The whole suboxone/subutex less is more thing is totally bullshit. Im living proof because I have been puzzled by this "less is more" lately, and I sure what to get more effect out of my subutex, so I have been trying a large array of different doses. I have found this to be totally false, unless your talking like 8mg would be more effective than 32mg and in that case i wouldnt know because I wouldnt want to waste them by taking a dose that high. I usually take 2 doses of 4mg a day, I have dosed with every ROA possible; sublingual, intranasal, IV, and up the butt. Less is not more, 1mg is more effective than .5, 2mg is more effective than 1, 4mg is more effective than 2, 6mg is more effective than 4. The only reason I could think of this being true is in the case of suboxone because of the naloxone. Now I dont know why anyone would want to take suboxone over subutex, naloxone is garbage, there is nothing beneficial about it unless you are overdosed on heroin. And its cancerous. So does anyone want to shed a little light? Sure, I would LOVE to get more out of bupe, but taking LESS of it is definately not the key.
i think people want the naloxone because they're trying to kick opiates, not get as high as they can from subs.
Well if your addiction is so bad that you physically cannot control yourself from doing heroin, then I dont think you should be taking ANY opiates at all.
Less is never more for any drug. I think the naloxone is only in it to discourage people from banging it.
i've heard of subs having a ceiling, somewhere around 32-36mg, but i've never understood the whole "less is more" thing myself...
Im only guessing that this thread has something to do with something I may have said at some point. If so, The less is more subject of Suboxone is exactly what works for me. But instead of reading this some where, I stumbled on it kinda by accident. After proving to myself it worked for me, I went and serached for people who felt the same way. Now, how much of it is psychological, I have no idea. Seeing as how I accidentally found it to be true, for me, probably not very much. For those who have read it somewhere, or many times over, your head may play a bigger role, who knows. What everyone needs to keep in mind is that when I said Less is More, I did not go into detail concerning what I meant. So I will add that along with the links I have showing that my feelings are backed up by a bunch more than one or two!
Well Like i said above, I GUESS it was about something I said because on the thread less is more, I commented right after your comment in that thread that less is more when talking about SUBS, also saying It worked great for me. When I talked about less is more concerning Subs, I was used doing this in a forum of people who knew what I was talking about so Im guessing this is where the confusion is at. LESS is MORE is NOT about the affects of SUBS on someone dealing with what the med is for, which is to make the transition from dependentcy/Addiction of Opiates to Subs and keep you from getting sick, then of course the weening down of doses until you finish the program where u are off of all of it. What LESS is MORE is about is getting a BUZZ or Getting HIGH of Subs, nothing more. When taking perscribed doses, for most of us, that is 8MGs, the users rarely get high. However when Users started dropping doses down to 1.5MGs to .75MGs, they were finding that doses this low were in fact getting them high, Hence, Less is more. So, Im not sure what it is that you were looking for but if you are used to 4MG doses, them you trying .75 to 1 MG when you are taking a dose, it could pleasently surprise you. Does it work for everyone, probbably not, or not at the dose i mention above. But if you search you will find that there are a ton of us for whom it works great. Most people wouldnt really know this because people who start SUBS, the last thing they are thinking is getting high. Thats it, that is what Less is More is about concerning SUBS! I no longer feel this affect primarily because im just about at those doses. So it appears the the dose you could get high on needs to be a small percentage of your normal dose, I did it some much, lol, that I ended up leaving my dose that low.
Yeah im talking about getting as high as you can from them. I wish I was like that, it would save me alot of pills. For me 2mg feels like more than 1 4mg feels like more than 2 and so on. But, I also find that 4mg gets me the highest, if I were to take 6, i would feel like I was on 4, and so on.
when using suboxone to kick a habbit you want to take the smallest amount of subs for the shortest amount of time. suboxone wds are a bitch.. IME every bit as shitty as the drug your replacing it with. im 21 days clean from these evil things. after being on them for 30 months.
I think you'll find that WDs are commonly worse for extended release meds just due to the fact of the long half life, (subs being very long) and also due to the dose you jump at. Most experts will tell you that jumping off anything above 1MG/day, is not a good idea. When following a plan for stepped down, then off of SUBs, Most hit a wall at a certain dose, the average I would say is around 2MGs per day = 1mg in the am and 1mg in the pm, two doses a day, period!, any more or any less will be counter productive. Depending on the length of that wall, it could indeed screw up the plan you have been following, but as long as you have enough meds you should be able to keep on track. What happens to alot of people when they hit that wall, is since they cant seem to continue, they may actually increase their dose just due to finding the wall and getting no relief. I have followed the support provided by one guy whos name is Robert (link coming) who has a simple method of stepping you down and it works amazingly quick as long as you have the required amount of Subs to make it to the end. Keep in mind that YOUR plan will differ from all others. Its really nothing more than taking the dose you are on, and reducing 25% every 4(+-) days but it is extremely dependant on how you are feeling hour to hour, daily. So you have GOT TO commit to it above everything else and communicate with him openly and honestly. He allows you to do this by giving you, your own thread to communicate with him. This thread will be your keepsake so to speak and will show you how YOU got off SUBS with hardly any withdrawals! Sorry I ramble on alot but here is the link to the site where Robert does his magic(simple plan) and has gotten Dozens and more off of SUBs. I just dont have the SUBs i need to complete his program if I did i would have to use a SDP(Step Down Percentage) of 50%, LOL! LINK http://www.drugs.com/forum/suboxone-treatment/ Shouldnt have any problem finding Robert either to actually contact him or read some of his cases. Good Luck!
I used methadone for 19 days. only 20 mg a day from the last day I took subs, until 3days a go. I have very minor wd symptoms 3days after my last methadone dose, which is today. im very surprised im not sick.
prone maybe ur experience is different from bottlefeds because ur taking subutex IDK i havent tried out this method yet cause I dont take subs to often. I will say tho before i got on methadone when i was doing dope everyday I would take subs and no matter how many i took i'd still feel sick. Then i got on methadone when i was only 20 yrs old was on it for like a 2 years until last august when i got locked up for 3 months yea you guys think your suboxone witdrawl sucks try being on 90mgs of methadone for 2years and i was taking 5-10mgs of xanax for more then a year everyday and then kicking that cold turkey in jail omg that sucked so bad i thought i was going to fucking die anyway my point is now that i dont have much of an opiate tolerance the subs actually give me a nice buzz which is cool because i can get them for 5$ and get high off it 2-4xs.
I take SUbutex as well, used the word Suboxone which is more common. I snort most of my subs so Subutex made sense.!
See I havent been on them that long. And i dont plan to be. My dose now is 4mg twice a day which I really enjoy especially in comination with clonazapam. WHen I get to a point where tolerance prevents me from enjoying my subs, im gonna ween off. I use subutex too, i wont touch suboxone for many reasons
