalism with them that is. I'm very much drawn to the the simple life, for spiritual gain, not economic.

Don't fancy having my eyes gouged out though, I'm pretty sure they don't do that anymore though.

 

Photos from Tibet:
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/001.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/002.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/003.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/004.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/005.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/006.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/007.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/008.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/009.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/010.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/011.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/012.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/013.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/014.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/015.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/016.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/017.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/018.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/019.jpg
http://jiujiangyuhou.diinoweb.com/files/xizang/020.jpg

More photos from Tibet:

http://bbs.jjxw.cn/dispbbs.asp?boardid=37&replyid=109790&id=26443&skin=0&page=1&star=1

Tibet is part of China. Leave Chinese alone to deal with their internal affairs.

 

Hi McLeodGanja, have you read this

http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?t=68073&sid=592d3de2ebacc4139b59a7158c1c838f

I don't think anybody can really challenge his opinions.

In some westerners mind, Chinese government is so evil that has never done good to Tibetans. Develop economic is geocide culture. No economic development is no care of Tibetans.

What Chinese government doing now is developing economic and protecting culture and religion, what Chinese government not allow is the monks to get back their political power.

In 2007, 92% Tibet financial expenditure were subsidies from Chinese central government. If no help from Chinese government, most Tibetans can't survive, productions from Tibet can't afford more than two million population.

http://www.10thnpc.org.cn/english/tibet-english/jj5.htm

 

This is all very interesting and informative Ellenz, but as I say I don't really have time to read it all. Like some of the respondents to the guy writing a text book on the matter say, I will take it all more seriously when China stops incarcerating and torturing Tibetans.... and Chinese.

About the pictures, not sure what your point is there. I don't think Tibet is any the richer for roads, or economic development. It might not have been the utopian spiritual landscape we all romanticise is to be, but it was one of the last remote places in the world untouched by modern capitalism, which is far from perfect itself.

Yes OK I am siting here writing to you on my cordless keyboard, 2GB MacBook and you are receiving it seconds later on the other side of the world, that's great. But capitalism ought to understand that it is not the be all and end all, well ok it is probably going to be the "end all" eventually. But just because anorther civilisation chooses a different political system does not justify a brutal invasion.

China should have a look at it's own record on human rights, environmental pollution, before it judges others.

 

Hi by showing the pictures just let you know, most Tibetans are living peaceful happy life and Chinese government has been working hard to help and improve their life. Tibet is still very beautiful, Chinese government didn't destroy its beauty. Tibetans are not second class citizens in China, on the contrary, they get more look after and better policies than Han people. An independent Tibet won't bring better life to most Tibetans.

Tibetans enjoy better life that modernlization can bring: tap water, electricity, roads, bridges even computers. Tibetans are human beings, they are not monkeys in the zoo for people to watch. People like watching monkeys, but they don't want to be one. If some people like original pure romantic life so much, why don't they throw away their computers and dig a cave and live in it, no tape water, no electricity, must be nice, but I doubt how long they will stay there..

In the past several decades, China has lifted millions of citizens out of poverty. I think it is the biggest improvement of human rights. Chinese government is now concentrate on pollution treatment and setting up social welfare system to give its citizens better life. During industrialisation road，Europe went through polluting then treatment too. Please give China time to solve the problem.

China is a 1.4 billion people country, managing 1/5 of world's population huge country is not an easy job. I don't think any other government can do better than Chinese government in the past three decades. No government is perfect. The human rights problem you mentioned is very few or individual cases, shouldn't cover the whole truth of China's huge human rights improvement.

 

Ellenz, I lived in a place called Omkareshwar a few years ago for 1 week. My last trip in India to one of the most remote places of India. There are no roads there, there is no electricity. I slept on the banks of the Narmada river under a Shiva moon, smoking chillums with the babas, eating chapati cooked on an open fire. I could have stayed there for a lot longer if I'd had the money and the visa.

I intend to go and live in the Himalayes somewhere for a few years before I die and live a simple life, probably somewhere in Pradesh Himachal in India.

When I stayed in Mcleodganj I met a western man who had given up everything to live there, he required no money and every winter he lived in a cave about 3,000m, completely isolated from everything. He took up bags of rice and lentils and lived like a monk for several months while the winter passed.

He didn't need computers, he didn't even need books, he had his own thoughts. He considered sex as purely necessary for procreation only.

Everyone, including and especially the Tibetan people, have the right to live like this if they choose to.

Fuck Chinese capitalism, it's human rights violations and it's irreversible destruction to the environment.

Give me a hut in the mountains of India next to a river and a crop of charas and I'll happily trade in my MacBook and my mobile phone.

 

Which of these two scenarios is the more likely to result in bloodshed.

(a) The Chinese government continues it's occupation of Tibet and carries on with it's plan to march the Olympic torch through Tibet in the face of International criticism about their human rights abuse record.

(b) They instead fuck off out of there for good, and loads of hippies from around the world go there, bringing food, music and love.

Voot now.