Starting MS Cotin - advice needed.

Im not too sure, I've never tried that. I imagine it would lessen the time release but not by much.

 

Plus, if a small majority says it is not that strong, it seems that most that have pain think it does - similary, one would think that since I am a visit away, that 90mg, or something at a time should work, since he wrote it for 6 per day, theoretically, that could be 90mg every 8 hours. Surely that has to be a bit stronger and longer lasting if taking correctly, than the fast acting, fast exiting PRN Hydro. 30mg

 

Well you said and a few others (different boards) said it worked for you - so that's faith enough for me - otherwise, not sure what to ask for.

Will be picking up in one more hour.

GOTTA HAVE FAITH ITS GOING TO WORK.
Thank you God - just believing it will. Want to make sure like you said, give it time as it might not be as fast - worried that I wasn't titrated with fast acting first to see what level I should be taking - this means you are giving a fast dosing then adjust to MS Cotin accordingly. Guess I will have to figure out. #180 pills should be enough to get me through the weekend. LOL. Just kidding. I mean until I figure it out.

 

Hmmmm,

Well I just took the 3rd one - the label says 30 mg, 2-3 tabs every 12 hours - not sure if it's working that well yet - can still feel knot in back - interesting.

Just read that someone said .5 mg of hydro is = 7.5 mg of MS Contin (or MS generic), can that really be true?

Thanks.

Started at 3:39pm, now 5:30PM. At first, I thought right after I took the second one, I started to feel the first and made myself vomit to little success as I was stressed I took too much (2 x 30mg), then an hour later I could still feel the pain in back - - so...

1 x 30mg, then a second almost 1 hour later, then half vomit (not sure if any came up as I hardly exceeded), now the 3rd as prescribed.

Hmmmmmmmm.

 

Now I read 30 mg of Hydro = 45 mg of Morphine Sulfate - geesh, hard to figure out.

Feel a little slow though - pain starting to dull a bit -

2 hours before working though? WHAT?
Maybe I should chew them - then drive to doctors on Monday and say, okay, looks like I need to fill my 15/200 compound (need 3 at a time for 45 mg) and see if he suggests anything else.

While it might seem recreational - its not, the lump in the lower back stinks - very painful, not so bad now.... 60mg ~1.3 hours ago, took two more 10 minutes ago - -seeing how I had 10mg or 100mg of dialudid a few months ago, not to worried that the bottle says 2-3 every 12 hours and I took one extra.

Also read it may take 2-3 days to adjust - any truth to that?
Seem a little slow - that won't work - as I need to work - hello? Geesh.

What to ask for and tell him while waiting for blood work to come back?

Thanks

 

FWIW, having a prescription for #120 15/200 mg hydro with two (2) refills and him knowing that it's probably not that good for liver (very long term) I'm wondering if he will suggest something else. He did say if it didn't appear to work that it could be a tolerance problem - but knows I suffer from REAL pain though -

If it doesn't work out in a few days after adjusting - is there something else to ask for or leave it to him to offer? I say the latter and drop the I need to fill my old #120 15/200 Hydro's.? ? Thoughts?

Seems to be getting better (pain)...long time to get here though -

 

So it's been 3.5 hours and had to take 4 and can still feel the knot. It's dull but know it's there - with the Hydro it does NOT seem to be there -

Suggestions?
What is wrong with me - Am hoping it's something metabolic and/or that in a few days, my body adjusts - next time, will take as prescribed, 3 per 12 hours.

Suggestions?

 

Nothing is wrong....Morphine really just doesn't work for some people. The bioavailability is realllyyyy low, so you might be taking a 30mg pill, and really only end up getting about 10mg worth of effects. Like said before, it doesn't metabolize very well at all.

If 40mg of Hydro worked for you, you definitely should have felt something off that dose of Morphine that you took, 40mg of Hydro is NOTHING...I can't even believe someone in that much pain could survive on 40mg of Hydro.

Try and get Oxycodone, that is my best advice.

 

Geesh, well I have a few options. First, I was happy I got the MS Cotin as I feel I have a doctor that understands.

Mid week, I can pick up the 15mg/200 Hydro and take 4 (60mg Hydro) or so, every 4-6 hours - he tends to think this is too much, so, yesterday, I had a total of 7-8 30mg morphine and sure enough, I could still feel the back pain, PLUS, I felt pain in places I never have felt.

Plus, and here is the WORSE part, a few months ago I was in the hospital due to what they thought was gastritis - very painful and was vomitting plus need dialudid to make the pain go away. Last night, after taking the MS Cotin, I experienced 60% of that pain and the only thing I had going for me was knowing that it would pass - whereas the first time (last night was my 3rd time), I had no idea what was going on.

Therefore, there is no way I can stay on this it causes me to feel my back pain in places I never felt it - It made me experience EXTREME sharp shooting KNIFE stomach pains and did not work 50% of what the 40-60mg of Hydro would do when I take those every 4-6 hours.

So, is there something else, one pill, hopefully, that is not to expensive (don't care if it is, but asking), as well, my brother let me try some of his Oxycodone (what is the difference between Oxycodone and Oxycotin) as I had tried several of his (must have been weak) as they were like taking asprin.

What do I tell my pain doctor - part of him said if the MS Cotin didn't work could be due to my tolerance of Hydro - but it can't be abuse - and hope he doesn't think that - it's real pain - not sure what to tell him, plus the fact that in the AM, it doesn't work NEARLY as quick as the HYDRO did in the AM and I won't be able to work.

He did say he was concerned and was running some tests - -white cells a bit off, lost gall bladder as child, new KNEE pain, back pain, gastritis a few months ago.

I don't want to give him the impression - hey, the morphine didn't work so what else ya got = but at the same time, I do need to feel as though I can function and surely there must be something safer than 4-5 norcos (way to much tylenol), or 4+ compounds (15mg x 4+ hydro) and something that is stronger than my brothers OXYCODONE (not cotin) as I had to take several off these and it was like taking asprin.

Everyone's advice here has been very helpful - - I am sure he doesn't want me on the Hydro's so need to figure out what to tell him and how and what strength I probably need - as what did work was COMPOUND HYDRO 15mg, x 3 or 4 - 45-60mg every 4 hours. 140mg a day, maybe a bit more. Could it be my brothers strength was too weak?

Advice needed on the max my doc can prescribe - and seeing how he thinks there might be something else going on - and I am in pain, if it doesn't work (MS Cotin), it doesn't work (7+ yesterday) plus = extreme stomach pain.

Please advise on what you think I need to ask for or look into - of course, if its something other than back pain (I pray it isn't), then am sure will get whatever, but just want to function as a human and get my life back..

Also prescribed Neurotin - just took one today so NOT cause of stomach pain.

Advice on what to tell doctor without looking like a crazy person appreciated - -
Thanks

 

Well, first of all, 5 norcos is not that much. Most people I know are on 10 norcos a day, which is the maximum amount of APAP one should consume in a day almost. 4000 is what is listed as the maximum amount of tylenol you should take in a 24 hour period. 5 norcos isn't even 2000mg, so don't worry about that too much.

Oxycodone is about 1 and a half times stronger then Hydrocodone, so I am guessing your brother probably had 5mg Percocets. In which case you would need probably 6 or 7 of those to equal to the 60mg of Hydrocodone you take. Trust me, Oxycodone is much stronger, and MUCH better at relieving pain. I am in pain management, and I have been through them all.

Oxycontin = Time released Oxycodone, no other ingredients. Releases slowly over the course of 12 hours, but it's more like 8 hours to be honest.

Percocet = Oxycodone with APAP

Roxicodone = Instant release Oxycodone, no other ingredients. Goes up to 30mg. (This is what I am prescribed to)

The only advice I can give is just to be honest. He obviously trusts you, just tell him what is wrong. The morphine isn't working, you don't want to continue taking Hydrocodone because it is always compounded with another thing like Tylenol (which is the only way that Hydrocodone is a schedule 3) ,and that hurts your stomach. So just ask him if there is something else that he can offer that doesn't have any Tylenol.

To be honest, if you are in pain management, you should be on a long-acting (like morphine, or oxycontin) ALONG WITH a breakthrough med (like Norco/Vicodin/Roxicodone/Percocet) to truly manage your pain.

The long acting works well for managing your pain throughout the day so you don't have to pop pill after pill, and then you use the breakthrough when you need to.

 

I agree with u4ia, get off the ms contin, its obviously not working. ALso, 15 mg hydrocodones, I had no idea they had these thats crazy. Anyways, it seems like you have real legit pain, and your doctor trusts you, so you should be glad about that. Tell him you'd like to keep the norcos for breakthrough pain since they kick in faster and harder ( for stuff like waking up in the morning, and when the pain becomes more severe) but you should also be on some type of dose of long acting opiates. I think the best 2 options for you would be 20-40 oxycontin x2 a day, or a fentanyl patch, one of the lower doses, fent last 72 hours, so you only have to put a patch on every 3 days. One thing for sure is that you need to stay on the norcos, they obviously work for you, so stick with them, and try finding a good long lasting opiate. Or maybe try chewing the ms contin that way it kicks in faster. Good luck.

 

Try plugging the Morphine, also.

 

EDIT: I just read the other posts and realized that Relayer and several others have already made this point, but please, Composer: get your doc to give you both an ER and an IR (PRN) medication. That is what you need, and if you are still in 60% of your pain after taking 90+mg's of Morphine you probably need something that is better metabolized like oxycodone or even some fentanyl patches. that might be the way to go. but either way you need one for long acting relief and another for breakthru.

Keep us posted man. I just want you to know something: many of us have been where you are, and I personally have. And just remember, in the darkest time when you feel fucking terrible and think it will never get better, It will get better. You will find the magic combination that lets you reclaim some portion of your life and you will feel overwhelmingly grateful for each little step you make.

Keep your hope alive, be honest with your doctor, and don't be afraid to ask for what you need.

Again, stay in touch.

Good luck.

-V

P.S. Pain management is one of the most difficult branches of medical science because it is dangerous, often breeds addiction/dependence, and is very subjective. Finding a doctor who you trust and who trusts you is imperative. When you find one, stick with him. But never be afraid to ask for what you need.

 

First off, what does Feel4 uLA mean when he says PLUG morphine??

Anyway, some updates and wanted to know some pricing information.
I went back to the doctor and was supposed to go today (was there last week), and he prescribed 100mg Kadian, 30mg KADIAN, both in 100 count amounts, as well as 30MG Morphine Instant Release at 120 count.

Well, sorry, but I don't have over $1000.00 to pay for the KADIAN so I got only 7 of each (100mg, 30mg) and got the INSTANT RELEASE, #120 filled ($39.00=very cheap).

Here's the deal, he seems to be skeptical about giving me what everyone here thinks is the best medicine, the Oxycotin, however, he did say he wanted to see how the IR and KADIAN worked first as the MS didn't work that well. Honestly, it works okay but I still find I had to take two-three (15mg Compounds) with 2-3 IR morphine, the Kadian is to expensive and it works fairly good but the strange thing is, I get pain in places I never had it before.

Starting next month (JAN) when the deductible starts over, he wants to pump me with some dye and see if there are cracks in my bones.

I also wanted to ask, if I am taking 60mg hydro and 60-90mg IR and it does the job OKAY but at the same time he wants me off the HYDRO, then what direction do I go in? What do I ask him for the next time I see him? The KADIAN is very expensive and I am finding out that so isn't the OXY, especially at the 80mg level and I can't afford those prices. Can someone tell me what the normal going rate is for OXY and what other prescriptions they think would work that are cheaper?

One of the pharmists (owner) said Demerol and Deludid are very cheap and would work. Should I bring those up?

What are the average prices for Oxy and long lasting and quick acting medicines. I thought that OXY was fast acting but the more I read it seemed it was LONG acting or is it FAST ACTING but long lasting?

Appreciate what I should do/ask for - as he wanted to see (as we discussed last week), what would happen if he prescribed Kadian/and an fast acting morphine before moving on and now its time to move on.

FWIW, I gave someone one 30MG IR morphine tab that had a prescription for 50 norco's and he said 1 tab lasted him two days and that he felt energetic and that 15mg worked really well. Man how I wish it worked like that for me. Nope, just the IR and combo HYDRO seem to work and should be going to the next level in meds tomorrow - just need advice on what to ask for and get some feedback on what you think the prices are, especially that the GENERIC OXY is no longer available.

Thanks everyone.

 

Please guys and gals give me some advice on what to ask for as I am seeing him today.

Not sure what the prices are for Oxy, but was told it is also expensive.

In the US, what is the MAXIUM a compound of Hydro could be? This seems to work the best, just not for a long time, maybe 5 hours and he keeps steering me in a different direction even though the Kadians, MS IR all make me tired and slow as well as not work.

Suggestions needed ASAP.

Thanks

 

PS. If I am taking Hydro that seems to work the best, how does it compare to Oxycotin?

In other words, if I take 60mg doses every 4-5 hours, how many Oxy would I need? For some reason he seems to point away from that but at the same time, he did want to see if the morphines worked.

1st visit: MS Cotin 30 mg 2-3 every 12 hours, told him I took 4 at a time, didn't really work.

2nd Visit Kadian, 100mg (#100), 30mg (100), 30mg IR (#120), but I could not afford the Kadian, and he wanted to try the Kadian and IR first.

Think today he will want to try, diludid, demerol, or Oyx, the first two were recommended from pharmasist.

Thanks all. Advice on how many of Oxy I would need and wheter the other two (Diluadid et-cetra, would work). Thanks - see him in 6 hours.

 

We met today, the doctor and I, it turns out though that the Oxy is pretty expensive. Since they no longer have the generic anymore.

We talked about it and he said he is a bit hesitant to prescribe it to anyone as its not something you can prescribe for life.

The pharmacy suggest Dilatid which he gave me (8mg) and methdone (saying it DOES work for pain) and I can see him again before he leaves on the 18th.

My only feeling is that everything he has prescribed hasn't worked yet so I don't put too much stock in this (what he prescribed) this time either and get the imression that everything he prescribes is a sleepy agent. I did let me brother in law (who had 50+ vicodin) try a 30mg fast acting and it worked wonders for him. Wish it worked like that for me.

Anyway, let me know if you think I should even bother filling the two new (Dilaudid/Metadone) or just pick up my #120 count Hydro (15mg) and go back to the doctor and tell him it didn't work. I should try it as the diladid is supposed to be pretty strong, problem is will it work or not (like the others) and make me sleepy.
PS. Even if he prescribed the Oxy which I can probably get if I push the matter letting him know everything so far either didn't work, made me sick or sleepy, I couldn't afford the Oxy which I got a price around $490 for 60 pills. I don't think so. Cash price.

Advice appreciated.

 

They DO have generic Oxycontin....they just don't have the SAME generics that they used to.

These are the new generics:

http://www.pharmer.org/images/domestic/oxycodone-m-596

Generic Name: Oxycodone Controlled Release
Strength: 80 mg
Manufacturer: Mallinckrodt Pharmaceuticals
Trade Name: N/A
Type: Analgesic
Class: RX, CII
Comment: Image courtesy of oharejoe. Imprint M596

They have different dosages of course, but I just wanted to show you that they do have generics, so don't let pharmacies tell you they don't make them anymore.

Also, what did he mean by saying you can't prescribe Oxycontin for life? Why couldn't you? Most people on strong meds like Oxycontin are going to be on pain meds for the rest of their life, regardless, so I don't understand why your doctor is stating that Oxycontin can't be taken for a long period of time.

Doesn't make any sense at all.

 

Yeah, I found out they do have generics but do you know how much they are? They are well over $350 or so for 80mg 60 count.

I don't have that kind of money to be throwing at it.

Does it come cheaper? Am I being misled? One pharmacy said they no longer carry generics anymore. Again though, the price I am getting is very, very high and he is leary of prescribing but probably will if the below do not work - just have to find the right combination.

Will these work? How do they fare to MS Cotin, MS IR, Kadian (way to expensive,)..the Dilaudid 8mg (hydromorphine and methadol) or am I wasting my time with these?

Thanks.

 

350 for 60 is CHEAP.

I pay 1400 for 120. I get name brand though.

Oxycontin is Oxycodone, but time released. If you have ever taken Percocet, it's the same exact thing, minus the tylenol/apap/acetaminophen.

It works extremely well, especially when coupled with a good breakthrough med like Roxicodone.