I'm Considering converting to Islam.

IMO if you abandon reason in favor of dogma, you have already sunk your only lifeboat.





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Well, it has been a year and eight months since Omar posted his struggle to choose between nudism and Islam.
I have had a few months (off and on) to think about this myself.
I'll offer a few more thoughts.

If you become a part of almost any Islamic community in the world, Sunni, Shiite, Sufi, etc.. you will probably find that these expressions of Islam generally would argue that you must choose between social nudity (or family home nudity) and Islam.
So can you be a Muslim without joining one of these strict congregations? Go on your own?

What does it really mean to be a Muslim?
Sunni and Shiite agree on 5 key principles, called "pillars" of Islam.
While the wording is slightly different, the concept is the same.
So, what are the five pillars of Islam?

Shahadah (I profess that) there is no god except God and (I profess that) Muhammad is the Messenger of God."

Salat - prayers throughout the day, traditionally done five times.

Sawm - (times of fasting) The purpose of these fasts is to dedicate yourself to a season of seeking closeness to Allah, show him your reliance upon him and your thanks, take steps to turn away from your sin and if possible make restitution, undo the wrongs you have done others. And help those who are undergoing physical need of some sort.

Zakat - charitable giving.

Hajj - if possible, at least one trip to Mecca during your lifetime. Examine your motives carefully. It is for your spiritual growth and devotion, not to impress others.

Notice that none of these pillars require you follow one imam over another.
None forbid you to be liberal in interpretation.

Sure there will be those who don't like your kind of Islam, but it is not for them to judge. If you observe the five pillars in your heart and in your deeds, they must be silent about all else.

For some, nudism is just a shorthand way of saying that you like to be naked. But most of us regard it as more than being naked. For them, it is a philosophy that believes that the human body is good and decent with or without clothing.
In fact, nudists believe that it is healthier for body mind and spirit to be without clothing when weather and social conditions allow it. There is more to it than this, but I have summarized some of the points I hear most nudists emphasize.

As much as I like nudist philosophy, it is not a comprehensive world view. I have met nudists who are pagan, Wiccan, Christian, Buddhist, atheist, agnostic, Jewish. Most people feel the need to incorporate nudist ideals into a larger world view rather than attempting to live their life by nudist ethic alone. It is very rare, but I even hear about Muslim nudists in Istanbul for instance, although they are very badly misunderstood by most expressions of the faith and they have to be very discrete.

This last expression of nudist Islam is a very difficult path, but if that is what you truly believe, what other options are there?

Can we assume that you believe that the specific teachings of the Quran are spiritual in nature, not meant for literal observation in this day and time? And of course that includes the rules about clothing. Learn the purpose behind these teachings without feeling that you must slavishly carry it out to the letter. The goal of these teachings is modesty. If you can achieve modesty without clothing, then is that not enough?
I know that it is possible to lust for a woman whose body is covered from head to toe.
The state of your heart not what is before your eyes or on your body determines whether you are pure or impure.

You may someday find congregations that share this broader interpretation of Islam. But even among those who believe this way, nudist activity is so controversial that it small groups who meet in private.

 

Allah will help you in your struggle (amin)

Peace be on you.

Since you already know the basic teaching which includes:

[20:119] It is provided for thee that thou wilt not hunger therein, nor wilt thou be naked.

[20:120] And that thou wilt not thirst therein, nor wilt thou be exposed to the sun.

[7:27] O children of Adam! We have indeed sent down to you raiment to cover your shame, and to be an elegant dress; but the raiment of righteousness — that is the best. That is one of the Signs of Allah, that they may remember.

[46:14] Verily, those who say, ‘Our Lord is Allah,’ and then remain steadfast — no fear shall come upon them, nor shall they grieve.

Allah will help you in your struggle, as He promises.

http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/index.php

 

He doesn't feel shame about being nude. And he shouldn't.

 

Im to tired to read all the posts, so sorry if this is a repost..
I think that you should not take the Kuran and obey it word for word, because remember it was written in a different time, and the circumstances were different then.. Try to create a spiritual connection not a theoretical one like most people do. Islam or any other religion never tries to stop you from being who you are, it helps you create who you are.. There is no need to hurry, take your time, and time will give you the answer

 

what circumstances were they?

 

Hi Omar!
Maybe you should read THE BOOK OF WISDOM by Osho.(It is in PDF)
Real religion is what you do second by second, and moment to moment.
Not Organized religions made by man through History. And a temple is where
you are, you are the temple, not one built by cement.

It is historically known, that although the word Islam means peace, there is a lot of political violence in it. Prohet Mohamad was Iliterate and died before the Q'ran was finished in writing, so muslims finished it themselves.

You are not allowed to have Western values. No nakedness, no drinking,
and everyone who is not a muslim is an infidel.

Whoever talks or writes against Islam , like the author of the Satanic Verses, should be dogmatically punished or beheaded. No Rock 'n' Roll
internet, tv and electronic gadgets.

I think you should try and learn meditation, which is not based on religious beliefs, or dogma, simply going within yourself, into silence, not words only.
Try it, once you get the knack of it, you'll love it.

Good luck on your decision.

 

blahhhh

 

The extent of your freedom is measured by how much freedom you allow other people.

 

What did you decide Omar el Cubano?

 

I was forced to convert to islam or else I was going to go to prison.

My girlfriend got pregnant while we were in Kuwait and since pre martial sex is illegal under islam having a child out of wedlock is a go to prison offense (also you lose custody of the child and they end up in an orphanage). My wife and I got married immediately but you must be married for at least nine months by the time the child is born or they will not allow you to give birth in the hospital ( they require you show them your marriage license when you arrive to deliver). 100s of women die every year in the middle east because they are forced to give birth at home or in the back of a car and if there are any complications they are to scared to seek or are denied medical treatment.

So anyways we got married and then needed to get the date on our marriage liscense changed so that it showed we were married for more then nine months and the only way to do that was to convert to islam because the date can only be changed on a muslim marriage liscense. Even after all this was done it still took 10 months to get my son his birth certificate because of legal trouble with the local laws. And to add insult to injury you have only 2 months from the day of birth to complete all of your child's paperwork ( birth certificate, passport, visa, civil ID and health card) otherwise you start to accumulate $12 in fines per day for everyday after two months ( this is called karama). All told I accumulated $6000+ in fines not to mention $4000 in legal costs, had to convert to islam, get married, commit perjury just to get my son a birth certificate and to legally be able to call him my son.

This is what you get when you don't have a seperation of church and state.

 

for $10k+ you could have just flown somewhere else to get married or for the birth.

 

When my wife's employer found out she was pregnant he fired her (women in the middle east get 6 months paid maternity leave so most employers will just make up a reason to fire you so they don't have to pay it) and reported to the ministry of lavor the reason she was fired was she was illegally pregnant they put a travel ban on her ( her passport is flagged and she is not allowed to leave the country). The only thing that kept her and I out of prison right then and there is I was american and we get some special treatment for the whole saved their asses from Iraq back in the 1990s. If we were any other nationality we would not have faired so well.


And our lawyer assured us it would only take a month to fix everything and he could get us out of the fines. If I knew it would have cost 10k I would have found a way to smuggle her out of the country.

 

wow man, thats some cool fiction ..you should write a book now about all things wrong in the middle east

 

Stoney,
We can find things wrong with the way Islam is observed in various cultures and it is certain that not all individual practitioners of Islam can be his role model, so how can this help Omar?
How can he know where Islam stops and cultural expectations begin?
You cannot find a section of the Quran that says not to smoke cigarettes, and many Muslims do smoke, but is there enough guidance within its pages that he could figure out that smoking to such an extent that he goes to an early grave is an abuse of his body?

In Omar's case, he asked about being a nudist.
Maybe it would be better to find out what he thinks a nudist is before we say we are for it or against it.

When that question is settled, then and only then can we look at the Quran and see if it contains principles that would help him understand the issue of clothing and nudity.

Lastly, based on that knowledge he could then decide if there is a conflict between the way he lives and what Allah expects of him or not...

If Omar does convert to Islam, would that require that he also submit to the rules and teachings of Alawi, Sunni, Shiite, Kharijite or a subgroup of these?

Maybe he will find his own way.

 

I didn't say anything was wrong with the middle east... just telling the story of how I converted to islam. I broke the local laws and paid the price for it.

What exactly did I say that you think is fiction?

 

May I suggest you contact Irshad Manji, a reform-minded Muslim who has taken controversial stances on many issues.

https://www.irshadmanji.com/
http://www.************/irshadmanji

 

there's no such thing as 'reforms' in religion - else you go down the path of where the previous religions got distanced from the original teachings and decrees

the west may celebrate and elevate people like irshadmanji, she or many like her can take whatever stances - but they have no authority to do so

there's 2 sources in Islam for guidance on all issues - the holy quran and traditions of the prophet. a mufti (scholar) may be consulted on matters who can provide fatwa (opinion - based on shariah). an imam who leads prayers at mosques is not necessarily a mufti and has no authority to provide fatwas

 

When the original message of a faith has been diluted with doctrine which is based more on a political agenda than on spiritual integrity, yet is sold as spiritual message, steps must be taken in order to rid that faith of the corrupt doctrine. This has happened with just about every faith in the world that you can imagine. Christians and Jews have faced their fair share of corrupt doctrine and continue to do so! You could argue that Buddhism and Hinduism have endured the same, and so forth!

Islam is also not immune from this sort of dysfunction however! Sect such as the Wahhabi and Deobandi have done much to corrupt the faith! Oh, and that term 'Salafi' that many Wahhabis use to justify their dysfunction is FRAUDULENT! During the first 5 or 600 years after the faith's funding, Islam prevailed throughout Northern Africa as well as Southern and Southwestern Asia. It also made inroads into the East Indies.

Until about the 1100s or so, as many as 135 schools of thought prevailed within Islam. Sadly come around that time, Islam became polluted with doctrine that had to do with political expediency than spiritual integrity. OF the 135 schools of thought which existed before that time only four remained. The faith began becoming corrupted.

WHO ARE YOU TO SAY WHO HAS AND WHO HAS NOT THE AUTHORITY TO TAKE STANCES ON SPIRITUAL MATTERS!?! THAT'S DOWNRIGHT DESPICABLE!!! Say what you want about Irshad Manji, it is she and a host of others likened unto her that will deliver Islam out of ITS dark ages! Sorry, but right now, much of Islam is in a dysfunctional state. Moreover, but I don't see those like Bilal Philips, Yusuf Estes, Abdur Raheem Greene, Zakir Naik or anyone else likened unto their kind as being credible sources and authorities for the faith!

BTW just because some thought originated in 'the west' doesn't discredit it! Did you know that most of those who emigrate to the United States say they find themselves more free to practice their faith here than anyplace else in the world?

Some Middle Easterners and Northern Africans claim that we 'westerners' particularly here in the 'States are some of the most dysfunctional people in the world. While I realize we are far from being perfect and that we have a great deal to work on; as bad as it may be here, it is worse, sometimes much more so in other places of the world! Sadly; northern Africa, southern and southwestern Asia; are all prime examples, and the East Indies are not far behind! The difference is, because we are a free people, we're more honest about it!

I will not consult anyone whom I feel has a political axe to grind! I will ONLY consult those whom I feel can prove to me beyond any doubt that they are spiritually sound!

If when you say 'the Prophet's traditions' you mean Hadiths, once again, I have severe questions about what is contained in those writings. They contain plagiarism from Deuteronomy, Leviticus and the Talmud! http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598105.0
http://http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9599796.0


Check this out: http://www.scribd.com/doc/21055367/Quran-A-Reformist-Translation

Other websites I don't totally agree with, but find interesting:
http://www.quranists.org/
http://www.quranists.net/
http://ourbeacon.com/