Imagine A Psychedelic Island Paradise

Aldousage, your explaining the exact same problems of statist societies as well. Do you trust human nature or not? Psychedelics are supposed to be about learning to trust others in a communal way. This is how aboriginal people live to a certain extent.

I think an individualist communal anarchist society with no masters can easily work over the air-conditioned anthill called consumer mercantilist capitalism.

The idea of the island is that people may not need to work more than they have to since there will be food and psychedelics growing everywhere. Coke does not have to be there since it isn't psychedelic, but there would be no rules against the freedom to cultivate as long as it was in a way free to all. After all it's impossible to eradicate alcohol from any human society since it is easy to make. Not like alcohol is far away from coke! Anyways synthetic coke is hard to make compared to just enjoying the coca plant, which would be the ideal. If people can extract cocaine from the coca plant then I don't see why they wouldn't be able to create synthetic medicines, lol. What you need a corporation for that?

But yeah, overall people need to trust human nature as well as mother nature herself with the full knowledge it can go wrong.

 

So we'd need a doctor, a nurse, a plane or helicopter, and a pilot. Exporting something would be quite helpful as well.




*thread stickied for a bit

 

This is starting to look more feasible with salmon4me's additions. With adequate transportation and medical facilities, fantasy island appears more potentially realistic. If bylaws and a system of governance were also added, I see no reason to think this imaginary society would be doomed to fail.

As for Silverbackman's thoughts on the inherent morality of humanity/human nature, I see humans as unique entities - moreso than other animals. Some people seem to be more prone to violence and adversarial behavior than do other people. This is due to a variety of causes: genetic/neurological, societal upbringing, gender/ethnicity/age imbalance, and probably much more.

A brief review of human history paints the "all humans are good at their core" theory as startlingly naive. I won't go into details regarding this history, because it might come across as an attempt to push my point with shock. Nevertheless, I'm guessing many of you can come up with an example or two in your minds.

Even if people were all nice to each other while high on psychoactives (Google "Charles Manson" for more on this), we would still have the problem of psychosis. I'm not speaking necessarily of drug-induced psychosis, just the usual, run-of-the-mill madness. In terms of specific mental illnesses, I expect narcissism would be a major problem in this sort of society.

Another problem on this island - if it were unpoliced - would be the development of factions. Every first year psychology student (and every observant student of life) knows that such grouping, often based on an initial, minor dispute, is extremely common within a microcosmic society. This generally leads to suspicion and hatred.

Done cautiously and intelligently, this proposed home could truly be a paradise like none before it. Thrown together haphhazardly and with a faith that all people are always kind, loving and unselfish, and it would be the setting for an incredibly disturbing psycho thriller.

Peacelove,
Aldousage

 

Hey man I'm trying to get my business off the ground, if anyone helps me I'll give them fair share. Its over the internet so you can help from anywhere you have sed internet. I think of it like a tumbleweed, at first its stuck in the ground, but when it matures its big enough so that the wind can carry it far away, hopefully close to a beach. What we don't need are nay-sayers, pullin us down, when we could be rolling on the beach. I say the whole is more than its parts and two people can feed four. Now who wants a thread and who wants an island?:cheers2:

 

Aldousage, I understand what your saying. Such a project should never be taken lightly and yes we need to remember that human nature can go wrong. Ultimately though, humans do bad things because of their situation. Yeah it depends on all the physiological and psychological factors you pointed out, I'de argue that there is even more to it than that. People can do horrible things when they have power. Just read about the Stanford Prison Experiment. Or the slavery in the South. Or any nazi/fascist or stalinist/communist dictatorship. Jim Jone's experiment with a communal town went to shit because he had tii much and commanded the respect of everyone in the group, and he himself had a drug problem with speed.

The problem lies with power most of all I think. As long as everyone in this communal psychedelic paradise don't have any power over anyone else.....in other words as long as individualism is upheld as a primary attribute of this communal society things will last.

I'de like to have no police on the island.....what we can do is have a general agreement among people that the rights of each individual shall be respected. Anyone who violates these rights should be kicked off the island quickly. Who will enforce these measures if someone violates the golden rules of anarchism? The people will.....no centralized authority should exist.

Who knows as time goes on we can establish a voluntary spontaneous order just like what Proudhon suggested. Like certain people can be in charge of certain drugs......for example we can have an entire group dedicated to cultivating shrooms for the group and helping anyone through whoever partakes in it. Another can grow the cannabis that will be used for food, clothing, house-making, fuel, even cars, highs of course, and a whole bunch of other things. Others can be tasked with normal food production......like apple trees and such. Fruits mainly, though I guess we could permit meat production as long as the animals are killed in humane ways.....not killed in a filthy slaughterhouse like with current meat corporations. And we can derive grain foods from cannabis, since cannabis doesn't destroy the soil it is planted into like many other cereal crops.

See we can have different sectors of this island all sharing and caring, but there cannot be an absolute leader to lead everything. Even each sector of the island......whether it be pot sector, the shrooms sector, the sassafras tree sector for mdma production if we so choose (remember even xtc is derived from natural chemicals)....the members of each of these sectors must all be equal. No bosses or masters, all decisions should be made in a consensual democratic way.

And of course we can have the normal services like a hospital, fire protection, ect. It'll be kinda like Nauru (the smallest independent country in the world), but much more chiller and free. The services will after all be free to all.

This idea can happen if we can find an island. Either find one, make one, or buy one.....all of which will involve the team work and finances of everyone involved.

Great suggestions salmon4me.

 

ummm, I think we need you in the brains sector... cheers.

 

Region Philippines, Asia
Price US $600,000
Status for sale
Size 38 acres
Location 20 minutes from the airport

Hen and Chick Islands, Philippines
Hen Island is 20 minutes from the airport and a 10 minute boat ride to the island. It is ideal for retirement or an island community village. Hen island is fully titled with town electricity. There is electrical wiring from the mainland about 1.5 kilometres away from the island.

From Hen Island, there are amazing mountain views with interesting rock formations. The island is relatively flat and surrounded by several beach coves. This island is located near the surfing capital of the Philippines. Presently, the island is used as a coconut plantation; there are thousands of coconuts on the island. There are fresh water creeks criss crossing the island.

The seller of Hen Island is giving away a 6.4 hectare, small, flat island called Chick Island. Chick island is a 15 minute boat ride from Hen Island. It is composed of a wide white sand beachfront.

http://www.privateislandsonline.com/henandchickislands.htm

 

Region Philippines, Asia
Price US $600,000
Status for sale
Size 30 acres
Location Guimaras Province, Iloilo
Apollo Island, Philippines
Apollo Island lies along the coast of Guimaras Province, Iloilo, Philippines. It has a fantastic white sand shore on all sides of the island with rich coral undergrowth.

The nearest seaport is 45 minutes away. The hill on the eastern side provides very good protection from the occasionally strong winds. The elevation also provides a great view of Negros and Panay Island.

http://www.privateislandsonline.com/apolloisland.htm

 

Region Argentina, South America
Price US $600,000
Status for sale
Size 2,255 acres
Location Rio Uruguay, Entre Rios Province
French Island, Argentina
French Island is a beautiful large private island located on the Rio Uruguay in the province of “Entre Rios”, Argentina. The property’s 2255 extensive acres in a populated and very pretty area make it a wonderful opportunity for tourism development or a ranching and agricultural venture.

Spectacular unspoiled nature surrounds you on French Island, with willow-treed woodlands, flat prairie, and a large 60-acre lagoon. You’ll find an abundance of wildlife including red deer, capybara, and otters, and the surrounding river teems with many varieties of fish and eels.

Located in a rich and fertile delta close to one of the world’s prime water resources, the Guaranì River basin, many types of ranching, farming and silviculture are possible. The Argentine government is actively seeking new investment and development in this region, and permitting is not expected to be difficult to obtain.

Some potential uses for the island are:

Tourism: Exceptional natural beauty, proximity (55 miles) to Buenos Aires and excellent fishing make French Island a perfect location for a hunting/fishing lodge or other tourism development. Capybara, red deer and other native species could be hunted for sport.

Ranching: Several types of cattle species such as the Bradfor would be perfectly adapted to the island’s natural flora and climate, and the unusually large size of the island provides ample pasture ground. High grasses, rushes, reeds, wetland tubers and other feed sources are readily available. Other possibilities include the raising of buffalo, marsh deer, and capybara.

Silviculture: The Argentine government offers tax credits and other subsidies to “green” industries that offset pollution, such as the growing of trees for paper and other uses. This production results in “Green Bonuses”, bonds which are traded and purchased by polluting industries to offset their carbon dioxide emissions. Species such as the Alamo tree have excellent, fast yields and would be particularly suitable.

There is currently one small and dilapidated house on the property, but it will need extensive renovations prior to use. There is not currently electricity on the island, which will need to be obtained from the nearest town of New Palmira, but cellular reception is excellent.

http://www.privateislandsonline.com/french-island-argentina.htm

 

Silverbackman, you make some intelligent points. More and more, I'm seeing that this might be an acheivable dream.

salmon4me, I think you really, REALLY ought to go with an island in international waters. The Philippines and Argentinian governments could and would surveil the island. If they witnessed activities which are illegal in their nations, there would be problems - very expensive problems with which the authorities of both countries would be entirely familiar.

Of course, in international waters, piracy would still be a very serious risk. The Southeast Asian Pacific in particular is swarming with modern pirates who would be absolutely delighted to learn about a community of pacifists producing salable contraband.

Please don't think of me as a naysayer. I very much like the intentions behind this idea, I'm just recommending extreme caution and a consideration of as many potential details/eventualities as possible.

Peacelove,
Aldousage

 

ok I take it back, ur not a ney-sayer, someone please look up my post in the business forums, im serious about going all in on this venture. peace

 

Sounds good to me!

 

hey my site is finally up, if you want to help me advertise contact me, ill pay on comission the site is http://charityelectronics.com and a dollar from every sale goes to aid rebilding of parts of the former yugoslavia, i.e. bosnia and croatia, bok, -jerod p.s. i am not trying to spam like i said im serious about getting this going.

 

What a fantastic place it would be, I would definitely visit there. If we are thinking of it realistically, we would need certain things to protect ourselves. Any sort of defense only weapon would be ideal, like mines in the waters around the island to make sure pirates could not get within distance to do any damage. We would also need to be very, very careful about making sure people don't leave the island with drugs, because if there are numerous instances of people smuggling drugs from our little fantasy island, a large country such as the U.S. or the U.K. might invade or something similar to stop the influx of those "terrible" substances from our island into their countries. So stupid why a lot of drugs are illegal, but that's for another post...

The Mushroom Man

 

International waters sounds good. We can handle the pirates with enough warm bodies and the right equipment.

 

the resources could be defended in a less militant manner. Plant dummy crops of psychedelics that are mildly poisonous unless correctly activated by trained workers. The Rio land sounds like it might be a good spot, self substainable agriculture is a big bonus. As a lazy american it might take some getting used to but it might just be worth converting to that lifestyle. whats the climate like there?

 

Modern pirates are known for taking slaves/raping/killing during raids, so you'll need to make some dummy dummies too.

Pacifism + communal life on an island in international waters = piles of dead pacifists/horribly-beaten sex slaves. The community would have to be fairly militaristic and strict to stand a chance against outside aggression and even internal rebellion.

Additionally, there would be VERY little time for leisure with such a life style UNLESS there is a fascistic system of governance, in which case the people in charge could relax as the underlings worked (for reasons of ethics and personal philosophy, I speak against such governance). If the workload were shared approximately equally, it's not likely anyone could have more than a day or two off per year.

Think of food production/water treatment, waste management, medical/chemistry needs, natural disaster response, childcare/education, a system of law and law enforcement (to deal with disputes/rule-breaking), a system of defense from off-island aggressors, an electoral system (if the island is to be run democratically), on and off-island transportation facilities (general, and for the disabled and elderly), tool and machine repair and maintenance.

Each of these needs (and many others) would require a committee, workers and someone in charge. There would also need to be a system and committee to determine and regulate who does what job (there just might be arguments regarding certain duties, for example several people might prefer sewing or wood chopping over human waste management).

Again, I'm not saying it's an impossible dream. I'm only pointing out that the fantasy would not be all fun. It will be mostly difficult and constant work. Read a non-fiction book on pre-civilised life on Earth for more info (NOT the life of royalty/the aristocracy).

"Never give up your dreams, but remember to awaken and rub your eyes before taking action"

Peacelove,
Aldousage

 

LOL. More than half that crap is not needed. Comittee free island for starters.

And that being said, your estimation on days worked is laughably pessimistic.

 

Again, it's a fun little fantasy. Perhaps I AM adding more realism than is comfortable. Please ignore my reason-based pessimism and continue dreaming of a lawless, structureless society that would not - within weeks - collapse in upon itself.

Hell, it worked for Gilligan, and HE'S so famous he's on TV!
(just make sure you have a professor and lots of coconuts)

:cheers2:

 

fuckin awsome!