Does religion make people bad, or do people make religion bad?

I guess this is the question that's been underlying everything. Is religion the reason for war, hatred, segregation, paranoia, etc., or is it just as good an excuse as any?

Your opinions please

(Oh, and as a small, probably futile disclaimer: I couldn't give a rat's arse whether any god does or doesn't exist or how totally proven it is or isn't or how stupid/blind everyone is or isn't for not agreeing one way or another. As far as this subject goes, it's totally irrelevant.)

 

Yes, imo.

I was watching something last night, it said that aggression is highest when a child and a persons innate aggression is diluted the older they get - in most cases. It is hard-wired out of most people.
Aggression can be re-ignited if provoked.
I believe the bible provokes aggression.
It is also not a stretch to think it also provokes prejudice, hatred and intolerance oh and lets not forget "holy wars."

It can also provoke love, peace and understanding.

 

The Bible incites these feelings just as much as anything else in the world does.

As soon you hear "forgive 70 times 7 times" the person realizes some form of truth. Now, if they actually do forgive past hatreds and learn to love then that is great. But if they "forgive" somebody just because God told them too, and really haven't forgave in their psyche/heart, then they harbor aggression (I a brainwashed Christian like this).

There's a billion ways somebody could interpret the same piece of information, and even more ways that a life experience can react with their karma. Not even death metal music may make people aggressive. Maybe hearing about death and violence inspires then to spread peace and love around the world.

It all depends on how they internalize it.

 

I hear this a lot, but it's not strictly true, is it? I mean, if the information is purely random, it is. But if the information is written language, it will have connotations that are based on emotional responses, so that maybe people will interpret something different, but the range of interpretations isn't going to be enormous really.

 

Over holy wars, as much as religion might provoke them, I'm wondering how often it provokes one that wasn't right on the brink of happening - some might say one that didn't need to happen.

I mean, to put it bluntly, holy wars tend to happen to poor people, right?

 

To poor people by rich people.

 

Not exclusively. My point is, though, that there are usually economic, social or political tensions between nations who end up fighting over something as irrelevant as which god exists. I've not known prosperous nations war over it. It makes me wonder, and if religion is merely the catalyst, I don't think it deserves all of the flak it gets.

I guess part of the reason I'm asking this is because, really, the nature/existence of a god is so insignificant to day-to-day life, I've never worked out how it ever became so important to people.

 

The religious wars I know about were not about existence, but about re-capturing holy land and killing other faiths for their faiths supremacy.

Erm, France, Britain, Spain...to name but a few.

Zealots believe their faith is superior so the banishment of other faiths and gods is a must. It's a little insecure, but just the way it is.

 

I'm just not convinced. As in, I'm not convinced that the massive monetary and territorial gains, the massive shifts in global status and so on, are just coincidental to these holy wars, and that it's really all about punishing bad people for believing in the wrong god. I mean, it just seems way too convenient. Some people call the US/Middle Eastern conflict a religious war, but those who profit from it are pretty blatant about it.

 

Yes, people could interpret something a billion ways.

It's like the butterfly effect. One piece of information has to trickle through a person's Karma, and gets influenced by every prior experience in their life.

It's just like saying the word "love". Do you mean love for food, for culture, for people, for hiking. Then your mind gravitates/repels according to each of these mental images. And according to an infinitely complex set of variables you end up with inspiration to do something, a creative idea.

Individuality is the proof of how people can interpret things ever so differently.

 

Both.

 

The Crusades, for instance, was not only about religion...it was about a turf war and access to vital sea ports. I'm not blaming the bible for everything, just a vital component.

 

See, this is kinda what I mean, if it's just the catalyst, I think blaming it let's the real culprits off the hook.

 

I don't personally excuse anybody who uses religion as their excuse...but can see that it does drive people to do what they do. I blame both.

 

A Catholic church near me owns 5 different pristine facilities they rent for special occasions. The main church has stained glass windows, Yamaha grand piano, and fish fry's 2x a week.

The Cathedral Buffet is owned by Ernest Angely's ministry.

Church on the Rise (one of the U.S.'s megachurches, located in Westlake, Ohio) recently built a new recreational facility. Fitted with Xbox 360's, big screen t.v.'s (along with the ones in the original church), art centers, music centers, etc.

It's sickening what these good folk donate their money to. Makes me want to open up a church.

 

I don't get it. Are the donors not allowed to use the facilities that they're paying for?

 

...you know the two worst genocidal maniacs in the 20th century were atheists under a regime where religion was outlawed...mao te tsung and stalin. violence is human nature...you can't go blaming religion just because it's a common excuse.

from my personal experience, i'd say those who actually follow their religions are good people. most of the world's main religions have the overall message: treat people right...which i can hardly disagree with. granted, there's some archaic moral "nodes" that aren't exactly right by me...but for the most part...

i'd say religion has more of a positive impact on the world than a lot of people give it credit for.

 

I think that when religion is a factor in a war, it is just used as an excuse, with real underlying reasons that aren't made public.

 

Such as?

 

Religion is just another way to segregate people