How Could Anyone Deserve an 'ETERNITY' of Suffering?

Well, what you believe "hell" to be is not reasonable. What I believe hell to be is perfectly reasonable.

Well I've personally heard birds talking English and I've heard of animals talking with people in sign language. Also many scientists believe that both dolphins and elephants have their own languages and talk to each other. Is that unreasonable or is it only talking donkeys and snakes that are unreasonable?

As for many headed beasts, weren't they part of a visions and not of themselves reality?

Genocidal? Mankind brought death upon himself. Son murdering? Wasn't it mankind that put Jesus to death?

 

Yes, you are correct the earth is a mess but aren't there still those that say; "mankind can fix this"? If God were step in now and fix everything wouldn't those say; "if you had just given us just a little more time we could have fixed all those things"?

God is giving mankind the time to try and work it out their way without him and will only step in when no one will be able to say; "we could have fixed it with out God's help".

There will come a time when all will realize that only God can solve the problems we face. At that point there will be two groups of people, one will welcome God's help and the other will want destruction rather than except God's help. God will give them what they want.

 

It really helps if some research is done on the subject before forming opinions.

OK excuse me while I use the Internet but feel free to do your own research

1) *Gehenna* in the New Testament, where it is described as a place where both soul and body could be destroyed (Matthew 10:28) in *unquenchable fire* (Mark 9:43). The word is translated as either *hell* hell fire* in English versions.

Please note the commentary about both body and sould being destroyed.

2) The Book of Revelation contains the image of a *lake of fire* and *burning sulphur* where *the devil, the beast, and false prophet* will be "tormented day and night for ever and ever (Revelation 20:10) along with those who worship the beast or receive its mark (Revelation 14:11)

Jesus often speaks of *Gehenna* of *the unquenchable fire* reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he *will send his angels, and they will gather. . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire*, and that he will pronounce the condemnation: *Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!*

The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

Hell is a state to which the wicked are condemned, and in which they are deprived of the sight of God for all eternity, and are in dreadful torments.

 

"*Gehenna* in the New Testament, where it is described as a place where both soul and body could be destroyed"; if as you say the soul is destroyed in *Gehenna*, what exactly is being "tormented day and night for ever and ever"?
(Ezekiel 18:4) The soul that is sinning—it itself will die.

 

Eternal lake of fire is metabolism and no amount of your own sorting out can satisfy this unquenchable fire. The only thing that finds one in such a state is blaspheme against the holy spirit in men.

 

A lot of the views on what hell is or isn't come from the various protestant factions.

In most Protestant traditions, hell is the place created by God for the punishment of the devil and fallen angels (cf. Matthew 25:41), and those whose names are not written in the book of life (cf. Revelation 20:15). It is the final destiny of every person who does not receive salvation, where they will be punished for their sins. People will be consigned to hell after the last judgment.

One historic Protestant view of hell is expressed in the Westminster Confession (1646):"but the wicked, who know not God, and obey not the gospel of Jesus Christ, shall be cast into eternal torments, and punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power. " (Chapter XXXIII, Of the Last Judgment)According to the Alliance Commission on Unity & Truth among Evangelicals (ACUTE) the majority of Protestants have held that hell will be a place of unending conscious torment, both physical and spiritual.

If anyone spends any time researching the subject you tend to come back to good old fashioned english manipulation of everything for their own benefit. You really have to take protestantism with the proverbial grain of salt.

 

So do the 10 million children under 10 who starve and die of other preventable causes yearly.

If your God is about and doing nothing about that and you follow him then your standards are rather Satanic and so is your God.

He has no heart.

Regards
DL

 

Christians always say that God cannot mess with our free will but tend to forget all the killings God has done and those definitely screw with our free will choice to live.

Their Emperor God has no clothes and no reality.

Repair to our systems is up to man and religions are in the way.

Regards
DL

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ott15j2KwQ&feature=related"]God Killed Jesus (Responsibility & Christianity) - YouTube

When a God demands that we believe in Dr. Dolittle it is time to scrap that genocidal son murdering God as he is insane.

It was God's plan from the beginning to have Adam and Eve eat the forbidden fruit. This can be demonstrated by the fact that the bible says that Jesus "was crucified from the foundations of the Earth," that is to say, God planned to crucify Jesus as atonement for sin before he even created human beings or God damned sin.

1Peter 1:20 0 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

This indicates that Jesus had no choice.

If God had not intended humans to sin from the beginning, why did he build into the Creation this "solution" for sin? Why create a solution for a problem you do not anticipate?

God knew that the moment he said "don't eat from that tree," the die was cast. The eating was inevitable. Eve was merely following the plan.

This then begs the question.

What kind of God would plan and execute the murder of his own son when there was absolutely no need to?

Only an insane God. That’s who.

The cornerstone of Christianity is human sacrifice, thus showing it‘s immorality.

One of Christianity's highest form of immorality is what they have done to women.
They have denied them equality and subjugated them to men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqN8EYIIR3g&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dspWh9g3hU&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c0RFxXrYzg&feature=related

Regards
DL

 

Hi Buddy.
Does infinite torment for a finite sin sound anything like good justice or God-like justice to you?

Regards
DL

 

True

True, that is what most Protestant traditions are but that doesn't agree with what the Bible says. Even the two Scriptures you cited, talk about the "lake of fire" of fire and not hell. Interestingly If you look at Revelation 20:14 the scripture right above the scripture you cited you can see that the lake of fire is not hell seeing as hell is thrown into the lake of fire and the lake of fire is said to be the second death a second "hell".
Revelation 20:14-15
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

True but then a "majority" is not always correct, now is it.

True but then "protestantism" is mostly just revamped Catholicism, a "protest" against Catholicism, keeping most the incorrect teachings of Catholicism and not a return to the truth.

 

There is enough food produced on earth so that no one has to starve and because mankind is so greedy that it allows people to starve to death that's God's fault? Yeah right. It seems that it is your heart and standards that seem to have a Satanic twist.

 

So glad (read: grateful) that I found Metaphysics. I found that things that I always believed in my heart. Things like, "A God of Pure Love could never create a hell."
Hence, the only hell existing is the one we create in our own mind.
I asked a nun in 6th grade why would God need to send his son to redeem us since he's God, He could have just forgiven Adam and Eve. The nun beat me, told me that I was going to hell and I had no faith. Interestingly, she never answered my question.
Boy, was she wrong on all counts. I found a God who loves me all the time, who would never "condemn" me, who gave me Free Will. My freedom today is to make either "Wise" or "Unwise" choices. If I make unwise choices, I'm creating my own hell and will pay for this.
Terms like "right" and "wrong" are for children. The child learns that it's wrong to play in traffic. The adult knows the "wise" choice is to not play in traffic.
As for the Hitler example given previously, my Loving God will give him more chances until he gets it wisely. A Loving God doesn't Divinely Love only part of the time.
As for the Bible, the world would be so much better without it. God isn't in the Bible, God is in our hearts and minds, look for God there. Nor is "he" that old man in the sky, sitting on "his" throne," just waiting to judge us and send us to hell. That's a sad concept of a Loving God, but it's a great way to control the masses.
Always enjoyed how God changed "his" mind. One day, saying "An eye for an eye," and the next day saying, "Turn the other cheek." I never believed that a Loving God would want anyone to take an eye, nor that the same Loving and Eternal God would change "his" mind.
Oh yeah, one other thing I believe, God doesn't use the word "but."
As in, "I Love you but..."
Nah, God says I Love you.

 

I hate to tell you this but protestantism is really just religion made political. Sure perhaps there are some denominations of protestantism that are exceptions to the rule but the vast majority are only about materialism and empowering the state. That's because of the way their bible(s) are interpreted and taught.

Heck looking in the protestant window it certainly looks like they don't even worship God... They just worship a man and they do a lousy job following his examples and wisdom. At least the Catholics bring it back to the 3 aspects of God that can be seen by mankind and therefore they continue to worship the one true God.

And least we not forget that everytime that some wealthy protestant finds a dogma that isn't to their liking they just go out and start a new sect of protestantism. One which is more inline with their personal held opinions and beliefs.

 

I think you love to tell us that actually But nevertheless it's a gruesome oversimplification. I see much righteous intentions and sincere faith in the reasons of the original protestants, even if I don't agree with everything (iconoclast for example).

 

Of course it's an oversimplification but I've found that more often than not... The average person oversimplifies everything said or taught to them and herein lies the problem.

So arguably even if a very pious Baptist minister is 100% based in the correct interpretations of the dogma. Shortly after he conveys that message of correctness to his congregation, it will become oversimplified and therefore perverted. It's here where the insanity is played out...

In the case of protestants the dominate theme has always been political so consequently the ignorant masses "oversimplify out" the mediating message of God and become obsessed with empowering the state and materialism in an erroneous attempt to be pious.

For what it's worth, I see these same political rubbish played in mosque every day. Sadly the average Muslim doesn't appear to be any better than the average protestant. This leaves me to speculate which is worst in this world? Protestant and Muslim politicization of religion or Catholic apathy?

In the end all I try to do is make sure I pray 5 times every day and stay focused on helping those that are less fortunate than I am. Even a kind word can be an act of charity.

 

Many are called but few are chosen. A fish lays thousands of eggs of which only a few survive to reach maturity. Not because they are bad fish but simply because they had not endured to the end. We begin creature instilled with spirit in this world to become spirit breathing life into others. Or not. As we come into this world we live for and with each other and if we mature we become co creators with god. Life grows from the simple to the more complex.

The purpose of time to give you time to bring it to an end, that is to mature to fruition, but the time of this solar system itself comes to an end so there is a limit to our ability to tolerate suffering. We are in the world but not of it, The lake of fire is biological metabolism as spirit fanning body, breath carrying oxygen, creates a fire that consumes and is consumed.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are two diametrically opposed ways to interpret the bible and these are not a matter of specifics but of world view.

One way is that the material is culturally understood. Cultural understanding or cultural acceptance is based on how one conforms to varying degrees of taboo and hero worship the specifics of which endow cultural identity which is separate, distinct, and preferable to any other culture that doesn't share the same value system. From this perspective god is always on the side of the culture invoking him and against the enemies of that culture.
Cultural compliance is instilled by reward and punishment. Therefor god rewards and punishes.
Other artifices of this level of interpretation have us giving godlike devotion to a personality, i.e. jesus the only son god etc., hero worship.

Sound familiar?

The other way is esoteric, meaning hidden. It is not hidden from those who have an open mind but it is hidden to those who have this interpretation born to cultural indoctrination. This cultural interpretation also has us saying that sin is inherited.
If there is any detrimental effect from this cultural interpretation it is the end of the appearance of innocence, harmlessness. It certainly doesn't offend god but the very moment the inevitable probable emergence of a fearful thought appeared it was answered
with a dispelling truth, god loves his son.

 

Mankind is whatever your idiot God creates so if you have a complaint take it up with your genocidal son murderer.

Regards
DL

 

We are way to close for comfort.

Please answer carefully. Who is your God?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdSVl_HOo8Y"]1A Hidden Meanings In Bible - YouTube

If I am right, you will also name my God. Care to have a go?

I do not want you to think I am just playing a game with that question. I just think you will know because we are close.

Regards
DL

 

Silly people.

The transition from eye for an eye to love thine enemies shows the growth of the seed of empathy in the human species. At one point groups were bound together by virtue of common enemy and as we have tamed our fear of nature it is left now to tame our own animal. It's desire is for you but you must learn to master it and mastery is to pick ones life up and lay it down at will. That is go beyond reactive to being active and creative.

Moses gave the law to accommodate hardness of heart, to mitigate conflict until a time when the species had more matured.