native americans back in the day went to hell?

native americans went to hell back in the days b4 settlers come ova or what?

 

No, not necessarily.
Depends on whether or not they responded to the light they were given.

Oddly, Native Americans are always used in this line of questioning.
Im guessing its to elicit some sort of sypathetic backlash at Christianity?

The ONLY people who will ever go to Hell will be people who deliberately chose to do so.
This is biblical.

 

ah, just wonder what the response is. I do not crash or look down on Christianity, I just believe what I believe. I write my own religion.

 

The law of God is written upon the hearts of all man kind. Alot of people that never heard the name of Jesus will be in heaven because they lived up to the light they were given. The Iriquous(spelling anyone) have a a legend about a virgin giving birth to a spritual leader. This legend exixted before the coming of the white man.

 

Wtf?

If your gods message is written in men's hearts then what was the point of salvation?

Why spread the gospel if it's not needed?

Either they needed jesus or they didn't, you cant have it both ways.

And not just the native americans, what about the pagans of the world who lived and died before jesus came to the scene?

 

they had their own gods and worshipped what the believed in. nothing wrong with that. so did the romans, greeks, egyptians, mesopotamians, and a bunch o other ancient cultures. it doesnt mean its wrong, and i dont really believe in hell.

 

Its kinda hard to go to hell whenyou have no concept of it

 

and there are people like that. it is their interpertation of God. but it does not agree with our society, which is why there's lethal injection.

 

Let me ask you the same question. Is your God true, right? It all boils down to interpertation. I am a firm believer in God, but I see him more as a spirit. Not as Jesus and all of this jazz you make him out to be.

The true God is the individuals interpertation. Religions are groups that interpert him in the same way. That does not make them right or the only true religion.

 

Jesus was a person. He was not God. People are simply led to believe this.

 

I understand all your questions moreso than you probably think. My whole life has been a wrestling match of my mind, and most of the thoughts all center around philosophy of life and religion. Everybody wants to know who they are and why we're here, what our purpose is, and we want explanations of life.... how, why. Supernatural? Natural? God? No God? shit, i've questioned for years and years. From what I read of your posts on here, Ive been on the same level of thinking.... question everything, question reality. Am I God, I dunno. Are you? I dunno. I just decided it's a vicious cycle and eventually just had to sit down and decide what I do believe. cop out? .... maybe so, i dont know.

 

no one has an answer for me?

 

hippies are a counterculture group, first coming together as a group in the 60's, mostly in protest to Vietnam. This was just the beginning. Eventually it eventually evolved into a true way of life.... hippiedom ..... to some it's a religion, others maintain a separate view on the God/no God subject. As times have changed so has the term, new importances added, priorities moved in front of others. Hippiedom simply put is a culture of progressives looking to steer the world in another direction from the materialized, self destructive, violent-filled, capitalism based path that the planets well down the path of. There is no one thing that makes someone a hippie, definetly not, anymore especially, having anything to do with dress. All hippies agree with certain beliefs such as pacifism (belief that conflicts should be resolved without the use of violence on any level). Lifestyles vary greatly. Some work. Some roam, seem by most as "homeless". There are many subcultures, or "optional beliefs" if you will such as: many believe the accomplishment of mind expansion through drugs, particulary psychadelics is a very important step for humanity to take in order for progressive steps to be taken as a world culture. The word itself means nothing, it's basically just an term that non-hippies gave to this counter-culture who seem to question everything and not conform to anything. Most believe that life should be lived simply & a many agree with & live the basics of Native American culture.

This is only a small explanation and personally I don't think hippiedom is anything that could ever be fully described, only experienced.

About myself and religion, I don't know what you would like me to tell you, my view I guess? Well, I don't really know what my views are is the truth. Many times I think I know what I believe, only to find myself waking up the next day second-guessing & of course I don't claim to believe anything unless I truly can say I believe in it full out..... which as of now, I don't believe in any one thing as my religion. I do believe life is a transfer of energy and all energy brought into your life through ways of food, surroundings, the clothes you buy, etc only bring into your life the energy passed through it. i.e. ~ clothes made in a sweat shop in India by children paid only enough money that they would have to work a month to save enough money to buy just only 1 shirt they make would bring nothing but shit to whoever buys this shirt and supports the kind of capitalistic based ideas in this. I believe in the supernatural no doubt, experience it daily. I don't believe that humans should eat meat just because they want to eat another living thing ...... we certainly don't need to. I don't believe or support capitalism as much as I possibly can; no, im not perfect. Im definetly all for environmental preservation in virtually every way. I'm for the bettering of the world. I live my life through hippiedom. I am one of those that believe the use of drugs is an undeniable massive exchange of energy & if used properly are a way to bring much positive energy into yourself. Lastly I care to type right now is that I do believe that psychs, particulary LSD is a window to your soul and, if used correctly, can move one's entire existance to other dimensions of life and can bless a person with a higher level of intelligence.
tell me what you believe, if I may.

 

Hey Shane.

I know in the Catholic Church we beleive if those people were good people, and there were a TON of them, they would go to Purgatory (a purification place taught only in the Catholic Church, possibly some Orthodox ones?, which is biblical btw) and when the death of Christ came, all the souls in Purgatory went to heaven This is why I love being Catholic, everything just makes so much sense and it's quite logical if you study it. MANY PROTESTANTS would argue since they did not "recieve the grace" of Christ, they are basically fucked, but that's foolsih, you can't hold people 100's and 1000's of years before the birth/death of Christ responsible for that.

 

Both are true because neither can be disproven.

The verification of Jesus Christ as the son of god is not empirically possible -it cannot be proven- so it does not fall within the realm of objective Truth (i.e. gravity), which is where your argument wants to classify it.

Placing religion on the level of objective Truth has been/is likely the greatest cause of conflict for humanity.

Jesus is not here for his miracles to be directly -externally- observed and verified. The miracles of Jesus instead reside within hearts and minds, and thus can only be verified on a personal, individual, level.

Some people feel touched by the words of Jesus. For these people, Jesus is a representation of god, because their perception of Jesus incites a harmonic resonation deep within. Jesus is a guiding light.

There are also people who recognize that they are able to be spiritually moved by the words of more than one author; and perhaps also by their favorite trail through the mountains, a plethora of stars on a clear night, the look of wonder in a child's eye, or even just the existence of themselves and the world around them. Representation of god can be seen in all things, especially the fact that people have established different means to the same end with religion. Religion is our attempt to grasp and understand god, only problem is, it manifests into different forms through separate societies, oft tainted by politics on the way.

But doesn't he demonstrate his own point? People interpret truth differently, as he has done for himself.

Because the basis of some truths can be emperically verified, like gravity, and others, like religion, cannot.

 

oh my goodness

 

With Karl's talk of what is your religion then and of "writing your own religion" i think this would be a good place to display my thoughts on the subject and about how i am spiritually connected with God.

There is one true God, whethere the name be by God, Allah, or Vishnu etc...He (although He is formless, but its good for explaining) is an energy, He set into motion all of the things explained by science (initiated the Big Bang, set the conditions for life to form on Earth). He has also sent down teachers of God. Also, to give us (all living things) souls He took energy from himself, and gave it to us (energy can neither be created or destroyed). Since all the teachers are teaching the same God, the reavealed religions are all true religions..The teachers are also reincarnations of the same soul (this accounts for the searation in the revealing of themselves). Also even though some people are Athiest's exist, they still so to heaven (or whatever type of salvation/enlightenment/next stage in life path) because they have a soul from God, just a lower amount (this does not mean that they are bad or have less of a soul, just less of God's energy in it). Because all living things have souls, everyting is connected to God so everything is severing God just by existing....Thats basically the jist of it anywho...and i know it is similar to Bahai, but i don't beleive in him as a teacher...

and for beleiving all this, my friend (who is an athiest, and we have many christian frends) calls me a cultist...


but anyway...BACK ON WITH THE DISCUSSION! and no they did not go to hell

 

I would dispute that purgatory is a biblical concept, but that's another matter.

The Bible teaches that salvation is always by grace through faith; it can't be earned. It also teaches that all people have received sufficient revelation through creation and conscience to (1) believe in God and (2) recognize their need for his forgiveness. Therefore, I believe that it is possible for people to be saved who've never heard of Jesus, but I also think that it's highly unlikely. Given that so many people who hear the gospel reject it, I have no reason to believe that they're any more receptive to general revelation. Conversely, I think anyone who is receptive to general revelation will also respond positively to the gospel (Jn. 6:45).

 

If it is so unlikely for a person who hasn't heard of jesus to ask for forgiveness, what happened/happens to those pagans that didn't know of a plan for salvation?

 

Well, not having the apocrypha in your bible does not help your study of it, but anyway....

Okay, but these people cannot be held responsible if they lived 1000's of years before Christ. I mean what about Jews before Christ? By that theory they could all be damned as well. In my opinion and the Church's we don't think a loving God would damn innocent, good people to hell just becasue they were born prior to Christ.