The only reason

I've been raised a Christian. I went to Christian school for first thru sixth grade. I go to church weekly (mainly because my mom makes me) However, I've never "felt" God. I've never had a relationship with God. Whenever I pray, I just kinda feel like I'm talking to nothing. I've never experienced God before.

I've "asked" Jesus to come into my life before. Nothing changes. I don't feel any different. It was probably an insincere effort, though.
The only reason in the back of my mind to stay a Christian would be because of hell. Not out of God's love. The thought of eternal damnation scares the shit out of me.


Truth be told, I guess I'm not really a Christian. I certainly don't live like one. I don't have the opinions regarding social issues like one. I don't live my life around the Bible. I'm lying to myself if I really think I'm a Christian.

I feel scared to just admit that I'm agnostic, because of hell. But how am I supposed to live my life around something I've never felt before?

 

I was exactly you at one point in my life. It's a scary thought man, and can be a very hard mental transition, but the light at the end of the tunnel is well worth it man.

The first step is simply putting yourself there. The discomfort will come, the doubts will arise, but eventually they will lessen and subside. You'll really realize how much your old beliefs have a negative hold on you, adding undue subconscious stress, worry, etc. to your life.

Just love man. Everything you do, try to do it with love. Whether its love for self or others, make sure that your decisions stems from that place of joy/happiness/unity. Love is the natural direction that we move towards (rather than sadness, worry, anger) because it feels right. Realize the quality of your mind when you have love in your heart, and how it feels compared to anything else. It's our true religion.

 

If you don't mind being around Christians or if you don't want to get into it with your parents, I would suggest not worrying about whether you are a Christian or not but use the time to learn about yourself. The Bible has the ability to tell you about yourself, so learn. If you find things about yourself you like, find out what you can do to improve on those. If you find things about yourself you don't like, find out what you can do to diminish those.

If not that, then let me tell you that God does use fear to get people to worship him. So although some people use fear of hell to hold people in a religion they don't want, they do so without God's permission. Hell is merely the common grave of mankind and death is compared to a deep dreamless sleep. There is no pain or suffering in death. God said to Adam, dust you are and to dust you shall return, dust feels no pain. So if Hell is the only reason holding you in a religion you don't want, Hell is nothing to fear.

 

The only part about this paragraph that isn't complete bullshit is the part where you insinuate death is nothing to fear.

How is it possible for a peaceful, deep, dreamless sleep to resemble hell? And what reason do you have to believe that's what death is like?

This is exactly why Christianity is the religion most responsible for turning believers into atheists.

To dude who made the thread, you don't need to fear hell. You need to do some research on who you truly are and you aren't gonna find much in the Bible. That's actually the scripture you'll find the LEAST amount of Truth in. Look up spirituality and you'll be on your road to experiencing God the way you yearn to. Don't be discouraged, you're already on the right path by deciding to turn away from what you see as bullshit even though you were raised to believe it.

And the reason you don't experience God through prayer is because Christianity teaches you to communicate with a God that doesn't exist, plain and simple.

Heaven and hell are states of mind here on Earth. Only brainwashed religious people make it seem like it's a place you go after "death."

You seem like someone who thinks for themselves, no wonder you aren't comfortable with religion.

 

Yeah, man...remaining a nominal Christian out of fear of Hell is not enough to keep you out of Hell, if it exists. You might as well free yourself from that fear of something you doubt exists at all.

I recommend reading Richard Dawkin's book The God Delusion. It's not a great work of philosophy or history by any means...and it's not meant to be. It's sole purpose is to let people in your condition know that it is perfectly fine to let go of this idea of God.

I advise you to do your best to get rid of all irrational beliefs. Then, when you think you've eliminated the influence of all the irrational beliefs of all the people around you as best as you can, start looking for your own irrational beliefs -- the ones that are true for you, regardless of whether they're true for anyone else or not.

And finally, here's a great quote from Kurt Vonnegut-- Live by the foma [a useful and harmless sort of horseshit] that make you brave and kind and healthy and happy.

 

^^ Good advice but the idea of God isn't an "irrational belief."

Maybe the Christian idea of God, but definitely not Spirituality nor Science's idea of God.

 

We disagree, but that doesn't really matter.

 

If you're having doubts, its for a good reason. a friend of mine who wants to be a pastor is having doubts herself. Read some Richard Dawkins, watch the Zeitgeist movies, take your head and life out of the fairytales and into the real world.

 

What you need to do is research quantum physics and collective Consciousness.

If you're gonna search for Truth outside yourself, at least listen to certified scientists and philosophers. Not some outdated book of fairy tales or delusional and/or money hungry pastor.

 

I see you are still showing people by your example what kind of a God you serve. I've heard it said that you can tell whether a tree is good or bad by the fruitage it produces, If your God has produced you then it's easy to see what kind of God he is.

 

LMAO oh so should I follow your example and serve a God who sends all his children to hell when they die?

 

I'm sorry, why would you think my God sends anybody to "hell" when they die? Has your God been misleading you again?

 

These are your words, not mine.

I personally know hell doesn't exist anywhere but in the human mind.

And I'm not having a childish your God vs my God debate but I will say this much, "my" God aint never appalled someone to the point they decided to become atheist. And no one who believes in "my" God feels any need to fear Him. Meanwhile your religion turn more people towards atheism than any other set of beliefs in the world. And I was saying that long before this thread was made.

 

Exactly, hell is merely the common grave of mankind. When people hear the word hell it brings up images of Satan carrying a pitchfork poking people in a fiery pit forever. When someone says, "Hell is just the common grave of mankind" they mean that hell is not what Donte described. Hell was translated incorrectly and connected to hades... but hell is just death; that's all it is. When we are dead, we feel no pain (So why fear it?). So this is a completely different kind of hell that is usually described by many Christians but those Christians are just confused and haven't really done their research. So when we hear the word hell, we just let go to the ideas that we once had about it. To better clarify, Sheol is just the grave, and the grave is what is discussed in the Bible. Forget the word hell if it helps.

With this in mind, J.Q. it seems like you are actually in agreement with OWB. You both agree that the hell Donte describes does not exist. And it also seems like you both agree that death is the same thing. The only difference, if you don't mind me saying, is your receptiveness in what is being said.

Not so long ago I was more inlines with your beliefs, J.Q. and whenever I seen someone that I thought was demeaning God I would get a bit upset and downright angry because they were changing Gods characters; and that bugged me. So you would be right in being a little upset whenever you see someone destroying the idea of God which is what most 'Christians' are responsible for. In the Bible taking God's name in vain is meant that we should not misrepresent his character by our behaviors, most likely because of the points that you have raised. So when we see 'Christians' using fear to hold others in their religion, then we can say that they aren't keeping with God's good character, and we have every right to be upset. Like you, I believe this is one of the main reasons why people think God is such a terrible and primitive thing because the so-called believers are reacting in a primitive manner... in other words, people toss the baby out with the bathwater due to outright confusion of the so-called believers and that this tends to send people to atheism.

To be fair, I am not sure you truly understand what we believe and I think that this has to do with your passion of your beliefs and the thoughts you have on Christianity. This is not to suggest anything about your intelligence. I am just saying that Christianity is hardly ever discussed in-depth because people turn the Bible into something else. What has helped me gain a better understanding of Christianity, to quote Yoda ( ) to unlearn what we have learned about Christianity and start fresh; using the Bible as our guide (not people). Let the Bible do the talking, not preachers.

Some things that I find useful:

Greek / Hebrew interlinear Bible software:

http://www.scripture4all.org/

Ancient Hebrew Discussions:

https://www.youtube.com/user/ancienthebreworg

 

So no one ever dies accept in your mind? Interesting, I guess you've been the problem all along. Please stop thinking about the common grave of mankind in your mind so the rest of us can live.

Once again, You prove you know very little about my God or my religion. Perhaps you should ask your God to keep you better informed before you try to trash another's God and beliefs.

Also this thread is not about trashing another's God or beliefs, although for some reason you feel that need.

It's about the concerns of Cold Brains.

Personally, I gave Cold Brains some advice that he can take or leave.

Most people, even atheists believe that the Bible is a good book with many wise things to say. So my advice to take advantage of his situation to learn more about himself is good counsel, no matter how you cut it.

I also addressed his second concern about "hellfire" by telling him that the Bible does not teach it and that if that was his only reason, for staying with the religion of his parents, he need not do so. Once again how was that "complete bullshit" as you put it?

My God teaches me to be concerned with the difficulties of others and try to help where I can, your God seems to be teaching you to attack the reasonable counsel of others before you even consider giving counsel to others. I find that an interesting distinction.

In any case this thread is not about your or my beliefs but about Cold Brains' dilemma and so I will not answer your posts in this thread any more, say what you will.

 

I respect where you're coming from on that first post.

Far as that 2nd one:

I meant hell in the sense of eternal torture when I said it doesn't exist outside the mind. I don't see any correlation between hell and death, if anything, you exit hell when you die.

And I didn't introduce the idea of my God vs your God. Whenever you're praying to a God you consider to be separate from yourself, you're praying to someone who doesn't exist. You don't have to agree, that's just what it is. That aint even my opinion, for the longest I considered all the religious Gods and my God to all be the same entity, just praised in different ways. But I've come to realize many (if not all) religious people consider God to be completely separate from them that they have to obey a bunch of strict laws to earn His Love. Not to mention, the religious Gods aren't even the same entity, they have different names for a reason. If it was all the same God, there wouldn't be a need for more than one religion.

Cold Brains, you have already been appalled by the Bible. That isn't to say there isn't any Truth in it because there is. But if you want an intellectual breakdown of who God really is, this should help:

http://www.eoni.com/~visionquest/library/godconsc.html

 

yes but HELL is still real men its spiritually torture......JC spoke more about hell then any other topic.????!!!!

 

zeitgeist is discreditable.


people really do believe anything that comes out of a TV

 

Hate to disagree with you but I believe Jesus spoke about the Kingdom of God more than any other subject. I mean, what with all those parables of his that started, the Kingdom of God is like. . . it seems like that was almost all he talked about.

 

J.Q. sometimes says things I disagree with, but he's often insightful, thinks independently and always communicates from the heart. He says things about my religion that are unkind and untrue, but I think that's only because he's been exposed to warped fundamentalist versions of it. His observation that heaven and hell are states of mind is right on, and quite insightful in our culture. The God who produced him is a good God, our God, and He's beautiful. The Spirit shines in this beautiful reflection of the Divine Spirit, created in God's image and likeness. Namaste.