Mckenna - Shaman or Schizophrenic?

A section taken from a talk with Terence Mckenna talking about Schizophrenic or Shaman.

"Tim Leary once said – or I gave him credit for saying; he later told me he never said it – but whoever said it, this was a brilliant statement; someone once said, “LSD is a psychedelic substance which occasionally causes psychotic behaviour in people who have not taken it.” – right? And I would bet you that more people have exhibited psychotic behaviour from not taking LSD, but just thinking about it, than ever exhibited it from taking it – certainly in my family. I watched my parents both go psychotic from the mere fact that LSD existed; they would never have taken it. There is a great phobia about the mind: the Western mind is very queasy when first principles are questioned. Rarer than corpses in this society are the untreated mad, because we can’t come to terms with that.

A shaman is someone who swims in the same ocean as the schizophrenic, but the shaman has thousands and thousands of years of sanctioned technique and tradition to draw upon. In a traditional society, if you exhibited “schizophrenic” tendencies, you are immediately drawn out of the pack and put under the care and tutelage of master shamans. You are told, You are special. Your abilities are very central to the health of our society. You will cure. You will prophesy. You will guide our society in its most fundamental decisions. Contrast this with what a person exhibiting schizophrenic activity in our society is told. They’re told, You don’t fit in. You are becoming a problem, You don’t pull your own weight. You are not of equal worth to the rest of us. You are sick. You have to go to the hospital. You have to be locked up. You are on a par with prisoners and lost dogs in our society.So that treatment of schizophrenia makes it incurable. Imagine if you were slightly odd, and the solution were to take you and put you – lock you into a place where everyone was seriously mad. That would drive anyone mad! If you’ve ever been in a madhouse, you know that it’s an environment calculated to make you crazy and to keep you crazy. This would never happen in an aboriginal or traditional society. "

full 10 minute talk can be found here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_qx5Pd9Z-M

I have to agree fully and completely with everything Mckenna has to say about everything he is talking about -

Its very sad and disgusting that a Western World considers itself to be enlightened with wisdom when any signs of someone thinking different from the pack ...they crush,hide away and force pills into their throats which are designed to shut them up, zombify and turn them into something which they were not born to be.

For anyone who doesn't understand any of this ...

Imagine someone who shows great potential at being a professional basketball player; they are very tall, quick and can get the ball in the net 99% of the time.. heck they even have a afro.. the problem is .. basketball is only practised in a few places in the world.

so instead of sending them to one of these places to play basketball ... you send them to a crazy house somewhere local... and you tell them you cannot be a basketball player.. we are also going to change your psychological make-up with drugs to make you think that you cannot play basketball .. and if you by-pass that .. well heck; these drugs are going to permanently cripple your legs and aiming ability forever.

Timothy Leary says "I think that a society that imprisons its philosophers is playing with very bad magic"

 

i've been fucked up before [on weed].
i'll take sanity anytime.

 

yep... i agree with most of what terrence says but i don't think you necessarily need to ingest psychoactive substances in order to get to these states of other awareness all the time.... stress and exhaustion (physical and/or mental) can get you there too.. as can various meditations, although, all these methods have a slightly different result regarding the depth character of immersion into these spaces between...

i was taken to and sort the help of psychiatrists and the like, before i realised what was happening to me.... thankfully, i have an innate distrust of the pharmaceutical industry so managed to avoid what they try to dish out....

i think there are many who are needlessly locked away..... however, i have faith that the circle will come full cycle by whatever means necessary to enlighten us all eventually..... we are all one, afterall

:cheers2: make mine a double.... (well, i'm only human)

 

mckenna wasn't saying you need psychoactives in order to reach these states... the bit about LSD was just to support his point that the western world tends to be afraid of the mind and what it seems to be capable of.

i fully agree with what he's saying. beliefs aside, it's just obviously more useful to develop a person rather than try to suppress them, both for the individual and society as a whole. just like you said, when someone exhibits a difference the obvious inclination should be to aid them in following what they are naturally good at.

but there's no money in that. psychotropic medication is a HUGE business, and for someone to suggest that we don't need this stuff just would not fly, there's too much support and too much money to be made in keeping people permanently "not fit". awfully convenient that these illnesses are incurable and simply require lifelong medication (which from what i understand is not at all pleasant to be on). when a system can't offer a better solution than that, i think it's time to change it.

anyway that's all too much of a radical change for the western world. we're already well on our path.

 

you all bring great points to the table

 

It is true that the meds are life-long. Hmm.. good point.
I don't think I'd want to visit a psychiatrist. They don't seem like the kind of people you'd like to speak to about your problems; all they'd do is tell you you have one of any number of disorders (take your pick: anxiety/depression/dissociation) and that you need pills to help you with it. Not very comforting, is it?

 

your right

 

My view is that psychological problems are only problems because we find them hard to control. This includes schizophrenia. In the past someone who would seemingly be delusional now would be a lead figure in their community, possibly even a spiritual healer, or yes, a shaman.

The one message I have to all people with any psychological disorders is to take it with a pinch of salt. Do not try and become "normal", because you *are* normal, its society that makes you feel like you aren't. Instead, learn about your condition, learn how to control it, and if you are experiencing voices or multiple personalities, listen to them, and instead of acting upon them, record what they are telling you, do your research and find out the true meaning of it all. You will benefit greatly

My mum has anxiety disorder and she takes sertralin tablets daily to combat it. She was off the tablets for a couple of years, and during those years she was really friendly and nice, and seemingly doing very well. However last year she went back on them, and since she's been very argumentative, always feeling ill/tired, and generally not the best person to be around. The only real way to solve problems like these is to find harmony and acceptance with yourself, we have a lot more control over our subconscious than we think, and a lot less control over our conscious mind than we think.

- I just read that back and that looks like one of my random "stoned epiphanies". It's not.

-Matt

 

its also worth noting that anyone who is schizophrenic in this society but still functioning more *normal* than anyone else; cannnot become a world-leader .. a president or prime minister ... due to their medical illness .. so forget racism .. that is done and dusted; now we are using a word to explain why someone legally cannot do things for a unexplainable reason

 

yeah.. i mean, i am just speculating.
i've had my fair share of doubts. i've considered going to one. but i don't think i will. to be honest if i had to take head meds, i'd rather have a pint a day and be all right that way :cheers2:

 

mckenna (or maybe it was alan watts, one of the two) had a book out on mysticism and addressed the fact that many shamans are in their position because they showed early signs of alternative functioning (what we might call schizophrenia, but the book also mentioned that some had hallucinations relating to fever or illness that distinguished them) and were removed from society and told they possessed great powers.

despite the relationship, the keystone of shamanism is that the illness is integrated and directed to the energies necessary to perform their healing. this takes years and years of practice and, essentially, the schizophrenic is not a shaman until they are "healed" in this way. it's not just a matter of being crazy=being a prophet or leader, it's really more a question of harnessing your own personal tendencies in the same way that anyone else would refine themselves to their own direction. someone who is fragmented, confused, or static would not be considered a shaman at all.

 

that's a good point; what use is random, psychotic blabber?
well, unless you're syd barrett. then, it's art. but he's always an exception

 

oh yes genius and insanity is a very fine line... both require a mind that can pick up on something more than most people. a lot of times this goes hand in hand.

especially with art... the true artist necessarily suffers.

 

great words.
:cheers2: to my idol, syd.

i am a writer myself. but i guess i'm not a genius, since i don't suffer THAT much. i do go through occasional disturbances of perception, particularly in very noisy, crowded places. =/