Why Don't You Believe?

Another refutation of god would be chaos theory. The first thing believers in god will say is, "Who do you think created the stars, and the flowers...etc.? Why is there day and night in regular intervals?"

But day, night, stars, and flowers are all superficial concepts. There is some recognizable similarity to them up to a point; but on another level, there is randomness and complexity and differentiation (i.e., no "flower" is like another "flower"; it is impossible to establish precisely when night ends and day begins, etc. etc.). And because the glob of energy-matter we call "star" or "flower" is in constant movement and change, it's impossible to say simply that they are or exist. In a way, they are still becoming, and therefore not yet "created."

It's up to you whether you want to actually debate with those knuckleheads, or not. I don't think I would.

 

As you suggesting the heisenberg uncertainty principle singlehandedly killed god

You might be right


Hotwater

 

The Babel fish is small, yellow and leech-like, and probably the oddest thing in the Universe. It feeds on brainwave energy recieved not from its own carrier but from those around it, It absorbs all unconscious mental frequencies from this brainwave energy to nourish itself with. the practical upshot of this is that if you stick a Babel fish in your ear you can instantly understand anything said to you in any language.
Now it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anhthing so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see as a final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God. The argument goes like this : "I refuse to prove that I exist", says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."
"But", says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? it could not have evolved by chance. it proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED."
"Oh dear", says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.
"Oh that was easy" says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.
Meanwhile, the poor Babel fish, by effectively removing all barriers to communication between different races and cultures, has caused more and bloodier wars than anything else in the history of creation.

 

A punch to the throat. It's the altruistic answer.

 

Between the Epicurean Riddle, Chaos Theory, and the fact that I simply haven't experienced a god (or any anthropomorphic spirit), I consider myself well-armed against the evangelists. :cheers2:

But to be honest, I usually rid myself from their overtures by means of curt and stand-offish behavior.

 

I'm agnostic, but I usually answer with "I'm part native american I was raised different" or "Do you believe in magic?".

 

Hmm.We try and be logical about God and the Universe.However, our sense of logic and proof is ultimately quite feeble usually.
To us , a Universe cannot come out of nothing.Nor can it have "always" existed.
Therefore, perhaps we need to take a step and say "something can exist because there is no reason for it not to exist"?

On another point,any God would perhaps exist outside of Time or Space.
One physicist( I think his name was Frank Tipler) famously speculated that our descendents will master Time.Their ultimate aim could be to travel back in time , and resurrect everyone who died.
The ultimate "Man playing God" scenario...

 

If Darwin managed to get himself buried in a church...I doubt heisenberg uncertainty principle (or the other myriad of theories) will be the end of God...Sad, but true.

 

That's kind of a cop out. God is by definition anthropomorphic. I don't mean bearded man in the sky, but I mean god has to have human qualities (particularly "intelligence", morality, and will).

If we're talking of infinity, or universe, or being, or nothingness...then why call it God? Call it by its actual name.

 

Good answer.

I hate expaining my beliefs, anytime I tell someone I am not Christian they want to know why not, what I believe in, and why I choose what I choose, like it need be to be explained.

My Mom is always giving me shit because I'm not Christian, neither is she.

She only recently talks about 'a God', and that was only since my Grandmother passed, I think it's a form of greiving for her.

 

A God could be of "infinite intelligence",or relatively so.
It could exist outside of our concept of time.
Therefore, to us,it may appear "later" in our evolution.

I think that as we progress as a species,our perceptions and actions will have more effect on the underlying fabric of whatever universe is around us.

I can't see why a "sentient" universe could not be a God.

Physics already (arguably)supports the notion that our very observing of it alters the reality of the universe.

In another way, perhaps we could become part of God(...or the other guy...)

 

Some scientists have already come to the conclusion that no matter how rigorous an examination there is of higher level human functions (such as consciousness) we'll never truly understand the condition

Hotwater

 

"Because the idea of an omnipotent and omniscient God who gives two tugs of a dead dog's cock about the petty lives of humans is simply laughable."

 

I don't buy this. Anything is possible with advanced enough technology, and advanced enough science. Given infinite time, we will find infinite answers (But most of those answers would probably lead to more questions, so it might be some time before we've got it all jotted down.)

 

It is not like I don't believe, I just don't know.

Perhaps a god, perhaps not.

But if I am talking to a bible thump, I tell them the history and the politics behind the writing of the Bible.

It always amazes me how Christians do not even know the history of how their own holly book was written.

If they are still hanging around after that I explain The business and power games of the powerful religious leaders. I talk about how and why the idea of guilt was introduced into the church to enslave and control the people.

By then the poor bible thump is screaming that I will boil and Satan's sewage pit for the rest of eternity...

Or

They are overwhelmed and confused but with a new sense of hope that glows from their eyes.

All organized religions are a traps.

 

guess I wont be seein most of you when I get to heaven...

 

This is what I'm wondering.
There's matter , energy and *consciousness*.
I believe its wrong for us to try and explain the 3rd with reference to the other two.

In other words , consciousness is one of the building blocks of a Universe.
Whether that be a Universe at a moment in time.Or across time.Or the Universe that exists in the mind of one consciousness.

This guy is quite interesting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Langan

 

With all the people who claim they're going to heaven, I don't know if I want to spend eternity with some of them anyway.

 

Pubs seem to have a weird sort of logic/wisdom.

I went to a pub on my travels.Got really talking to someone.But I'm never gonna go back to that pub...probably.When I left he said "see u in heaven".

Ok it was an off the cuff remark.But it did sort of resonate with me, in a trippy type of way.U know.. eternity's quite a long time.

And I wonder,what are the purposes of our "chance" meetings..

 

How about figuring out why YOU don't believe in God and then you will have your answer.