Cheney says he and Bush not responsible for this economic mess.

We are not owed freedom from taxation. Taxes pay for our infrastructure. When the rich avoid them...we pay for their free access to things that make their wealth multiply at our expense. While they lobby to control our access to protections from their excesses.

That's why the working man is losing his job, while AIG executives receive their bonuses becuse they have legal contracts. That's why bankruptcy laws for individuals were tightened up in the last ten years but corporate bankruptcy laws remain the same as they were decades ago. That's why workers no longer receive pensions, but the wealthy have a legal right to their bonsuses and golden parachutes.

The working man can no longer file a suit for workcomp without an attorney...but that's their fault.

We take risks we send our kids to die in War, what risks did Bush and Cheney take? It's hard when gas is four dollars a gallon and grocercies skyrocket to invest in Goldman Sachs.

But AIG has indeminified Goldman haven't they? But we may smoke and we have computer access, would you like to take that from us. The new cigarette taxes certainly look like it. What next a tax on computer access? I can see that coming.

 

So poor folks shouldn't have access to broadband? You cut off free analog tv airwaves, you forced us to buy boxes and new antennas, now what...? We should appologize for trying to stay in communication.

 

What I want to re-evaluate is telling the little man all his law suits are frivolous, and his injuries on the job are his responsibilitity alone. What I want to re-evaluate is the attitude that privatization leads to lower prices on and better delivery of utilities and government. I want to re-evaluate the myth that law suits made by consumers harmed by faulty goods, commodities and services are without merit.

I think those of us that lived through Enron in California have not forgotten about their emails and phone calls laughing at us while we suffered and Bush and Cheney told us it was our problem. And they forced the election of Schwartzeneger even after we had relected Davis.

This newest crap with AIG is just more of the same. But now it's on a national level.

You think these guys care about you:

http://allnurses.com/world-news-current/enron-traders-caught-68595.html

What kind of quotes do you think we'll get from AIG when this is over?

 

Thing is we didn't get anything back from Enron in California but Shwartzeneger, and we didn't ask for him.

 

I will agree that the AIG bail out is a farce, and I for one feel the free market should be allowed to bounce, and let the strongest companies survive. Supporting the whole group allows them to continue their poor business practices. If we had one fewer of each industry, the companies that survive will be stronger, no government bail out, no tax payers added burden, and those who loose their jobs will need help. Let's spend some of the bailout money to help them survive the crises and allow funds for re-education for new fields of work.

But I believe that most people who have financial problems have contributed to their demise more than our government policies. I don't suggest that we should do without our pleasures in life, but maybe if you are going hungry, then you ought to read Maslow's Needs of Hierarchy to see what is important in life.

We are spoiled rotten and want to blame everyone around us when there is plenty of things we can fix on our side of the fence. We have too much government, and now we are signing up for more government dependence with the bailouts.

If we wait for someone else to fix our problems, we have to live with their solutions.

James

 

This is what Hoover did during the great deppression. He let the banks fail and it destroyed the whole economy. Bernanke compares AIG to a smoker who lights his house on fire and it is among many other wood houses. Do we put the fire out, or let the whole neighborhood burn?

 

No, Hoover bailed out the banks, just like they are doing now. This is what turned the 1929 crash into a 16-year depression.

 

Herbert Hoover Copycats

http://counterpunch.org/zadeh02202009.html

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No, Hoover failed to act strongly enough and let some big public banks fail including the New York Bank of the United States. This led to a panic and a widespread run on the local banks. With no credit available the economy collapsed.

 

But these are the same lies that Bernanke and the bankers are promoting... this idea that the Depression was caused by the Fed's failure to act. The exact opposite is true. It's the intervention that turned what would have been a hard but short crash into a prolonged depression lasting well over a decade.

If Hoover had simply allowed the banks to fail (which he didn't), the Depression would have been over in just a few years, as opposed to 16 years.

 

......or if Hoover had pumped more liquidity into the economy there would have been no depression at all. We'll see what happens this time. Most economists believe we'll be out of this recession by the end of the year.

 

No they don't.

 

Actually, they're right. We will be out of a recession and in a depression. Some economists believe we are already in a depression, especially when considering the REAL unemployment numbers.

 

Like I said. We'll see. The market will tell us shortly. Personally I think it's bottomed. You can call me a sucker if you want.

 

What's funny is that the people telling us it's bottomed out and that the recession will be over in a year, are the same people who have been wrong on everything else so far. Basically Bernanke -- an inveterate liar -- came out last week and said we should be out of the "recession" by the end of the year / early next year. Then the establishment, lapdog journalists and economists took what he said and ran with it. Now all of a sudden "most economists" believe we will be out of the recession in a year. It's total bullshit.

The thing is, I would not be surprised if things do get temporarily better, which will be then used to get everyone back into the stock market, telling people it's all over and that everything will be OK. The thing is, the current policies of constantly printing fiat paper money are going to begin to show after time, and it's when hyperinflation kicks in that we will really be in a depression.

You cannot simply flood the markets with worthless liquidity and not expect to see any fallout from it as time progresses.

 

If the economy resumes growth Bernanke can just raise interest rates to stiffle inflation. If it doesn't then your right we're screwed. How did you like Bernake's 1.2 trillion dollar injection today? The market is liking it so far.

 

It is very unlikely the economy will resume growth when so much of this country's industry has been sent overseas.

Yeah, the markets are liking the injection of money at the moment, but that will not last. And no amount of increase in interest rates will be able to quell the amount of inflation this will trigger further down the road, especially when you consider the trillions more that have already been printed up and have seemingly disappeared into thin air.

Most people don't realize that the banker bailout bill from '08, which was initially supposed to be 800 billion dollars, later turned out to be more than 9 trillion.

 

Rat I don't know where we are going to end up economically at this point, but I started this thread in order to discuss how absurb it was for Cheney to imply his administration had no responsibility in causing it. I would hope we could back to that focus or let this thread die and start a new one for you discuss your predictions of doom and gloom global banking elite conspiracies.

 

I'm just going to answer the opening question.Bush/Cheney and Co. did not start this mess,but they made it MUCH worse.And they created a host of other major problems in so many different areas.They're only intention was to make the rich richer--thats it.And the American people fell for it.

 

Oh,and as far as Cheneys net worth it can almost be guaranteed he is worth many BILLIONS of dollars financially.As a person he is worthless.