Brexit

Wanting to control the demand for public services and the like isn’t racist. Basic economics

Insisting we need workers from Europe to work in our coffeehouses like numerous europhiles did before the referendum, that kind of is. Talk about patronising people...

And for the record, as a large contributor to the eu budget, as well as a popular choice of residents for Europeans, the U.K. is hit with a double edged sword in terms of migration.

In terms of trade, we are inhibited by common policies. And saying Europe trades on our behalf suitable with the rest of the world, free trade does not exists

It is highly protectionist. They claim to be for free trade but rather than raising tariffs they instead increased regulations. A back foot approach to unfair competition that people like trump have rightly accused the eu of doing.

Love Europe, hate the eu

 

And the Euro elections Brexit party won. The greens are not a remain party, they are an environmentally orientated one. Plaid and snp are independence parties. I know loads of older people in my area including family who voted Brexit and are labour because it’s in their bones. Change (nothing) uk was purely remain are did not show up.

 

Never heard before one of the primary jobs for the east european migrant workers was in coffeehouses?
Another idea for using foreign labour without having those workers move to the UK is to have them over temporarily one part of the year. You know, migrating seasonal workers. Most east europeans just want the proper paid work. They don't insist on moving here permanently

 

We should be critical on the EU (as well as on our own national governments naturally), and dislike/hate unfortunate decisions made by it. But why hate it as a whole? It's a work in progress and has many potential benefits. I don't like plenty of it neither. But that doesn't make me hate it as a whole.

 

Anna soubry and the like argues the need for eu workers in the non skilled sectors, they said repeatedly that ‘British people saw themselves as too good for the work’. Hard to believe someone out of work would think this. Anyways, my mentioning coffee shops Is just a silly joke aimed towards people who ponder all our Brexit woes over a decaf skinny vanilla latte no whip or foam as opposed to a simple cup of builders tea

 

As for the Eu as a working institution, since the euro and it’s pathetic monetary policy, id argue in principle nothing could work properly if the tail is wagging the dog of ‘ever closer union’

 

Hear Hear!
Hear Hear!

Yes slowly the UK is being morphed into a totalitarian European State with a European Army.
Heaven help us if we stay inside that dung hole of a union.
For me?

I Want To Be FREE of that great big Bureaucratic costing us a fortune dung heap!!

 

What else could be the reason a certain amount of unemployed british people turn down jobs like bending over picking crops all day for minimum wage (which is good pay for most east europeans)?

 

Ha Ha !
And who would you have vote For the leader of the conservative Party ?? Labour /Greens /lib Dems ?
We don't vote for a President in this country we vote for a party to govern the country and that party chooses a leader Didn't you know that ?

Look up "parliamentary Democracy " if your unsure !

 

Ha Ha poor Asmo !! You Asked Fuddy why he was Being a Dick Did you ?

So you came Back into the Thread to stick up for him Like Robin Hood Did you !

 

I came back reading the last page to see what's going on here now. Just to see you're avoiding proper responses and twisting stuff around as usual.

I will now only respond to you if you say something worthwile on topic. No time, patience or respect for 'convo partners' like you.

 

I never asked you for anything ? I don't know why your getting all twisted up about it Clearly something is bothering you ! But to be honest I really Don't care what You think so Chin up and stop Sulking on my behalf

 

Lol

 

Have you asked them if they would? I can’t speak for everyone I’m sure you can’t either...

And good pay or not it’s hardly aspirational. That’s more ignorant sounding than many of the racist things horrid right wingers say.

I guess the problem is we never grew how to crops in the U.K. before joining the Eu, clearly nobody was picking any. Suppose we have them to thank for a lot.

Viva Brussels. mea culpa

 

Being

Being most of this stuff has been covered did you read the thread before posting?

OK lets un pack this-

Not this old myth

What do you mean by ‘control the demand’ as said actually - The average European migrant arriving in the UK in 2016 will contribute £78,000 more than they take out in public services and benefits over their time spent in the UK (assuming a balanced national budget), …By comparison, the average UK citizen’s net lifetime contribution in this scenario is zero. (Oxford Economics)

We also already under EU rules EU migrants can stay for three months in which they cannot claim, to stay longer after that they have to be: in work; or actively seeking work with a genuine chance of being hired; or be able to show they have enough money not to be a burden on public services. Apart from that, evidence of benefit abuse or fraud is grounds to exclude or expel a person.

You then later admit that was made up – “Anyways, my mentioning coffee shops Is just a silly joke”

So it wasn’t others being patronising it was you been silly.

So what was your point?

The thing is that we have been using migrants in many positions for example large numbers work to keep the NHS going, because neoliberal policies in the UK have worked to cut the number of people been taught to cover those jobs.

Why blame the migrants for things that are the fault of right wing policies?

 

Being

But we also contribute less (per head of population) than some other EU countries such as Germany.

As for paying for EU membership well to repeat

I believe it cost somewhere close to 9 billion

But let’s put that in context - we spend:

145 billion on health

45 billion on defence

29 billion on transport

And 13 billion on overseas aid

For the 9 billion we get all the advantages of free trade with the EU members and with the EU trade deals with none EU countries along with a say in the regulations and policies set by the EU (unlike say Norway).

Some have put a figure of roughly £31bn-£92bn per year as the best estimate we have in terms of the additional value created to the UK economy through trade as a result of EU membership.

There is no such thing as ‘free trade’ even WTO is not free trade

But in what way is the EU stopping us trade? As pointed out Germany already exports more to China and India than we do.

What are we going to suddenly manufacture and sell outside the EU that we are not doing because we are in the EU?

Which specific regulations are you opposed to?

What do you mean by unfair competition?

Trump is imposing tariffs in a protectionist way so why are you citing him?

 

Being

This statement makes me thing you have not that much knowledge about the UK’s political parties.

What is ‘in their bones’?

I know of labour people that voted to remain and leave so what the fuck are you on about?

Can you cite the quote - ‘British people saw themselves as too good for the work’ I can’t find it connected to Anna Soubry? But she is a right wing politician so it’s possible.

I mean to me this idea of a scrounging benefit takers that think such work beneath them is a staple of the right wing media not remainers.

And I love a builder’s tea, PG is mine preference.

I’ve actually been a labourer and an agricultural worker, I grew up in the countryside and did a lot of farm work and later moved to towns and cities where I found work as a labourer (helped build Canary Wharf).

It’s wasn’t great pay but I learnt lot from it and met some great people.

Well a lot of agricultural work has been mechanised or automated since the 1970-80’s. It used to be that large numbers of the urban poor used to go into the countryside to pick fruit etc look up hop-picking.

The thing is why do you hate the EU?

I mean going on what you have said so far your views seem based on false or misleading anti-EU neoliberal propaganda.

 

Mal

Interesting so you don’t think the leadership has any influence on the direction and policies of the party?

So you think that something like Thatcherism would have happened if Margaret Thatcher had not won the 1975 leadership battle and say Willie Whitelaw had lead the Conservative Party instead of her?

Have you read any history?

 

I didn't say any of that !
Instead of asking me daft questions try reading what I posted