Buddhism and Drugs

I like a lot of the beliefs of Buddhism. However, I read in the FAQs that Buddhists don't believe in doing drugs. I believe that if a drug grows naturally in nature then it is OK to consume. For example, I believe it is OK to smoke marijuana and eat shrooms and peyote because they are all things of nature. I do not believe that it is good to do drugs like LSD and alcohol because they are like 'hacks' on nature. If something doesn't grow naturally then it just wasn't meant to be. What's the reason behind the whole 'don't do drugs' thing in Buddhism?

Some of the things that I've said may even change in the near future. I've been trying to find my 'place in life,' if you will, and I keep flip flopping back and forth between things.


Edit:
Oh shit, I completely missed the the "Buddhism and Marijuana" thread. That pretty much answers my questions. This can be deleted by an admin.

 

im a buddhist/hindu and i believe that certain drugs should be acceptable natural or not. Ive been experimenting with LSD lately and im so glad i did. i saw the godhead and a world that is there but we dont see in our normal perception of reality. once you see this world and know its there you are forever changed. seeing the world with a different light shined on it is amazing. im not abusing anything, im not harming myself or others. its justifiable.

 

"I believe that if a drug grows naturally in nature then it is OK to consume".


Here's one for you then. Au naturel, Hemlock, a common European herb.

This of course, is the counter argument: - )

 

There's one thing about Buddhism. It NEVER says you HAVE to Believe this or that ...

You can believe anything you wish... no one is stopping you... and that's quite apparent...

And everyone has every right to believe what they want. Here's the thing Buddhism does teach, however. Cause and effect. If you want Y result (effect) you do X (cause), i.e., you want people to hate you (effect), hate them (cause), or, you want to destroy your liver (effect), drink a lot of alcohol (cause), or, you want to burn your lungs up from the inside (effect), intentionally inhale burning materials (such as tobacco, et.al.) (cause).

Oh, here's a good one, you want to kill someone (effect), drink to intoxication and then drive a vehicle (cause). Oh, but wait, here's another way to kill someone (effect), do a lot of hallucinogens and then drive a vehicle, or play with a weapon in another persons presence (cause). That's are all really wonderful ways to attain Enlightenment.

What Buddhism does is teach people to rid themselves of the motivating factors of Greed, Ill-Will and Delusion. The fourth noble truth is the path to leads to this liberation ... namely ... Right View, Right Intention, Right Action, Right Speech, Right Livlihood, Right Effort, Right Mindfulness, and Right Concentration. Why are these called "Right", because they do not cause harm to other living beings, nor do they lead one to become a causal factor for harm in another living beings. There are three types of harm: Mental, Verbal, and Physical.

If someone were to take away your drugs, would you become angry?

If you had no drugs to take away, would one become angry for not having anything to take away?

If your mind is partially skewed from ingesting or inhaling intoxicants, and you loose your mindfulness and kill something, or steal something, or begin lying to people, or commit rape or have sexual relations with your best friends girl-friend (or boy-friend), or your best friend's wife (or husband) does this bring you happiness? Does it bring happiness to the one your doing these things to?

When is what you believe in no longer a belief, that is, when does it become a truth? After you've killed something? Try to imagine what it would be like to have your life taken from you by someone else under intoxicating influences. Try to imagine what it would be like to have someone steal from you because they were intoxicated not aware of the harm it would cause you. Try to imagine what it would be like to have someone mess around with your girl-friend/boy-friend/wife/husband sexually under the influence of intoxicants. Try to imagine what it would be like to have someone lying to you while intoxicated.

If you were a Christian, you would try to live by the rule of "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

But then back to the original statement ... Buddhism does not say you HAVE to do anything. It does say to get this you do that (not verbatim, but this is the entire idea of Dependent Origination). Example: Because of Ignorance (cause) we act (effect). If there was no ignorance there would be no action. Because of action (cause), consciousness (effect) arises. There would be no consciousness if there were no actions. This is the same as saying there would be no consciousness if there was no Ignorance, beause that which arises to cause consciousness itself would not arise. You don't want to go to jail for posession of narcotics (effect), don't posess (cause) narcotics. You dont want to posess narcotics, don't come into contact with it. If you don't want to come into contact with it, stay away from the places where it is.

Simple ... you want this ... do that ...

There's no "you can't do this...", and "you can't do that...". You can do A.N.Y.T.H.I.N.G you want to do while your practicing Buddhism ... BUT ... the desired result ... are you ready for that? And yes, even bad actions are desired. If they weren't one would not have done them to begin with, so the results are desired results from desired actions, and actions begin with intentions.

So, Justify all you want ... you're entitled to your own idea of things ... you have a right to believe anything you want ...

HTML:

 

says the person who has obviously not taken both...

Not that I'm disagreeing with your argument at all, just being a bastard really. I've actually used the same argument that since all of our resources come from earth nothing we have can be truly unnatural.

 

If we can only take what nature provides 'in the raw', then why not apply this to other areas of life too? So eat raw food, go naked etc. It's the same principle operating.

 

this is true. all drugs are natural. knowledge is a little thing that came along and aloud us to extract LSD and such. knowledge is great it's not unethical at all to do LSD because it does not grow "naturally". think of this. Natives all over prepare san pedro in a simple extraction method that results with a tea. Now, with more sophisticated technology we can extract alkaloids such as LSD out of ergotamine or flip LSA into LSD and shit like that. it's all about experience. There is nothing wrong with extracting anything or doing anything that does not grow in a natural state where we can consume it off the plant. If you have the knowledge to be able to bring the product into a usable existance then you deserve a taste of it.

 

i think the question about recreationally consuming neurotropic substances, whether in the context of buddhism, or anything else ism, is what the heck kind of gratification or anything else is being expected of them and why?

to me, they are just another distraction that economic intrests lure people in the direction of, away from the only real gratifications of creating and exploring, for the self serving and nothing bennifiting attraction of little green pieces of paper for other little green pieces of paper.

buddhism is, i think, among other things, and taoism even more so, and the keeping of indiginous traditions also to a signifigant degree, about NOT deceiving ourselves.

i can't really speak for buddhism, but for myself, its not about neurotropic substances being good or bad in an of themselves, but their being a nongratifying distraction, vail, smoke screen, deception, away from things that really do gratify. gratify the soul yes, that too, but even also, even immediate tangable and physical existence as well.

=^^=
.../\...

 

From a Buddhist philosophy there isn't a right or wrong. What you should ask is if it is ultimately helping you release from illusion, or if it's drawing you further into delusion.

If you rely on something other than Self for happiness, then ultimately that is bondage because it is impermanent and can/will be gone or taken away.

As Alan Watts said about drugs, "If you get the message, hang up the phone." Basically, once you've glimpsed that there is more to reality than normal waking state, explore it through meditation as the tool, not drugs.

 

Personally I believe drugs hinder my path to enlightenment and therefore do not take them. I don't know if they help or hinder. But meditation on its own can be just as effective as drugs.

 

That's the one thing I've liked about what I've read (about Buddhism) so far. It isn't all about how you should appear to others. It's about personal responsibilty and inner spirituality. I'm kinda slow learning this stuff (mainly because I was indoctrinated in christianity as a kid and teen) but I'm taking steps towards it

 

Great quote, and it describes perfectly one major reason why I stopped smoking weed. It's not because I think it's "evil", it's because I already "got the message". So there's no need for me to "hold on to the phone".

 

What if one could take "LSD"(action), expand consciousness(effect). You don't want to expand your consciousness, don't take the pill

 

Sorry Darrell but the reefer madness images you describe are effects of irresponsible use of drugs and don't address the experiences of those who are searching for answers to questions. Lsd is a tool that is useful for some people, just as meditation is for others. It helps in understanding the relatedness of things. It shows us the effects of repression. The "external" world is shown to be an illusion.

 

Certain drugs lend themselves to transcendent experiences which can truly help the Buddhism minded folks out there.

 

i totally just realized what that quote means wow that really is amazing.

 

While I agree that certain drugs can have a place in sprituality, this is still a tough question to answer. I won't say that the psychedelic experience can't make someone a better person, or allow them to realize something they didn't previously know. But in terms of Buddhism I really don't think drugs help as much as they hinder. For a few reasons:

Meditation is a practice which is meant to help a person connect to their true self. It's about looking inside and seeing your own behaviors and patterns for what they really are. Becoming more aware. LSD and other psychedelics may help a person see things for how they think they are. But it's important to recognize that you can't just take something and "see". It may show you a world you never knew, but Buddhism is about a path, about practice- not just "seeing".

The very fact that drugs are trying to be justified is another hinderance. Buddhists strive to end attachments. While this isn't a "give up everything at once" attitude, it's an attempt to begin to understand yourself so you can recognize when you're attached. If you try to argue or justify something, you're attached to it. You still desire it, and until you can admit that, you're still suffering (in the Buddhist sense of attachment).

That's just my view. As has been stated before, it doesn't matter what you believe in. As long as you understand cause and effect, and see where one cause leads to one effect, you can make any choice you like. It's all a matter of where you want to go.

 

As a former stoner, some practical reasons why I finally chose meditation over smoking weed:

a.) I don't have to worry about where to score some weed
b.) I don't have to worry about getting caught smoking
c.) I don't have to worry about failing a drug test
d.) Nobody's gonna arrest me for meditating
e.) I don't have to spend money to meditate.
f.) There's nothing I have to do. Just sit. Just walk. Just stand. Just breathe. Just be. That's it.

 

As a former stoner, some practical reasons why I finally chose meditation over smoking weed:

a.) I don't have to worry about where to score some weed
b.) I don't have to worry about getting caught smoking
c.) I don't have to worry about failing a drug test
d.) Nobody's gonna arrest me for meditating
e.) I don't have to spend money to meditate.
f.) There's nothing I have to do. Just sit. Just walk. Just stand. Just breathe. Just be. That's it.

 

I am just beginning to learn about Buddhism so please bear with me, but isn't it true that each person should be able to go about their own way in their practice?

Right and wrong are not concrete facts. Just because there is a law against something doesn't make it wrong, just as there isn't a law against something else makes it right. Things such as LSD might immensely help someone, while they might hinder someone else. Isn't it just personal experience?

I don't know anywhere that it says that you can't induce altered states of mind to help with anything. It all depends on the reason why you are using them. Things such as meth, alcohol, and heroin are not really going to help most people in any way at all. However drugs such as mushrooms, peyote, or LSD can greatly help someone if used properly and not just to get 'high.' Even marijuana can help one meditate or sort through things in their head, but people that take it just to get also hinder themselves.

I think that no thing in itself is bad, it all depends on how you use it to benefit you.