Relationships and Sacrifices

I didn't say anything about changing one's self, I was talking about what one does for one's partner.

 

I trust people who realize sacrifice is selfish, like everything else. In which case, it becomes a matter of semantics whether sacrifice is truly sacrifice.

 

It depends on the stakes. When you're deciding between two restaurants yeah that can be considered simply a "choice", but when it's something like choosing between your job and a relationship it becomes a "sacrifice".

 

Choosing between a job and a relationship??????
Aren't those kinds of choices made well before entering the relationship?

(i.e the choice between "living to work" or "working to live")

 

Again,
Only value itself is perfectly valuable.

So,...
Would anyone feel guilty,
If they were truly honest about following their conscience?

Why should guilt be at the core of morality,
Why not a commonly held good?

Our actions should be separate from our nature?

I agree that,
There is a hierarchy,
Of things that are valued.
If not, sacrifice is meaningless.

Could you be more specific?

 

i think what mike means is that you should already have a philosophy of how you will either choose work, or choose love, before you even get into a relationship.

 

Either I don't understand what you are saying or I do not agree with this premise at all. There is no inherent value absent evaluation. Further evaluation in a moral sense is not needed to organize our lives. A mind without anxiety is wholly kind.

It is certainly possible for people to feel guilty for following their conscience in respect to the unanticipated effects of our actions. Many times you will hear the phrase, I didn't intend to hurt anyone.

There can never be a universal morality because helpful is a matter of timing. That which is suitable for one in one instance may not be suitable to another in the same instance. Moral character is a cultural affectation.

 

If there were a commonly held good, there would be no moral dilemmas. However there is what is true or real and what is not real or imaginary.

 

Of course our actions are separate from our nature.

(I'm not sure what is meant by "our nature". It can be used in many ways:
Dismissive "You didn't really mean that, its not in your nature." An appeal to pseudo-biology "Its every man's nature to rape." a synonym for "personality" are just three)

Consider the following situation, you've been pulled over for speeding, you are not happy, but nonetheless, you are polite to the officer writing the ticket, even though your nature may be leading you to an angry response.

Similarly, you can be nice even when you have a headache and are feeling grumpy.

I'm not sure about how you meant "our nature", but acting in a way that expresses ones better side rather than the side that is currently dominating one's feelings is common and a good thing (especially in relationships).

Acting better than you "really" are is a good thing. (Even if you hold that you "really" are what you do, not what you think or feel.)

 

If men naturally want to be direct,
Why wouldn't they want to be direct?

(By naturally, I'm mean without trying)

 

that's not sacrifice. doing stuff for your partner, to bring a smile to their face, to make them feel better, or to just do something for them for no reason at all whatsoever---of course you do things like that for the person you really care about. sacrifice is when one partner has to give up/change himself, his life in order to suit someone else's whims/ideals/whatever. and that is what i don't agree with.

 

I think that if you have really found "the one", you are willing to do anything just to make the other person happy and to make the relationship work. You will know it when it happens. Sometimes, when we are blinded by love, we tend to be irrational but if the other person loves us just the same as we do, they will not let us fall into the dark side.

 

Regardless of how people evaluate happiness,
Happiness is a commonly held ideal,
Which is naturally desired.

If being direct naturally makes a man happy,

And if being happy and being direct are equally desired (without trying),
Then being direct is being happy (they are equal).

But if being happy includes sacrificing being direct (e.g. trying to be tactful.)
Then happiness is more valuable than being indirect (they are hierarchical).

Therefore,

Happiness is both equal and hierarchical.

Some say that men naturally prefer hierarchical relationships,
And women naturally prefer equal relationships.
So they both could have a happy relationship,
Which is both hierarchical and equal,
(e.g. mutually sacrificing).

This could also explain how,
People can become friends with their parents.

I'm Catholic, and there is also something else personally interesting.

Saint Thomas Aquinas once wrote that happiness is God.
If happiness is hierarchical and equal,
It could help understand God,
(God is both a Father and a Son)
(Jesus is both God and man in one person).
We also believe that love is God (1 John 4:16).

 

The biggest sacrifice in a relationship is freedom.

 

Ain't it. Having to check on all the ex's I have detained in the basement. Really puts a cramp in ones style.