If our current culture were to crash

Lode- we're likely to have problems coming up with lead if this winds up being a camp most anywhere in the states, unless we're near silver ore, secondary suggestions for ammo? it doesn't have to be top of the line, simply propellable and penetrative.

 

NTH - I absolutely agree, however best to be prepared and 'not' need the preparations, than to need them and not having done them.

 

im a jack of all trades, but i hate working so id mooch off of you skillful ones.

 

Im just good at bein myself. *scuffs shoe in dirt*

 

Beck, I hope you're kidding...lol

NTH, I'm afraid my last message was a little brief, let me try again...better to have people that know what to do with a lower infrastructure than what we 'need'. As you've noticed, a lot of the skills we've been tossing around can be 'retrofitted' themselves to provide the infrastructure we're going to need 'IF' a nasty collapse happens, and if it doesn't, then having the skills means that there's less reliance on the outside world to do it for us, which is going to be a big cause of problems IF things go down the tubes.

For right now, it's an interesting mental exercise, seeing what we could all contribute.

It's why you've got teenage guys sitting around making zombie hunting manuals. This kind of 'what if' keeps us from feeling powerless, because we can say 'hey, we CAN do something'

But you have very valid points NTH, in that it's not likely to be a 'mad max' scenario.

 

The main consideration with ammo is it's mass. That's why you see that even heavier metals are preffered for a lot of military applications. (DU)

Of course DU's expensive, so it's not widely used in regular munitions. It's really the denser the better.

So um, Mercury's a substitute. I don't think any of the really good substitutes are that common.

Keep in mind. Other metals will work. They're just not nearly as dense and so won't transfer nearly as much energy.

 

Lode- exactly what i'm getting at, and as mercury in its natural state is not only hazardous to handle, but also liquid, that makes it a bit difficult.

I mean if nothing else, we could use other metals (like cast pig iron) ammo, if it gets to the point where lead's unavailable, but I understand the density being better for energy transfer, so we'd have to overbuild the barrel and breech to handle the higher propellant load to get as close as possible.

Longer barrels, overbuilt breech and barrel, probably something close to a 45 caliber, rifled barrels will be a severe pain, as if we're using anythign besides lead, it won't 'grip' properly, and will actually slow the bullet down.

 

yeah i can trap,i know how to make and use a long bow, although i have a compound so theres no need.

the reality of that is that wildlife will quickly become scarce from over hunting. you forget that after the great depression the deer and turkeys in the south had to be reintroduced.
even tree rats will become scarce if things get bad enough.


your best bet if your a meat eater is having a herd of goats.
they take little water,they will eat virtually anything,they travel well so in the event of having to be nomadic,keep the herd together wouldnt be a problem,they can even be trained to pull a wagon..

i dont guess any of yall are old enough to remember the goat man??i only saw him once at the very end of his traveling days,they say he came through this area a lot.

check it out..


http://thegoatman.com/

 

Let's see, I can garden, cook, sew, crochet, paint, lay tile, use hand tools, do yoga, and make a nice latte.

 

I like this.

I dont think I have any wild living 'skills' other than my own human instincts. I follow Artemis.

 

HHB - yeah, hunting's likely going to be impractical, depending on the circumstances, herding would be better, Also, we might need the longbow building expertise. If the compound gets damaged...

There's also the question of defense. Even if there's a 1930's style diaspora, there's going to be crime committed, most likely against those that have by those that don't.

THT-you've got a good all around set.

 

cate- not knowing's no problem, you can learn.

 

in a lot of ways, i truly agree. my medical knowledge comes from working in hospitals, and a very busy emergency room where i saw all kinds of traumas and crazy shit. it is extraordinarily fascinating to me to see just what humans are able to do with great skill when necessity demands it. even when they didn't know before. people who know nothing about the human anatomy but know exactly where to place a finger to keep someone's severed artery from bleeding out before he got to the hospital. how to deliver a baby in a speeding car going 100 down the freeway. it's amazing how humanity adapts to what they need to in order to survive and thrive, in relative comfort.

for myself though, i'm choosing to spend much more time and effort focusing on how humanity can prevent such a crash rather than planning what to do if it happens. because i feel like our energy concentration on a solution will provide a solution... though it is fun to talk about the "what if" sometimes.

 

yep, and that's what we're doing, is thinking about what we'd need to adapt, and stretching the boundaries to the 'bordering outlandish' a bit. I like the comment about 'relative comfort', because things like AC, or refrigeration, or a lot of the things we've been discussing, are relative comforts...they're things to make our life easier in the possible situations.

An ouce of prevention being worth a pound of cure - I totally agree with that, but there's also the reality that we shouldn't discount the power of stupid people in large numbers.

 

the way we see it is if it comes to having to defend yourself,we will just scavenge weapons off the dead,..
i mean dont get me wrong,we have ammo and weapons here,enough to last under normal circumstances,but like i said,if it gets that bad,we will just do whats been done in times of war for ages,scavenge the dead..

 

HHB- yep, I see nothing wrong with looting the dead, but there's also a difference between long term and short term. If we can't reload bullets, (either from a lack of lead, primers, powder or brass) firearms are going to be pretty useless once they run out of ammo, which drops us down to either hoping that we can trade for ammo (not always desirable) or building our own replacements.

 

oh and BTW, we are end of the road,nobody behind us,about a mile up the road on high ground is a couple families of boers from south africa with quite the arsenal. at the bottom of the easement road on either side a half mile away are,,well lets just say,rednecks with guns, back on the main road straight across from the boer is a retired marine colonel,,with weapons..

the point is,, i aint REAL concerned about having to defend myself,if someone gets through that gauntlet,we will have already bugged out.
we have over a 100,000 acres of forest to disappear into right behind us.
no sense in dying if ya aint got to..

thats something,map skills.. all around woodsman skills, wild edibles,how to build a shelter,how to tap a spring, etc.. indispensable..

 

HHB, not arguing with ya, man, you've got good points. Keep em coming...that's the best test of any idea is figure out how and under what circumstances you can break it.

 

dilligaf and i know you cant plan for everything,but we have pretty much set a course of action based on triggering points in the collapse.
we have 4 before we bug out.
the thing we think will work best is that as soon as you have implemented one plan you begin preparing to enter the next phase if need be.always praying ya aint gotta take that next step..
when i came off the road back in 86 i said i would never LIVE in a city or go to prison(fema camp is a prison to me). and i wont do either.

theres a lot that quite frankly i dont care to elaborate on in a public forum.. ive read rex 84,operation garden plot,directive 51, etc.

yeah,,we pretty much got a little more going than ideas here. we will survive,,till they kill us..

 

HHB, understood. I've got enough woods experience that I can (and have) vanished for periods of time, but I was mostly looking to see what skills people had to get us going on the mental exercise.

There is a serious undertone to this, though.