Howdy, everyone. Plenty of you know me, some don't, so I'll give a quick bit here before I get into the thick of it. I was raised Catholic and in my early teens wandered away from it, exploring a number of other belief systems. Everything from the most obscure pagan path to Buddhism to, well, you name it. This feverish study of other beliefs tapered to a slight extent as time has gone on, and left me very spiritual...but not terribly religious. I have always thought faith was important, faith of any kind, and unlike a lot of former Christians, I have no special distaste or anger toward that faith - in fact, quite the opposite. So much so, that often in my arguments with atheists online I find myself defending the Christian banner to some extent. Anyway, I don't want to ramble. So as time has passed, I've found I am missing a central sort of belief, something greater than just a personal philosophy. And so, a good 15 years since the last time I'd called myself Christian, I think I'm interested in re-exploring the faith...at least insofar as principally following Jesus, and not so much the old testament...and with less stress on big churches and such, and more on action and doing good in the world. So here I am, I figured this was the best place to start and put out a hand. I could use some help, any help to point me in the right direction. I'm open to anything, and pretty well-versed to begin with...happy to discuss things here or via private message or email or whatever else. Thanks!
Depending on how much reading you want to do, I suggest Pope Benedict's "Jesus of Nazareth". Love em or hate em, he is an amazing scholar. This book is very dense. I have a hard time slogging through it. I also really liked Denis O. Lamoureux's "Evolutionary Creation". Albeit not really about Christianity in General, this tripple PhD (from whom I took a clas) outlines a very clear view of the world through a Christian theological perspective that many discount. I cannot really come up with a good interneet resource off the top of my head, but a blog I like is What Does the Prayer Really Say. Happy reading.
I'm curious, because I have a similiar background...I was raised Christian and the religion will always be ingrained in me to a certain extent, but i've explored other religions and I consider myself a spiritual person more so than a religious person...so i'm curious, what are you seeking in the Christian religion that makes you want to return to it?
I'll give all three of those a good look; thank you You know, I'm not quite sure. A longing for a more personal connection to my faith, I think...and maybe a touch of just having it instilled in me since birth; similar to what you described. Or maybe something else; I can't really put my finger on it. Well, I'm not so sure I want to utterly ignore it - just not base my life and philosophy on it.
What does it mean to be spiritual versus religious? Your last question might also be phrased, What did you not find in other religions that makes you want to reexamine the Christian religion? In regards to the blog Grim, I just want to specify that I generally agree with the author on the issues and not the majority of posters who are often, I find, spiteful. Fr Z has a wealth of knowledge, but often writes very frankly. His posts on Confession are specifically what drew me to the blog, but I stayed for other things.
You said you want to know where to begin. I reiterate - ignore the old testament at your beginning. Read and re-read Matthew and Mark. That's your beginning to being a Christian. There's so much there to meditate on - it's the words of Christ Himself in those 2 gospels. The old testament is not a literal record of actual events for the most part. The insistence on accepting it as such by most christian-industry clubs is the source of so much unhappiness with Christianity and confusion about it.
I'll keep that in mind too, Ukr. Any suggestion helps, so thank you all the same! ...and I was thinking to maybe start with those gospels, worldsofdarkblue, so I'll probably take your advice and begin there before stepping back and reading the whole testament. Anything else, guys? A particular type of church I should look for to attend services, any other web communities?
The Mystic Christ by Ethan Walker has been recommended highly to me, but I haven't as yet obtained a copy.
Catholic Seriously though, if you do a little bit of digging, I recommend looking for a parish that offers the Extraordinary Form of the Mass, that is to say the Latin Mass, just because it would be different even from what you remember. I have gone a few times to a Low Mass (priest and altar boy talk, but the congregation participates internally and prayerfully, which should happen anyways) and the experience was something I've never had before. Also seek out an Eastern Catholic (or Orthodox) Church. Those will be very different from the Novus Ordo Catholic Mass, but it in them that I become spiritually fulfilled. Barring that, your run of the mill Catholic parish.
One of the least controversial and gentle books I've read on the whole god issue is an interdisciplinary tract, "How to Find God", by Depak Chopra.
What did Christ say about morality that isn't already common sense? Do I consider it common sense because I am enculturated in a Judeo-Christian based society? Perhaps, but I dont think so... Most societies have ethics that are based on mutual altruism, the golden rule. This is why I don't understand why people make such a big deal of Christ's moral teachings. Sure they are good... but not particularly ground breaking... not to mention the evil deeds of his dad.. but I guess if you are Catholic you would believe that Yahweh (read: Jesus) flooded the earth, killing the majority of living things, then a few thousand years later, flip flopped, and Jesus (read: Yahweh) started preaching love and peace. You are devoid of something greater than personal philsophy. But what do you mean by that? Do you refer to the numinous? or like an emotional desire, or a lack of Self-actualization?
Reading your post I keep asking myself, why do feel you have to attend a formal church to be a Christian again? Funny story, I stopped attending church in my late teens for a number of reasons, I continued to study the Bible as well as other religous teachings and still read the Bible daily, anyway my wife finds great comfort in attending services every Sunday and it upset her greatly that I didn't. In an effort to make her feel better I decided I would give it another try. The funny part is the sermon for that Sunday was on the fact you did not have to attend church to be a Christain, boy was she upset. I know there are people that look down on me because of my feelings about formal church services, but doesn't that go against the very beliefs they say they follow, namely judging me for not attending. How I choose to serve is between me and god.
That's kind of how I see it. Jesus did a lot of good, but the OT scares me off the idea. really, the only thing I would say is that you shouldn't change what you already believe and feel to fit into a religion.
I'll look into this too, thank you You've been terribly helpful! I'll put it on the list, and hopefully pick it up tomorrow! Thank you! You know, I'm not really sure. A certain longing for a spiritual fulfillment that I don't have right now, and a desire to be connected to whomever or whatever God is. For whatever reason it is, I feel a certain comfort in teachings of Jesus - and always have, even when I wouldn't have even considered studying the faith again. Beyond that, I just feel a certain urge to do this - and I want to see it through. Oh no, I'm not trying to give off that feeling. While I miss and would enjoy the community and such of a formalized church; I'm not saying I -have- to be part of one. I just think finding something of a community in a local, physical sense might help me with all of this. Well that's just it, the more I think and meditate on it, the more I realize what I really believe and hope for sync up with the teachings of Jesus more than anything else. There are some things I want to study more closely and think on more deeply, of course, but I'll cross those bridges as we go. ...and I have no idea what I did to mess up the formatting in the quotes; but I can't fix it for the life of me.
Loving your enemies and praying for their welfare is common sense to you? Not resisting those who do harm to you is common sense to you? Giving away your extra clothing is common sense to you? Forgiving those who hurt you or steal from you is common sense to you? Taking no thought for tomorrow is common sense to you? Thinking with anger is as bad as doing in anger - common sense? Shall I go on or would you prefer to read His words for yourself?
Spirituailty to me is feeling God in the presence of nature. I was raised religious, but the only time I ever felt the presence of God during my church-attending years was when I went to a Christian camp and we were having what they called "quiet time" on top of a mountain. I was staring at the view off the mountain top and felt the spirit of God in the life surrounding me. I think this is the reason I turn to nature now when I want to talk to God. Religion to me is more about tradition. Its more about following certain teachings because they are part of the religion. Spirituality is something I don't need to think about or practice; its just something I feel inside. I don't know if I would refer to those things as common sense, because common sense is really relative to the culture in which one is raised. However, I do think most those examples fall under the Golden Rule, which is present in every religion and society:
I know, and I was responding with the point that while its not neccessarily common sense, its also not morals and ethics that are specific to christianity only.
Fair enough, common sense wasn't the best term to use. However, I am trying to convey that many of the moral teachings are self evident to me, as well as most other societies.
