Fed & State Check - Bipolar? Can't buy a Gun

I was just reading the mass of latest articles covering the row over gun laws, massacres by the criminally disturbed, the NRA verses Government & preserving the 2nd Amendment's right to bear arms & protect yourself against fascism & dictatorship; & pacifists & victims concerns. (I think we realize automatic weapons are not to kill deer; they are to fight alien powers in the event of a government breakdown.) The NRA says these new proposed laws would not have prevented Sandy Hook. Hey —neither will they prevent some wacko lacerating other students with an exacto knife or making a bomb out of a pressure cooker. Gun advocates have a point: "The only thing that protects from a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun". Let's face it, it is a violent World right now. The lion is not lying down with the lamb just yet.

My biggest shock was when the State of Texas (of all places) outlined specifically that the wacko list doesn't just cover those who have ever been institutionalized for mental problems. But also that a merely BIPOLAR person (new name for manic depressive) IS that kind of wacko. I disagree. The roughshod definition for that mania is that you have mood swings & when you get under stress you think weird thoughts. I mean, seriously, bipolar people would more often than not kill themselves. So, rope is still legal. But they can't have a right to carry & protect themselves. Bipolar is by no means schizo or violent. In fact most Creatives seem to possess that eccentric bent. And we seem to need them so much in Society that we put up with all the quirky musicians & painters & geeks...

I think the bottom line is & will always be: YOU CAN'T LEGISLATE RIGHTEOUSNESS! There's always somebody that is gonna manufacture a batch of something to mail their State Rep or grab some ad hoc weapon like a kitchen knife.

 

in today's world. it only takes one phone call to put a person into a mental unit. and whom is a danger to themselves. then, those people can pick on you for a life time and you cant do anything about it. youre mentally ill..

 

When a bi-polar person is in their manic state, they don't think about the consequences of their actions. All bi-polar people I've known were likely to blow up during arguments and had very tumultuous personal lives. I think that anyone with moderate to strong bi-polar disorder should not be allowed to carry.

That being said, it is among the most over-diagnosed disorders out there. Many psychiatrists seem to think that if a person has emotions, highs, lows, good days, or bad days, they are bi-polar.

I would say that technically, bi-polar people should not be able to carry. But realistically, that may not be the case.

 

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/15/158758286/the-law-and-reality-of-gun-access

"Timothy Courtois' family had been worried about him for weeks. They repeatedly told police in Biddeford, Maine, that the 49-year-old was off his meds for bipolar disorder. And police were also told he had guns. But still, because he wasn't doing anything that rose to the legal definition of imminent threat, police said their hands were tied.

"We're very limited — very, very limited to what we can do," says Biddeford Police Deputy Chief JoAnne Fisk. "Just because somebody has a hunch, we will investigate it. But everybody has rights, and you have the right to bear arms in this country."

It was both frustrating and a relief to police and the family when Courtois was finally arrested for speeding down the highway to what could have been a tragedy. Police found an AK-47, handguns and several boxes of ammunition in Courtois' car as he drove toward New Hampshire, he reportedly told police, to shoot a former employer.

Federal law bars gun sales to the mentally ill only if they've ever been deemed by a judge to be mentally incompetent or involuntarily committed. That may have been the case with Courtois, but states' reporting of such things to the federal database is spotty, and very often, it doesn't show up when a gun seller does a background check."

 

I guess, as with Pot, Federal Law Trumps State Law.

Nonetheless. Most people diagnosed with mental illnesses who are deemed unable to hold down a job receive SSI.

Among those, there are people who are required by law to have a designated Payee, who makes sure they get their money & use it on necessities of life & not squander it. They cannot manage it on their own.

There is another proportion of mental health benefit receivers who through a doctor's assessment are deemed able to be 'their own Payee', —in other words they will budget their money & use it wisely & not toss it into the air on a freeway overpass or spend it on crack.

So there is a large proportion people diagnosed who are not prone to violence, either to themselves & others. (The article mentions everyone's constitutional right to bear arms for self-defence.)

So this opens up a whole can of worms: What if a bipolar person is denied through a background check the right to own a handgun for self-defence when they knew they were in imminent danger of being attacked & they are attacked but are thereby defenseless.

Lawsuit.

 

October 23, 2012 - American Psychological Association
Myths and Realities About Bipolar Disorder

"APA: Is bipolar disorder on the rise or does it just seem that way because of frequent media coverage?

Dr. Youngstrom: Both may be true, but changes in the actual rate are likely to be in the small to medium range, whereas changes in clinical diagnosis and media attention are huge. Several studies have found that the rate of clinical diagnoses of bipolar disorder has increased markedly over the last 20 years, especially in children and teenagers. The media often present these as percentage increases, which exaggerates the appearance of change because the current generation of practitioners was not trained to look systematically for bipolar disorder in youths. When something is rarely or never diagnosed and then starts to be recognized, the change in the rates can be misleading*— 40 times more than something very small is still a small rate. A recent meta-analysis found no sign that the rates were increasing over the last 20 years. However, some of the risk factors associated with bipolar disorder, such as obesity, changes in diet, disruption of sleep and earlier onset of puberty, definitely have been increasing over the last few decades, so we cannot rule out the possibility that there is an increase in bipolar disorder. The increase is just much smaller than the changes in attention by the media and clinicians."

 

I said most over-diagnosed, not increasingly over-diagnosed..

 

As a recovering bipolar, it would be better for everyone if I didn't have a gun when I was falling into the huge manic states. (not that I had it, here no-one has private guns)

 

Most states already have this law on the books or are in the process of enacting a weapons under disability law. I highlighted two possible situations that would cover just about anybody... Interesting stuff.

 

Interesting + Some other Meanderings

On the flip side, who would be more threatened & least able to protect themselves than a person who is physically handicapped?

Yes, [last post] they are honing in on the drug thing. Well, felons aren't allowed to have guns anyway.

I think I mentioned it, but Texas was the State that made sure to spell 'bipolar' out as a bonafide nutcase scenario. I definitely know for a fact that not all bipolars are created equal. So that's a real broad-brushed law. I don't agree that 'one size fits all'. I think schizos would be the problem. Imagining enemies.

In California, where Reagan let all the wing-dings run amuck signing into law & letting them out of treatment facilities you've got way more than bipolar, —you've got ex-cons & prisoners who were released under their own cognizance from mental hospitals everywhere. Gangs & criminally insane as well. That's where a lot of the violence originates. Read http://www.edhat.com/ the police blotter. And the cops just take the position to let the homeless both go to jail. There's a 'transient tax' after all that the locals must pay. It's expensive enforcing that shit. Send them to jail for the weekend & collect from the State for a full month. (ahem)

But evidently, Reagan the Hero, saved Federal BigGover a lot of money by doing so. And they are talking publicly about modeling Federal Mental Health Care after (you guessed it) Kaliphornia. And now look at formerly peaceful places like Santa Barbara where you've got million dollar homes & movie stars & a homeless population of about 1/5 of the population of the city.

And they built a shrine to Ronald McDonald Reagan where all the Republicans & conservatives who make a fetish object out Ronny (photo op) 'Break Down that Wall Mr Gorbachev' Reagan can come & worship. It's practically on the Beach. You can see it from there right on State (It's main street). Must be where the Bushes got the idea for their own freakin LIbrary. (And they ran out of highways) But North Central Expressway will always be good ole IQ-75 —a tribute to GW's intellect no matter how many Bush Freeways they name after that clan. OMG —Jeb & those two daughters!? Haven't we had enough of that Dallas Dynasty?

A last thought is how you can be mental & required to have a payee (person who handles your SSI & makes sure you don't spend it on the 3rd of the month on your drunk friends & that you pay your bills). But you can have a doctor assess you as capable of handling your own check.

It might lead some to contact a lawyer that could assess a person & attest to the same. I mean, those guns laws are built around the self-defence issue of 'feeling a credible threat from someone'. That's where the right to carry was born. You won't have time for 'Ma ta go fetch the firearm' before this guy shoots you both.

How about just a note from my Mom?

 

You cannot cure BPD, right?

Well, I was diagnosed with it years ago, and it turns out the doctor's notes even said I didn't have it. Instead I have PTSD. So for years I was paying $400+ out of MY pocket for medication I never needed. And those meds were nasty for my body. I was supposed to have blood tests every two weeks. Also paid for out of my pocket. Well, I was NEVER told about the blood tests. NEVER. Ask a doctor about Paxil, Risperidol and Depakote and how important blood tests are.

 

Yeah, I have a family member who has gone through the same & is on all that same stuff. Way back he went manic & he got busted so he had to do probation & they make you take all this stuff, but then he continued because quitting gives him seizures & he doesn't find his behavior baseline because it has long ago drifted downstream. So he continues. Pisses me off because he goes to AA & doesn't drink but says he would be on drugs & alcohol if he wasn't on all these meds. But then he gets on peoples' case for drinking.

I mean, self medication on things that make you less social instead of more social suck. WTF for? So you can live in a private world? He's like in a hole like I was when they put me on zombie meds. But then my friends told me I was a walking corpse & I stopped. He doesn't get it. Lobotomy drugs. Lithium, Haldol & all those elephant-feet drugs... Thorazine... I wouldn't be so pissed off if he weren't being so selfrighteous about going to AA & trying to get everybody to go. And the only reason he is maintaining is because he's on all those heavy mind-controlling substances.

Stuff really has to kick your ass to give you seizures. FTS!

PS: Pot, booze all make you more social & they are natural. I found Anti-D's & Benzo's are enuf to control my BP. My Dad was the freaking poster child for Bipolar/manic depression & he was never on anything. Artist-types!

"Men of force are men of faults" —Have a better one.

Plus people who go out & commit gun crimes, duh, do they go thru background checks first? LOL! No they go to a gunshow & buy a semi & then the fuckers go shoot up some innocent people. We're talking self-defence here, not a military style self-offensive. They just go insane & decide to take other people down with them. Nuts. That's REAL Insanity! Not BPS...Later :mickey:

 

Honestly in my state they ask mental health issues on the form you fill out when buying guns. I have bought two and lied on the form. Did they check my medical record, no.

I have since sold one gun and let the police keep the other after a suicide attempt because it is in my best interest and personal safety that I do not have access to a gun.

I will never buy a gun again.

 

Hi Burnt, Haven't Seen You Post For Ages, Glad To See

Everything Is OK With You...



Cheers Glen.

 

:bigcry: See above... I'm just getting warmed up

 

The worse thing is the way friends think they are amateur psychologists all of a sudden & they are bipolar & you are bipolar & everyone is bipolar. I think they are sort of jealous of the commodity. Like, wow dude, you get money for that? I have mood swings too... They fail to see the gravity of being 'manic depressive' & suicidal much of the time & have those golden moments when things are going well where you feel you can rule the world. Jimi Hendrix proportion lows & highs. This is a condition way way way beyond ordinary mood swings that everybody has. Most people are not GREAT! So they don't know how far down you have to go to balance out your great artistic side or intellect or whatever it is you are gifted at in order to humble you. And they start spouting that 'we all have it' —even clinical psychologists who don't really understand or deal with people, they are simply beaurocratic number crunchers. Then to prove it one of the real BP's turns around & walks off their job or hops on a Harley drunk or shoots themselves to prove they are totally full of shit, & that no ordinary human being would go that far... And they are dead & everybody can't believe it. Suicide is in some people's DNA & I know a girl who has three in her immediate family. They are always on the edge, on the highwire way up or low wire way down. Friends don't get it that you have a hard time carrying on normal relationships & start playing 7-11 Psychology like some scratch-off card where they think they can call it. Then somebody dies because it puts them in that state to where... Well, even if you are you can't articulate it. The best I ever heard after years was, you get morbidly depressed & when under stress you think weird things. Real BP's act that shit out, so I wish they'd stop it. Cuz they really do believe they are that extreme personality at the time. And they become it. It's like getting into character. It's dangerous to play your friends like that because all the time that's one of the factor's pushing them to it & it's that they don't believe you. Catherine Zeta Jones? I bet she tried suicide & they just didn't say so. All of a sudden her husband is like dying of cancer & she goes off on the whole family, etc. I'm sure it helped them to put it in perspective but I don't think for one second the psychs made it up. Outsiders are just thinking they are pretending & then they start acting out. I have another near family who lives with it & one who died with it. I'm surprised yet a different one got through his whole life with it as talented as he was —absolute perfectionist. But man, the volcanic activity. This is not your normal person by any means. It's almost like if they don't become an actor or comedian or musician or artist they will never fit in for normal. Never. They often achieve things regular people can only dream of. And sometimes they die while walking that wire across the great canyon. Oh, and if they do they're planning another stunt. It's never the last emotional high. Everybody else stays home but this guy is up all night thinking about doing it until he does. All the amateurs shrinks stay home but this guy warned them they were pushing him into the twilight zone but they just went to bed cause they were normal. :banghead:

 

Yeah, so sorry, I bleed

 

The other day while looking at Facebook marketplace someone was selling a semi-automatic rifle. I called my local police station to report it. I would hate for that gun to fall into the wrong hands. The police officer told me that as long as it is a private sale it is perfectly legal in the state of Florida. That is fucked up and scared the shit out of me. Make me want to buy a pistol for protection now. The police officer also went as far as to say that we don't even have to have it registered, just as long as it is a PRIVATE sale. WTF is that?????

 

Hear in the USA if you buy a gun from a dealer , one with a f.f.l. you need to fill out a b.a.t.f. form . Any thing that is full auto takes a class 3 lic. I dont know how a sale done over the net would work . I did find these sites . http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/ http://www.gunbroker.com/Uzi-Guns/Browse.aspx?Keywords=Uzi http://www.uzi.com/ and this site http://hub.politicsnissues.org/hub/rkba

 

Welcome to America. Here you get freedom of (and from, if you wish) religion; freedom to speak your mind; the freedom from unlawful searches and seizures by the government; the right to an attorney if you are brought up on charges by the government; and in all of that you have to give some room for the rights of others such as the right to have a gun for self-defense or for hunting or for sport.

I don't like the bad guys having guns either, but sadly the bad guys are turning out (more often than not) to be the cops we ask for help, thus we have no choice but to be armed for our own protection.

Let me ask you this-
A man breaks into your home. What would you prefer?
a. to be found by the authorities dead, after being raped and strangled to death with your own pantyhose?
or
b. to be siting in front of detectives trying to explain why a burglar was found dead in your home with a bunch of holes in him?

Hey, if you like being a victim, that's fine. I don't know anyone that does, really. If you think that just giving what you own to the creep is good enough, think again. Giving people like that what they want is like giving milk to a stray cat. They'll come back. I can practically guarantee that.


And maybe that will never happen. It just so happens that some people are blessed with never being a victim in a crime. Very unlikely though.

And if you're armed and know how to use the gun, it's not a promise you'll never be a victim, but it certainly does even the odds quite a bit.

And if you still don't want to have a gun, that's fine. But what about those that do? You want to make sure the wrong people don't get the guns. Well, as I said earlier, there are bad cops out there. If anything you'd think they'd keep the bad guys off of "the force", but they don't.