social stigma: what do you say to this?

alright so it seems like there is a massive social stigma attached to lsd, and ill probably start another less specific thread later about it. but for now i have a situation and i thought i would run it by here.

so in my family i guess it's me and a few other people in the younger generation who are pro-lsd, assuming responsible use. but lately we have really been struggling with the rest of our family which has been taking an ever increasing stand against lsd and hallucinogens.

we try to tell them the way that things -- well atleast the way that we percieve them -- are, but they are just not open minded at all and hold onto their ideas about hallucinogens relentlessly.

in their minds all hallucinogens are extremely dangerous and will cause you to have psychotic breaks, regardless of how cautious you are with the substances. they think that it is extremely risky behaviour which can only end up in two ways: legal trouble and long-term jail setencing, or having a psychotic break and becoming a vegetable. we try to explain how there is a threshold that must be respected when using these drugs, but they think that the safe-use threshold is not there at all. they say that one use is all it takes. even though we have all -- the younger and the older generation -- used hallucinogens numerous times before with no ill effects, they will still not give up on their positions.

they also discredit any kind of religious or introspective experience that may be induced by hallucinogens as being unnatural. they think that these lessons should be learned through religion and life lessons, not from taking a drug. even though we feel that hallucinogens are by no means 'a drug', it is still looked on as such to them. they see the use of hallucinogens as a spiritual tool as being invalid.

and to make matters worse the older generation has done an absurd amount of drugs in their lifetimes and i guess come to the conclusion that responsible drug use is impossible. just because they weren't able to, what is to say we cant? how can we communicate this to them?

so what on earth are we supposed to say to help alleviate some of this nonsense?

 

teach your children the virtues of hallucinogens. you cant teach an old dog new tricks.

 

do you not now about all of the suicides and acid-casualties who were committed because of the use of hallucinogens?

Let's be real here for a second, the drugs aren't for everyone man.
I think you need to accept that and not force your opinions on anyone

 

you can only do what you can do. when you see opportunities to illuminate, take them. don't force it. and enjoy your psychedelics.

 

My parents say psychedelics are only for artists, and since I'm not an artist... You get the picture, lol.

 

?

 

Stigmas suck but we don't have to tell people what we do, we don't have to argue for the sake of position, and we don't have to convince anyone to respect LSD. When it comes down to it, whoever is supposed to take acid gets some acid. Those who are open take more and can have a nice time. Those who realize may take more but they know why they take it. But in the end as long as LSD is unknown and the information distorted, THE STIGMA LIVES ON.

 

I've learned that people will believe what they want to believe, and that includes me and you as well. We're no different. They are just as annoyed with us taking drugs as we are with them being incredibly ignorant of drugs.

It's just two sides of the same coin, so let go of the coin

 

Nothing Desos. You aren't supposed to say anything.
I know the past is the past and it can't be changed, but I'm suprised that you even intially said anything about acid. I would never tell anyone in my family that I have done acid, not because I am ashamed of it, or afraid of the consequences, but because I know that it would lead to this. Constant friction.
There is nothing wrong with taking psychedelics. And there is nothing wrong with not taking psychedelics.
You say that they are close-minded because they are not open to your views. Perhaps you are close-minded because you are not open to their views?

 

People who become burnt out or insane from abusing acid.

Casuality - killed or injured in the line of duty.

 

Agreed.

Acid's been great to me, I've had wonderful introspective experiences, insights, mystical and spiritual realizations. In 99% of my friends, they simply had a good or bad time and can't seem to understand what it is that I am talking about when I try to relay these wonderful experiences. I'm okay with that, and wouldn't even consider trying to convince someone who isn't already interested in trying acid to try it.

All it takes to screw up your life completely is one dose. As much as people in power distort the actual facts, as far as I'm concerned the system as is is fine, people who aren't content with every day reality will become depressed, turn to drugs, maybe try acid, maybe learn something from it, maybe not, and nobody's any worse off in the end.

If it's nonsense, why does it need to be alleviated? The only things worth changing are real things, trying to change nonsense is just going to make more nonsense.

 

members of mainstream culture have not the slightest comprehension of the magnitude of the filter that is covering their minds. we have it too, but we're aware of the fact and we dont dogmatize and institutionalize what we perceive. in order for the naysayers to appreciate what we say, they have to take their entire worldview with a grain of salt and question the very basis of their existence. but their worldview is a dependency, an addiction. they rely on what they think they know for their own emotional security. it's hard to walk away from a bad investment especially if it has been invested in since birth and by one's lineage.

nevertheless I think it's possible to create some fissures not so much in clever arguments but in embodying the energies and passions that are central to the psychedelic realms. just as words are futile from one tripper to another, they are much more so when communicating to a straight-head. the essence of it is not complicated except where we insist on complicating it. a calm and disinterested person will make a bigger impact on people's perceptions of lsd, etc. than a person who is engaged in correcting the false opinions. when people feel like you have something to prove it becomes an ego game in which they're not likely to surrender.

 

Just because I take acid and dress like a woman with a dildo in each hand and walk around lots flirting with truck drivers doesnt mean society has a right to neglect me

 

never shame the acid dropping,dildo fucking,hooker

 

Yea! I need some love too ya know

 

Next time your parents say that, tell them you've decided to go to art school.

Since I'm an artist, I guess I have permission from your parents to use psychedelics! :cheers2:

 

your grounded, go to your room.

 

Heh, my parents thought if you smoked weed you would go insane and jump off a roof or something like that. You can't teach old dogs new tricks. In large, its better to not have people ignoranty going off and taking an unknown amount of drugs without knowing any of the true effects or consequences thereof. Its a choice, and it should be an educated choice, and not forced to think one way or another about it.

LSD can and does have a negative side to it. We do not understand fully how it effects our neurochemistry and it does not effect any 2 people in the same way, nor how it interacts with other drugs perscription and nopersrciption. While maybe 1 out of 20 may have some ill side effects, there is still a risk associated with it. Its a fact of the matter, it can be dangerous in some ways. To blindy say there is no risk whatsoever is just as stupid as saying that if you take acid one time you are going to jump off a building and kill yourself. However that being said, some people are self destructive to start with, and they are not going to use it intelligently and with respect to its power.

If I choose to try it, its my choice, but I have also been there and done it several times before, I know what to expect, and how to deal with it.

 

hahahaha

 

I don't even know what to say to that. Everything you just said about non-LSD users can EASILY be applied to people who do acid, or have done acid. As a matter of fact, when you find yourself thinking of people in the manner you have displayed in this paragraph, it's my opinion that you are back to square one and need to re-evaluate some things. You are not more aware, your worldview is no better than theirs, and "questioning the very basis of their existence" is probably one of the most pretentious and narrow-minded things I've ever read. Way over the top, and elitist also.

All of the enlightened masters that frequent this very forum play ego games all day long, every day.