Abortion, (esp live birth abortions..)

Your attempt to sting back by saying 'find your own lies' kinda makes my point.

This is why the biggest rift in this topic features religion so prominently. It comes down to, at it's core, the question of the meaning of life.

 

How is this still going? Abortion is legal. I win. End of.

 

It isn't religion for me, it's gratitude. That I'm alive. I want that for others. I want others to care about that more.

 

i hear yaaaaa

 

It's my opinion and I do think abortion is murder, its ending a life without the life in questions consent.. I was never trying to 'deter' someone from thinking that abortion is okay, everybody is entitled to their opinion just as I am with mine. I've seen the bad side of things, I have seen my friend at the brink of suicide because she regretted what she did, and that is not nice, and she has to live with that forever.

I think, that if abortions were not so common, it wouldn't be as much of an issue for me. There are girls here that use it for contraception, laugh and joke about it like it is nothing when actually it could stop you from conceiving when you're ready in the future, and it could have long term psychological effects. In the UK they do them for free (not sure about the US) but when I was pregnant the amount of people asking, including doctors and midwives, whether I was going through with the pregnancy or not really makes me wonder how many people actually make these decisions with a fresh mind. If you are constantly bugged (especially young mums) about what you are doing, then your mind is going to be swamped with doubts and you could make the wrong choice without actually meaning to and regretting it.

The fact that abortion is such a widely available option, makes people less responsible in itself. The fact that a young teenage girl can have an abortion WITHOUT her parents knowing (in the UK this is the case), could put said teenage girl in the mindset that it doesn't matter who she sleeps with because there's always abortion when shit doesn't go to plan. This puts her in all kinds of danger.

And I do give a shit about life, who are you to tell me I don't? I can't cure world hunger amongst children, but I fucking wish I could, you really hit a nerve with that. I donate all of mine and my daughters old things to the womens refuge, a place where women and their children can run to when fleeing from harm, usually with nothing but the clothes on their backs. Or to my local council who work with under privileged families, not a lot of help I know but I do care, about everyone in this world. Don't tell me I don't give a shit.

 

I think what she was implying was government providing living resources and programs to help support single parents. Resources like shelter, food, electricity, childcare, and healthcare, not government to get rid of the fully born child.

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I think it's time I state my position on this issue.

I'm pro-choice, with conditions that if met, would switch me to the pro-life position if certain changes happen in society.

As someone else said, I too have noticed that the pro-lifers, generally speaking, are really more pro-birth and from there the views split in supporting programs to help the poor and single parents.

I don't think there is enough public support for a public system of caring for single parents and orphaned/foster children in the system now. Many lack guidance, good education, food, shelter, medical care, water, and a loving environment.

The fact that many families have believed that kicking/disowning their son or daughter out of the house for impregnating or becoming pregnant is counterproductive, doesn't get rid of the problem and instead gives the problem for society to solve and usually increases the poverty and homelessness rates.


I would love to see the day where society gets passed all the political fear mongering and slippery-slope fallacy based arguements and actually gets problems solved for the right reasons and not for re-election and $. Until the hypocrisy ends within the pro-life movement, I can't be pro-life, because they seem to be pro-life in name only.

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Even then you've got to address the pregnancies from rape and incest, and the abuses of how the government has deliberately slowed the approval process of getting an abortion procedure, in states that require this approval, to the point where the girl in question has already given birth.

It's a sad fact that the charity and understanding in this country doesn't meet the demand.

 

You both missed my point.

The conservative government wouldn't take care of these mothers and children because after it's out of the womb, they seemingly stop giving a shit. So yes, it's a great point, but it doesn't matter, because they don't care about taking care of citizens in desperate need.

 

I just dig it when canastyans tell us what our government cares about. Especially from one where the healthcare system is a failure. But that is off topic.

Heres liberal progressiveness for you. Lets go deep into government intervention about abortion. Let us have them tell the citizens which babies to keep, and which ones not to keep. And subsidize it. If there is noncompliance, lets just go for the whole mandated infertilization. Isn't that just a dispicable infrigement of liberties??? Yet liberal government is very much about making decisions for us.

 

No I totally got that point, and agree what you've pointed out. It's the foundation why I'm pro-choice, and doubt there is a genuine "pro-life" movement to begin with.

I don't know a single liberal who views this issue like that.

 

seems like all anyone body cares anout is the baby in womb......


the quality of life after birth doesn't matter, as long as it lives till birth after that if it dies of starvation/lack of healthcare/housing it doesn't matter right??

because that is a great quality of life

 

Actually, that would be ad hominem. Then followed up by hypocritically doing the same thing you're accusing them of; speaking about another country's government without knowing shit about the topic.

 

Did you just try to analyze my political views based on that post? LOL

Nice try.

I came here from the states and I'll tell you, I've heard more whiny bullshit from Americans bitching about Canadian Healthcare than Canadians bitching about Canadian Healthcare.

 

:rofl:

I guess we need to start preparing ourselves for the final right-wing moral frontier: "Life begins at erection!"

 

:rofl:

 

CalGirl is the only person on this topic that makes any sense. All of you Liberal/democrats have exposed yourselves as the ignorant, unethical and immoral government thugs you are.

Esp you goofygooberz. Is it the governments responsibility to take care of John and Kate + 10?? No!

By that logic the government should help everyone that makes stupid choices (Gambling, malinvestments, drug use etc.) Goverment bailouts all around!

 

It will not ever be illegal. I don't even see why that is in conversation anymore. The outrage is always toward the government: a government that hasn't banned it. Secondly, the focus is on the woman, and her freedom of choice. She has the choice to NOT abort as well. We should be encouraging that, not giving more reasons why abortion is a wonderful option.

 

I don't really think abortion is encouraged. Mamapeace said earlier in the thread it is basically encouraged in the UK so I'm sure it varies from culture to culture but in the United States I don't think I've ever really seen abortion encouraged. When people do get abortions its done very quietly and there is a lot of stigma attached.

Its a deeply personal decision.