Boycott Citgo Oil and Jugo Chavez

Citgo oil is from Venezuela, and the dictator there is Jugo Chavez. He is anti American. He is a socialist extraudinair. He would love to see our way of life destroyed. Democratic countries like the US feel he is a threat to democracy in South America. I would boycott Citco if you can. I don't want to see America go towards socialism. I like being free to say Bush is an asshat or anything else I want to vent wether I believe it or not. Screw comunism and socialism. Save democracy; boycott Citco.

 

didn't he give the poor in new york free fuel for heat in the winter or something like that? i vaguely recall that people were really pissed about it....still don't understand why.

 

Why and how?

 

How would an economic system such as socialism oppose democracy? Or freedom? I dare say that there are a few socialist European countries which are just as free as the US, with better health care and a higher standard of living. Plus, the US is somewhat socialist already and that has not affected our way of life. If I am going to boycott oil, it is not due to Jugo Chavez.

Peace and love

 

Socialism takes away your individual freedoms and puts them in the hands of the government. Who do you trust to handle your health care better; a private doctor or some state run clinic. Do you want your government to do everything for you? If so you are heading towards powerlessness and self defeat.

 

How is that any different than now? I can only go to the doctors my insurance covers. If health care covered all treatments and payed for everyone, then why would it matter who I went to see? Socialism is an economic system and it isn't necessarily a dictatorship. One can have socialism and a healthy democracy. Look at Sweden. They have a mixed economy- both capitalism and socialism.

Peace and love

 

Trekker, Your example is a bad one. What happens when you cant afford the private doctor since they are all trying to make a profit alongside supposedly making you better? Not all state clinics or national health services resemble some sort of run down soviet system. IMO socialism takes away some priviledges from the wealthy and distributes them to the majority, the majority of people would be far better off and would gain freedoms they have never had.

 

It depends on what is more important ... freedom or equality.

 

Ooooooh bad news, Trekker. You're pitting a the totalitarian regime of George W. Bush against the social democracy of Jugo Chavez. The correct answer is:

Chavez, please. At least he doesn't hide behind the lie that he is there to help you by gradually taking away your rights.

Wake up Amerika! We're all already fucked. Most of us are too blind to see it or too dumb to recognize it.

 

I think HUGO is pretty damn cool. He is straight forward, says what he means. His whole thing seems to be about helping the poor. He has 80% of the population LUVIN' him! He actually spends TIME with his fans... Not everybody agrees with everything he does, but he seems to mean exceedingly well. He is no threat what so ever to us, but our government is a threat to him. And, yea, he gave cheap heating oil to folks in the USA. He's not anti-American at all. He's anti-big money/corporate/elite. I think a lot of us can relate to THAT... He doesn't have to try to make the US government look bad, they do it all on their own. They are just pissed because he had the balls to say that George Bush is the Devil or a DONKEY, and he belongs in the nut house. Well, he was RIGHT. We'd be in a lot better shape with Hugo in the white house than we are with George...

 

Trekker, you won't get ANYWHERE with even the most logical of arguments...almost everyone here subscribes to the "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" philosophy.

You're all so quick to DEMONIZE the U.S. and it's president for every little infraction against justice...yet you defend someone who is oh so much worse in those areas? Are you all aware that Chavez is in the process of reconstructing things in Venezuela that will make it IMPOSSIBLE for him to be removed or even voted out of office?

From:
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/10/30/113504.shtml?s=ic

And that election was so rigged in advance in favor of Chavez that the European Union (EU) refused to play an observer’s role, NewsMax reported at the time.

As NewsMax reported in August 2004, Thor Halvorssen, First Amendment scholar at The Commonwealth Foundation in New York and a Venezuelan citizen, spelled out a several of the election’s shocking irregularities, including:





<li>Thousands of voters, including Halvorssen, were mysteriously removed from the voting rolls.



<li>Citizenship was granted to half a million illegal aliens in a crude vote-buying scheme.



<li>Citizens were "migrated" away from their local polling places. One opposition leader was moved to a voting center in a city seven hours away. Another man, Miguel Romero, had for years voted in his neighborhood school in a Caracas suburb, but the Electoral Council computer indicated that he was to vote at the Venezuelan Embassy in Stockholm.



<li>Venezuelan diplomatic posts around the world "inexplicably ran out of passports. Many Venezuelan expatriates were thus prevented from returning to their country to vote,” said Halvorssen.

His report in the Wall Street Journal also disclosed that bands of Chavez’s thugs brutally assaulted citizens in Caracas who were peacefully protesting the rigged election results, and fired indiscriminately into the crowd.



A 61-year-old grandmother was shot in the back and killed, and Halvorssen’s own mother was shot and severely injured.


Now...HOW MANY people in this thread said they'd prefer Chavez over Bush? He sure is cool, eh earthmother?

He is a DICTATOR, and makes his own rules. Don't you bash Bush like there's no tomorrow for much less?


I wonder how many Chavez supporters in here would also come to the defense of Iranian president Ahmadinejad? I heard people praising the man after the little interview he did, just because he's a charismatic man (and an enemy of the U.S.)

 

That is the thing I've noticed more than anything else, there are two distinct and differing sides to the opinions. The media is either on his side or against him totally. The Venezuelans are either loving him or hating him, depending mostly on if they are rich or poor. Some people are seeing him as a savior and some as a demon. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground. I was quite interested in the "revolutionary" ideas happening there and researched things a bit by locating some expatriots from THIS country, and also some former natives and asking a lot of questions. Again, total division. I find THAT to be very strange, unless SOMEONE is not telling the truth, or the truth lands somewhere in the middle, or things are actually getting better for the majority and it threatens the rich and powerful, so they get all worked up and try to make things seem worse than they are. I find usually when there is SUCH division of opinion, then it is exactly that (opinion) and nothing more.

 

So it's all just a bunch of opinions flying through the air, is that it? No such thing as right and wrong anymore right? (actually according to the left, there isn't...go figure).

I just want to know what YOUR opinion is, particularly when it comes to the bold text in my last post?

And why is it that you're rushing to dismiss these events as opinions and heresay?

If someone asked you about the political climate of the U.S.A. I get the feeling you wouldn't be saying "oh, some people think George Bush is swell and others don't...they're all just opinions though".

 

My POINT is that there are such DIFFERING opinions that it is impossible to know for sure WHAT is the truth without GOING and living there yourself. And THEN, you could form an OPINION based on REALITY instead of biased information.

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119586925917802724.html?mod=todays_us_nonsub_page_one&apl=y&r=883463

Lil piece on student protest in Venezula.



http://opinionjournal.com/forms/get_email_page.html

Free subscription with the link

 

So earthmother you're saying that all of these news articles (and I could show you dozens....HUNDREDS) are fabricated and not true? They're not actual events, they're just opinions? Those people that protested against Chavez and then were shot dead in cold blood in the street...what of them, do they just symbolize more opinions?

Or is it a clear cut case of evil being done by an evil government?

You're saying that the opinion of the European union that the elections were completely invalid doesn't matter?

Liberalism is a mental disorder, and I'm sorry to say you're living proof. Calling your own president the Devil...then turning a blind eye to terrible injustice just because acknowledging it might make America actually seem like a pretty decent place.

 

Skip how could you POSSIBLY justify murder of innocents? People whose only offense was political dissent?

And what do you mean FINALLY gone too far...what about the 2004 elections that he OBVIOUSLY rigged like crazzzy? That's not enough for you?

From: http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/10/30/113504.shtml?s=ic

Exit polls showed that 58 percent of voters favored ousting Chavez and only 41 percent wanted him retained. But election officials conveniently reported that 58 percent of voters wanted to retain Chavez and 41 percent wanted him ousted. As a result, the staunchly anti-American friend of Fidel Castro remained in office.

I STILL hear people talking about how Bush stole the election, and what happened in Florida pales in comparison with Hugo's doings...

 

i believe michael savage may have already said something similar to this, but why is it that when bush does something hes a villan, then chavez or who ever does the same (or worse) he's considered a hero? anything the US does=bad. anything an anti american country does=good. that's the feeling i get here.
yes the man has done alot to help the poor of venezuela. but that doesn't excuse his consolidation of power. making himself president for life, censoring the opposition etc.
and before you blast me for using wikipedia as a source, know that all points in the article have reliable sources, some even have multiple ones.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Hugo_Ch%C3%A1vez

in summary...

>stole the 2004 election (him and bush arent so different it seems )

>dominates politics in a way similar to teh US after 9/11

>has passed a law which makes all private television and radio channels part of the state, able to decide schedules, programs and content. (yes, some of you will claim that bush and corporate america have done the same, but has your precious democracy now been shut off and replaced with speeches by bush and co.?)

in closing, what i am trying to say here is that chavez is a somewhat more extreme, more competent, spanish speaking version of george w bush who doesn't hate poor people. an asshole is an asshole is an asshole, period.

 

As it was pointed out, Chavez has given control of the media to the state. So Vz media cannot be trusted.