Conclusive evidence that God does not exist

I constantly question the nature of existence. In fact, I've been doing it more and more lately thanks to the herb and my past psychedelic experiences.

I don't just blindly accept things. There is much in the way of proof of the spiritual realm. Particularly, I found Michael Harner's account in the psychedelic book "Higher Wisdom" to be riveting. I highly recommend checking it out.

I totally do understand where you're coming from, though. I myself would be an atheist if I didn't have the spiritual knowledge under my belt that I know to be true. The mind is a truly powerful thing, but the thing you have to realize is that our bodies are only suits. The reason we have a brain is because it'd otherwise be impossible for us to exist in the physical realm.

To me it didn't sound like he did the research outside of our cultural understanding of religion, which is why I commented the way I did.

Personally, I feel like evolution IS intelligent design. A higher power, God, created the universe and all existence. Then He chose to create life. Over time, we evolved and He chose us as the beings which would have access to advanced consciousness, and He grants us the keys to higher enlightenment.

I also don't see how such a belief would stand in the way of life on other planets as well. What if all life in the universe is part of one big ecosystem?

At this point, yes, I'm not sounding Biblical. But the Bible isn't all true.

It's a document written by enlightened men who many times received very accurate messages. The fact that the world is a sphere suspended in space, and that the sun and moon are celestial objects (not Gods themselves) originated from Christian mystics. The Bible also brings up ocean currents before modern science verified them. http://pleaseconvinceme.com/ has some really good info, as well as other equally as good stuff I can't remember off the top of my head.

But at other times, of course, The Bible's been far off the mark, mainly the Old Testament. Which is why I like reading the New Testament more, of course.

 

Just the fact there exist a building named WalMart has got to be sufficient proof that there is no God. WalMart has got to be derived from some ancient language meaning Trapped & Damned. There is no God, only hell on earth, in the form of strip malls and traffic. And this is just the 'nice' part of hell.

 

I know what you mean, I was huge dick before taking psychedelics for the first time, now I am just a dick.

As far as psychedelic experience can create more thoughts and make you see what you haven't noticed before, it can be a basis to tell that there is god, etc. etc.

Those were just chemical reactions in your brain. Sure it turned your mind upside town, destroying everything as you knew and opening your mind for new things.

But what is spirituality? I'd say it is a state of mind. It is used to describe what is going through your mind. Yet everything sits in your brain. It is you who create your own world.

I'm not religious in any matter, but I would call psychedelic experience spiritual, but not because there is some power or god, because it lets you get into your deepest places in mind.

How can you 'just know' that something is true. You can't 'just know'.
It is not a fact if it is not reasonable.

Bodies are suits for our brain. The process of working brain is called mind. Brain and nervous system steer the body. Where is spirituality here?

It would be possibile. We would develop different system of reacting to impulses.

There are brainless lifeforms, bacterias, insects.

We are just a more advanced lifeform.

What do you mean by cultural understanding of religion? I'd say I have not said anything which could be understood as 'explaining religion'. I was explaining phenomenons that are mistaken as 'religious experience', because they are not popular or too advanced.

Who created god?

How can you know what he choose, if you don't know him.

I think everything is part of some system of some sort. Not necessarly eco-system.

To me you are more of a spiritual person rather than 'strict christian'.

How can you determine what is true or false in bible? And why is bible important for you if you know it contains lies and false information?

Christian religion originated from pagan, roman, greek, judaism and probably many more.

I am sure that ancient people knew about ocean currents. Those are easy to observe.

I don't know why you call yourself christian. You are not one.

 

:2thumbsup:

I can't be sure if there is no god though. There is possibility. But it is far too low and we have better explanations.

If god exists, he should flood this shit again.

 

Just to state the obvious flying fly, since you talk so much about facts and knowing, spirituality has a lot to do with faith/belief and there is not always a point in debunking someone's thoughts on it by asking questions about how a person knows certain things or stating that he can't know such things. We all know some things are unknown (like what kind of answer do you expect to get on who created god? ) and demanding proof when discussing spirituality is sometimes silly when it is solely a matter of faith, belief and/or personal and religious convictions. I know some people are not satisfied by that but after all we're talking about spirituality.

 

My thought is if God exist (s)he should ignore all of our feeble thoughts and actions (like It is most likely doing). It would not make him seem evil from my pespective.

 

There actually is absolutely no proof of the spiritual realm. That 'spiritual' realm you speak of is just subjective experience. You can literally put on an electric helmet and have an out of body experience and feel like an omnipotent being is watching you. It's all in your brain, everything. And about the bible, it's a book, made by unintelligent mean. Read it, and of you're a decent critical reader, you'll understand. The stories are ridiculous, like a movie made by Michael bay. You believe an omnipotent benevolent being spoke to people in one of the most undeveloped countries in the world, instead of telling everyone there is a higher power and it loves all it's creations. I don't get it, I really don't. How can people believe a story that contradicts everything we know about the natural world? Being religious is cultural, not intuitive. Naturally we're a curious species, due to intelligence. What do you think religious texts were created for? Surely you think they're an enlightened text written by man who spoke to the creator of the universe and told them his set instructions. "do as I say or burn in hell." Come on, you can't believe someone so irrational. The whole 'good and evil' thing. There is no good and evil, there's good nature and bad nature, good nurture and bad nurture. Instincts for animals, and nurture for humans. Perturbed minds or intelligent minds. It still comes down to the environment. As nice and pleasing the thought is of 'picking your destiny', it's not true. Your environment shapes your mind, your brain processes the information, and it comes up with your conscious thoughts. There's thoughts you're just unable to think. The truth is, we're just a microscopic spec of dust in our galactic neighborhood.

 

^
Great, I'm not alone here.

 

One thing I forgot to add is the comment on how evolution is intelligent design. No evolution is a slow process that happens at the genetic level so the animal can flourish and proceed to exist in it's milieu. It's the reason why DNA has existed for over 3 billion years. Evolution implicitly shows that creation stories are just myth. Also, the universe has no intelligent design either. If god created the universe, he is one lazy fuck. All he did was split apart nothing into a positive and a negative. Not that complex, if it was, we wouldn't be able to comprehend it. We can measure everything that happened after 10 to the power of negative 43 seconds after the universe's inception. Nucleosynthesis started, space expanded faster than the speed of light, and of course, it took a pretty long time for stars and galaxies to form. No one can tell you exactly how these things happened with exactitude, but science is modest, and brilliantly precise.

 

Ah, naivety at it's best. Now see, this is what I was talking about when I was saying there's people who haven't done the research I have. No proof? Wow. Uhuh, yeah there's plenty of people in the world who can refute that. Not even with faith alone, but I'm talking about otherwise unexplainable and miraculous phenomena.

Also, to FlyingFly-the brain is part of the suit, because there's a lot of evidence to show that the brain is simply a filter. It's been estimated that our brain normally receives 11 million bits of information per second, but only processes 200. (National Geographic documentary-"Inside LSD")

Research on psilocybin mushrooms shows that psychedelics expand the mind by decreasing brain activity, shutting down the areas responsible for filtering our senses.

Hence, not only can psychedelics manifest your subconscious mind, but they can also allow you to experience more reality.

Also, I am a Christian. I believe Jesus died on the cross for my sins, and through Him I am saved. I also believe in tuning in to the "Kingdom of Heaven" inside us through the Holy Spirit.

Knowing what is true and what is not true comes from knowing God. I know He is full of peace, love and light.

I would continue debating you guys, but I see there's no point really. You haven't talked to the people I have, and you haven't looked at the sources I have. Heck, you haven't been where I've been!

God operates outside time. And while you may say I'm using an excuse, well I've had the fortune to experience that feeling while on psychedelics. It's unexplainable, but possible.

The universe is God's canvas. That means He was busy for a LONG time before He finally came around to us.

 

You actually had the confidence to post that and believe you know what you're talking about. First, psychedelics work by perturbing your nervous system/brain which cause the 'spiritual' effects. You think you can 'tap' into heaven via the holy spirit. That's ridiculous. I would laugh, but it's sad. The sources you look at are online sources, and a lot of 'Internet research' isn't valid. Psychedelics do not make you experience more of reality. Saying that there has been a study done that a hallucinogenic psychedelic makes you perceive more of reality has to be the dumbest thing I've ever read. Well, besides the fact that you believe a demigod was sent to earth on a suicide mission commanded by the creator of the universe to die for your right to masturbate. So 'god' decideded to have a kid, after he created humans, he made a human son, then sent him on a suicide mission? That makes sense? You don't want to debate because your beliefs get stigmatized. You don't have to keep replying, you have 'free will'. Haha.

 

See, I do psychedelics and drugs to experience spiritual feelings, and experiences great feelings. I don't say it's the work of god. After an acid trip, or a DMT trip, even though the feelings are 'spiritual' sometimes, it doesn't mean they have meaning. To say you know that a god exists outside of time, and outside of the universe, and you're so 'sure', makes you ignorant. How do you know an infinite being was never born, never dies, and always existent; an omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient being. How do you know? You don't.

 

You obviously haven't read "The Doors of Perception". Nor are you aware of the recent studies The Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS) has been doing. Nor the book "Higher Wisdom".

Psychedelics aren't just 'hallucinogens', and I believe they can make you experience more reality just as much as they can unlock imagination and the subconscious. It's all about how you use the tools.

Not even going to comment on the 'suicide mission' part.

 

...... Psychedelics are just drugs that perturb your nervous system/brain producing hallucinations, and different feelings. What you believe is wrong, how can a drug make you perceive more of reality? So you're actually saying that doing psychedelics makes you tap into another dimensions or help you to perceive things not normally perceived sober? I don't think you understand how imbecilic that sounds. And no, I haven't read a book about 'higher wisdom'. Wisdom is not defined by the drugs you do, or 'spiritual feelings' you've had. How does the association for psychedelic studys 'maps'. That doesn't even make sense.

 

It's called do the research, brah. Calling me an imbecile would mean Aldous Huxley was an imbecile, too.

MAPS is an acronym for the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies.

Remember, don't let your ego get to you.

 

You're not gong to comment on the suicide mission? God's omniscient, and all knowing, surely 'god' knew that Jesus was going to die if he created him. You don't have the intellectual capability of critically analyzing the reality of your religion. You were told it was right, you believe it's right. Simple as that.

 

No shit it's an acronym, how does that form maps? Why would I research something so ridiculous? I've already dabbled in the field of neuroscience, and I know how psychedelics effect the brain. All the Internet research in the world couldn't prove such ridiculous claims.

 

Yeah, you obviously haven't learned probably the number one lesson from psychedelics: EGO LOSS.

MAPS has nothing to do with actual maps. It's just an abbreviation because Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies is too long to say. I thought that was obvious.

Psychedelic research is fairly new because the government closed the doors on it back in the 60's when LSD became illegal. It's slowly opened them, though, to organizations like MAPS that are involved in legally conducting very modern and professional scientific research.

I can't even discuss with you the subject of God, when you're so insistent on blowing off such an obvious major force in the psychedelic movement. Screw off.

 

Aldous huxley was born in the last 1800's. It's 2012, parapsychology and mysticism has been debunked. It's a bullshit field, only respected by the gullible humans who think the paranormal could exist.