Would Adam and Jesus be equals? In his perfect sense, before he sinned, would Adam have been just as great or holy as Jesus?
hmm, well if you follow Christian theology, i would think no. Adam dind't know the difference between good and evil, but [assuming Lucifer wasn't lying and told Adam he would be like the gods] Jesus would know Good and Evil [either being from God, or because He is after Adam] so i dunno if that makes sense or not
Good question. You should check out the Muslim perspective on this too. As far as I understood, some Muslims say that since Adam was born sinless, and so was Jesus, then they are equals. (There's a great book called Islam in Focus by Abdalati.) Ahh...quite a conundrum for me as a Christian.
Only in the sense that both experienced sinlessness. However, Christ, as the Father's Wisdom, is eternally God. He is not created and shares equal glory, power, and honor with the Father. Adam was a man who was sinless (for a time). So no, they are not in any real sense "equal."
I agree, sort of, with Alsharad. Adam was sinless but ignorant. Jesus was sinless and wise, as he had been through the human drama, knew good and evil, but rose above it. Kind of like the prodigal son parable. The son who stayed at home is loved, but the son who was lost (sinful) but then later refound was even more greatly loved. Same with the parable about the lost sheep. When you return home, are refound (when you rise above good and evil, attain enlightenment) is is more than that innocense of a newborn child, because it is innocence that brings with it that added element of wisdom. This perspective assumes a human, non-divine Jesus, though. If you see Jesus as God, then how could Adam have been as good as that?
Perhaps your thinking about the argument against Jesus(peace be upon him) being divine? "The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was."[K 3.59] Thus, If Christ is speciell for having no father, then Adam(peace be upon him) should be even more speciell since he lacked both parents. Why make fowl out of one and fish of the other?
And that's where it doesnt make sense. Adam did know the difference between good and evil. God told them not to eat from the tree. Adam knew eating from the tree was against Gods will, it wasnt right. He was already aware of right and wrong, good and evil, before eating from the fruit that would give him that knowledge. I dont remember what verse it was, but doesnt it say somewhere in the bible that one Adam came to bring sin into the world, and another to take it away?
Adam didn't know that until after he ate the fruit. Remember, it was the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He had no idea what any of that was before he ate (raises a moral dilemma on God's part for punishing someone for acting in ignorance).
God warned him before he ate it. Before he did God said: do not eat it. It's wrong to eat the fruit, and Adam knew it was.
hmmm, that is a good point, i have never read genisis, so i couldn't argue either way--i wasn't aware if it said that Adam knew what he did was wrong prior to the act... the way one of my friends explained it was that yes, God told him to not eat it-so adam knew to not eat it, but didn't know why it was wrong to eat it but again i am not well versed in the Bible, especially the Old Testament, so i may be wrong
That is an assumption on your part. The Bible doesn't even have the part in it where God forbids them. My bible reads thusly: 1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?" 2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' " 4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." God said they would DIE, not that it was wrong or bad to eat it. And it turns out, the "evil" serpent was right, they didn't die (god lied). It seems more like God was trying to have them believe that the tree was poisonous (they weren't even supposed to touch it), but the serpent told them the truth. But it's clear they didn't know it was wrong to eat it, because they didn't know what "wrong" was, including the fact that they didn't even know they were naked.
Its not about the dying part, its about the 'not' part. You should not, because i say so. Its odd that God lies and Satan tells the truth, btw. Wasnt Satan like the liar above all liars?
"Because I said so" has never been a very good reason, especially for a child who has no understanding of or fear of the consequences (Adam and Eve being like children). How could they have known it would be wrong to defy God until AFTER eating the fruit and learning about right and wrong? And for the record, nowhere does it state that the Serpent is Satan, that's another assumption. It just says the serpent was the most clever animal. In related Semitic myths, the snake is a god/des of wisdom, because the shedding skin represents spiritual growth. And indeed, in this story, it is the Snake that brings wisdom to mankind. We should rather be angry at God, for trying to keep us in darkness. With things like this, I understand why the Gnostics thought the Old Testament God was evil.
" I have said ye are Gods, all of you are children of the most high.†Psalms, Ch. 82, Verse 6 John 13: 34 'A new commandment I give unto you. That you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another.' I interpret the second verse as meaning we should all treat each other with the respect and love that comes from accepting them as being equals. Truly believing that everyone is equal would lead to humility, compassion, and acceptance. I consider this as being unconditional love, which I sense when I read Jesus' message.
yeah, theres also another passage, i think from the gospel of thomas that says something like when you know yourselves, something something something, you will be greater than adam. Not sure what that means
The knowledge of truth and Maya. What is Maya? That you will die, and the oppurtunity for experiencing creative drama.
