I've noticed on some of the threads, especially ones concerning Viet Nam and the Middle East wars, that the term 'baby killers' is used to describe military personnel. I'm intrigued that such a term is used in a web-site whose forums are usually associated with people whose ideals would support abortion-on-demand. How is this differentiation made?
Who says that everybody here supports abortion? I think you'll find that's not the case. You're assuming quite a bit, actually. If you post on here more and get to know people, you'll find that there's a very wide variety of opinion on here.
I don't consider abortion like killing a baby. To me, human life starts at birth, not before (althought I am aware biologically it starts before birth). Also, circumstances are very important. Abortion is a sad but sometimes useful thing. You do realise a 14 years old teen can't take care of a baby, do you?
DQ - Read it again. Didn't say everyone. And you didn't leave an opinion. Any Color - Can you clarify your statement. You're aware it is, but it isn't??
'Baby killer' is a term designed to provoke an emotional response, so it's easier to dismiss something or someone as evil... but really, things are always more complex than that.
Misterrain - Good point about using the words to express a feeling. I agree some people use the term that way. However, when used in the context MOST accusers use, they are in reality attaching the act of 'baby killing' to the accused (especially by anti-war supporters), and it's a term that is missing when discussing support for abortion-on-demand where a baby is actually killed. Would that be paradoxical?
Before birth, there is life. But I don't consider the futur baby like a person yet. Abortion kills life, and should be used as rarely as possible, but it doesn't kill a person.
Are you suggesting that overseas babies aren't actually killed by military personnel? You know, when you bomb hospitals it's inevitable that you will kill some babies.
TFC - I appreciate your reading my post as closely as you have. Yes, overseas babies are killed when aggressive forces meet. And it is not limited to hospitals or wars. However, I would put forth that not all military actions, nor all military personnel are involved with events where a baby, or others for that matter, is/are killed. Conversely, a baby IS purposely killed for each action of conducting an abortion (yes, there are some who survive abortion attempts. Rare and not desired!) If you use your point, the death of a baby (or any non-combatant) through military action (what is today being called collateral damage) is inevitable (I'd say yes and no)? But is it the desired result? Again, conversely, in an abortion it IS the desired result. My question would be more directed at those who may consider the killing of babies in a war to be different from (or the same as) killing babies in a clinic and how the line is drawn! AnyColor - Could you expand on your statement that "Abortion kills life,... but it doesn't kill a person."?
While not a new term to the era, it was most widely used by anti war demonstrators referring to returning Vietnam veterans. You make an excellent point. By definition, every woman that has an abortion and every doctor that performs an abortion is a "baby killer". In retrospect a very very small percentage of returning soldiers from any war would be by definition, "baby killers". Also a slang term for birth control pills.
Gardener - ...and parents who leave their children in closed cars in the summer, etc...yes, there is a very long list of 'baby killers; some intentional, others not. But under the 'Hippie' forum, I am only asking about the comparison of some soldiers and all abortionists. And how does the inference of 'intentional' play into how you view 'baby killing' as it pertains to wars and abortions.
and maybe those who are taking on enemy fire from a village that happend to also have woman and children decided that thier own lives were worth taking a chance on defending themselves. Have to ask yourself if you were being attacked what would you do knowingly or unknowingly to save your life? I believe there is a correct answere, a phrase was brought about to create shock and help fuel ones agenda. Yes and in war when you hide in and around schools, hospitals and such, you take the chance of getting your civilians killed. I guess that is another thing we dont do here, our military bases are not next to those items. That and lack of proper medical help ect is a fantastic point. Cheers to you gardner Its alot easier to sit back in your warm house, safe from most outside forces and look down upon others who have to make a split second decision that lives are balanced upon. Wish all wars could be done out in a battlefield away from all civilians. Better yet, let the leaders decide fate over a game of chess and a fine brandy, it would be far more civil.
but were they less than 100 feet away from a civilian hospital or were those bases actually inside the grounds of a school, hospital, refugee camp ect?
Perhaps you should read this if what you are referring to is the allegation by Israelis that Hezbollah hides behind civilians, it just isn't true. http://www.canadiancoalition.com/forum/messages/18038.shtml
I assume women who miscarry...have ectopic pregnancy's.... must abort due to medical reasons...or mental illness(ie..women who takes medication for bi-polar or depression which could harm a fetus...but which with-out the mother could commit sucide or endanger herself) are also "baby-killers". Sigh...some people.
Labels suck. If you have such turmoil in your life that you need to label another human being and then belittle them with such barbaric words perhaps you should look inward and see why you are the way you are. Abortion is legal. Get over it. War is immoral. But it happens. Put a stop to both and you'll start a new war or wage one in the process. Try living your own life.
And if he was referring to Iraq, he should ask any combat veteran and they would tell him that it was standard practice for the Iraqi Army to position AAW and artillery near hospitals and schools, for insurgents to take hiding and stage attacks from schools and Mosques, and Fedayeen to slaughter civilians to insight fear. Neither of our points however have anything to do with the original posters topic. Simple answer to his question. By definition, some soldiers are "baby killers" and every mother that has an abortion and every doctor that performs an abortion is a "baby killer". What I believe the original poster was trying to point out, subtly, is the hypcrisy of the hippies that call war veterans baby killers, but openly support the act of abortion but do not consider abortionists baby killers.
