It is never ok to kill someone just because they may cause you emotional and psychological pain. The baby is innocent. Doesn't the baby have rights? How would you like it if you were a product of rape and your mother said, 'well I just can't bear to look at you, so I'm going to terminate this pregnancy.' You would not exist. Would you deserve that? Wouldn't you have wanted someone to fight for your life? Whether or not life begins at conception, we all came out of somebody's womb. Life begins somewhere in there, any one who doesn't realize that is ignorant. It's selfish to choose death because it makes you feel better when life is also a choice.
It is selfish to force someone to chose life in a situation such as rape because YOU feel it's right. I have lived poor, I don't want the responcibility of paying for someones kid that they don't want or tend to, because YOU wouldn't allow them an abortion
Adoption is a great alternative, Jack. If you don't want the responsibility then don't adopt. But there are plenty of people that would like to adopt that could take care of the kid. If someone will take the kid, why not let them? I'm surprised you feel so strongly on this, I'm assuming you're not a woman.
I have another point, but most pro-choice people probably wouldn't look at it this way. Does the woman impregnated by rape also have the right to kill her rapist? I'm sure that would make her feel better and is the more deserving target here. My point is if that's not right why is the abortion right? Does the baby DESERVE to die?
That's like comparing Apples and Oranges. I am going to not even continue this though, it's not going to get any where... but it's not a baby, it's not like your killing a human (what seperates a human from animals? Emotions, abilty to laugh, critical thinking my point is, an enbrio (sp?) does not have any of that, thus it's not even a baby yet, basicaly it's the same as a chicken egg cept you would never dare eat it.
Then, no offense, you are uneducated about the subject. Have you ever seen what an embryo looks like at the ages the law allows them to be aborted? WHEN exactly does it become a baby? I'd like to show y'all, but you may find the pictures offensive.
Ok, this post is going to piss a lot of people off, but it's meant to be educational, not judgmental. A lot of women that have abortions are not told this, or shown this. What they are told is that it isn't a baby, it's just a blob. The key question then is when does it become a baby? I'm not tackling that one. There are a lot of opinions on that, I'm just going to show you some pictures and you make your own conclusions. Newborn baby, normal 9 month gestation [/IMG] This is Kimberly, she was born very premature at only 25 weeks gestation [/IMG] [/IMG] This is Kimberly at 6 months [/IMG] Next post are the bad pics.
This preemie was born at 21 and a half weeks [/IMG] Y'all have a right to know what abortion is like, but you may not want to look at this. Your choice. This is an aborted fetus, just a few days younger than the living preemie above. He was 21 weeks. [/IMG] This is a 15 week fetus in the womb [/IMG] This is an 11 week aborted fetus [/IMG]
I don't know how old this one was, but he must have been pretty far long. I don't think abortion at this age is typical, but certainly has happened. [/IMG] Abortion at 7 weeks [/IMG] Saline abortion at 19 weeks. This is an old picture of an old procedure. [/IMG] This is a late term partial-birth abortion. The fetus was 7 months. [/IMG] Take these pics however you will. "By the end of the second month of pregnancy, the fetus has a vertebral column, a bony jaw, clavicle, and palate, a cranium, ribcage, femur, tibia, forearms that can be distinguished from arms, and thighs that can be distinguished from legs, a developing nervous sytem, sympathetic nerves (meaning the fetus can feel pain), a closed circulatory system and a working heart, eyes, developing ears and nose, lungs, arms and forearms, legs and thighs, hands and feet, a pancreas, a bladder, kidneys, a tongue, a larynx, a thyroid, germs of teeth, and developing muscles." Source: bellsouthpwp.net/.../marybrown/8wkfetus.htm
I guess no one wants to look at it. It's the same thing with "conservatives" and war. You're OK killing unless you have to see the bloody corpse. And my grey area is open enough to know that people have the right to make their own decisions, but they have the responsibility to understand the consequences of what they do. Everyone makes mistakes, that's true, but you can't ignore the fact that something is dying when you have an abortion. If you can acknowledge what happens and still do it, then I think that's absolutely fine.
You make a good point. I'm totally against war unless you have a damn good reason. This war is fucked up. We shouldn't be there. But the war between the colonies and England was for freedom. That kind of war is justified, because someone else picked the fight and it's necessary. We may have to have that kind of war again. You do have to realize you're killing someone's kid though.
Damn, Therese, thanks for that. Seriously, no sarcasm. Thanks. That was disgusting. But I think I still agree with Jack. I don't think Jack has said anything incorrect. Society is better off if these embryos are aborted. Even though the babies are innocent most of them are going to grow up sucking off the public tit. (That sounded SO republican. Ohh well.) These babies are going to be on Welfare, drugs and the wrong side of the law when they grow up. Fair? It's not fair to the babies? It's not fair to me to have to be the one on the wrong end of a knife when one of these babies grows up to rob me on the underground. Fair? No it's not fair to the woman to have to let the thing gestate inside her. I haven't been pregnant, being that that is a biological impossibility, but supposedly, IT SUCKS!!!!!! If I were a girl, if I were going to be pregnant I would want my baby daddy to be the man that sleeps in bed with me at night. Nobody stands up for the rights of the baby, but a woman has rights to. Forcing her to gestate a baby that was illegally put inside of her is cruel and inhuman. An post rape abortion should be a state funded operation with no deductible and no insurance necessary.
It should be 100% up to a woman, if she wants to get an abortion that is her choice... You can't be a fucker and say "NO! You have to have this baby no matter what!" I say fuck you, she has the power, no man can make her decision.
It was for freedom of not paying taxes. Although I'm glad we fought, the only reason we got pissy was cuz after 200 years of no taxes England needed money badly and decided to tax. We just got mad and pulled away, it was like a kid that never did chores, then turned 13 and his dad said to mop the floor. we just left home really, and here we are... Paying taxes.
My point was that maybe the kid has a say. . . Wouldn't you want a say in whether you live or die? And who's to say they'd grow up useless? The only difference between aborted babies and those that grew up is that somebody decided which one gets to grow up and which one doesn't. Each and every one of you could have been aborted, but you weren't. Are you useless? Are you going to rob someone or suck off society's tit? Or are you automatically perfect because you got picked to be part of society? And if you aren't perfect, maybe you shouldn't be allowed to live either. Is that what you're saying? Aren't you glad you have the opportunity to prove your worth to society instead of someone writing you off and deciding for you that you're worthless? Where's the freedom of choice in that? And since when is one person's rights more valuable than another's? Should I sacrifice a right so you can indulge in one, or should you sacrifice a right so I can indulge in one? Rights are supposed to co-exist. Rights in general are not supposed to ever be infringed, not just the rights of one group of people, aka women. So for you to say that it is absolutely wrong to take away her right is hypocritical, because if it's wrong to take away her rights, it's wrong to take away ANYONE'S rights. It should never be a necessary sacrifice. But never mind. What does the right thing matter? It's only what people want that matters anymore, no matter what the consequences.
i didn't vote because i don't like any of the options. i could never abort, if i got pregnant, whether it was planned or unplanned. i want children in my life too badly for that, and the instant i conceive, i will have a child in my mind. but that is just me. i am pro choice, because i don't think anyone can make decisions for another person, much less the damn government. abortion is such an emotional issue... and i hate looking at the pictures of the aborted fetuses... and i've seen them in real life (well, not aborted, but miscarried) and it's very sad. but i also believe that souls aren't tied to a body. if a pregnancy is terminated, i believe that soul just leaves the little body it was in, and waits for a better chance to come back here... someplace it will be welcome and loved, hopefully. but the thing is, i believe all souls choose the situations they are born into, before the even incarnate here on earth. so in a way, they know what they're getting into. they choose it. so how can i say that it's wrong for someone to have an abortion, when it was a situation agreed upon by all the souls involved, far before they ever incarnated here? i think it's a very personal matter. each woman should be allowed to decide for herself. personally, i could never do it, but i can't tell anyone else it's wrong. it's only wrong for me.
Personally, for emotional reasons, I don't think I'd be able to have an abortion. But i definately think that it's not up to the government and up to the individuals involved.
I'm not going to say much right now, cause I am quite drunk, and I tend to ramble when drunk. So I will try and keep it short. Death sucks, admitted. Now, go read Dickens. A life like that REALLY sucks!! Of course, our society is no where near as bad, for an orphan, as it was when Dickens wrote Oliver Twist and Nicholas Nickelby, but the point is still the same. If a mother cannot support her child, the child will be put into foster care. He will bounce from one home to the other, never having a stable loving home. The child may be subjected to abusive parents. Parents that may abuse drugs. Parents that may drink too much (Did I mention that I'm drunk right now. Let's hope that the condom didn't break last weekend when I got laid, cause believe me, I can't take care of a kid. That kid will be aborted, straight away.) Isn't all that more painful than just not existing in the first place? What percentage of children come out of the foster care system complete failures or Criminials? 60%? 70%? 80%? I'm not saying all the fetuses should be aborted, but I am saying that if there weren't SO MANY, then the foster care system could take care of the kids that are there, and reduce the SUFFERING of the children that are born, as well as the criminal activity of the kids that fall through the cracks and the SUFFERING of their victims. Nobody wants to kill a baby, but nobody wants a baby to suffer years of poverty and neglect, either. What did I say about rambling when I'm drunk. I'll shut up now.
