can everyone POTENTIALLY be saved?

duet chap 23


1 He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD. 2 A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD. 3 An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD for ever:

So, can people who are castrated never be saved? Can a bastard never enter into the congregation of the LORD? I'm not sure if Ammonite's and Moabite's still exist, but can they be saved if they are still around?

 

and why is the poor bastard punished? How can he be blamed for his father's indiscresions? What is the deal with punishing "unto the tenth generation", as if the later generations did something wrong?

The same problem exists with Original Sin, a stupid concept that because Adam and Eve transgressed (which can be argued, since they didn't know what they were doing was wrong until after the fact...), all future human beings are born stained with sin. What sick mind looks at a newborn child and sees a sinner?

 

Some believe it to be to the tenth REGENERATION, e.g. tenth reincarnation.

 

wasn't the meaning of bastard different back in the day...

 

Far as I know bastards always mean't someone who was born illegitamitly.

 

Why are you asking Christians this? We don't follow those traditions, the Jews do.
All this was changed in the NT...

Deutoronamy's 100% Torah.

 

[taken out]...

 

So why not just chuck the OT out altogether, as Jesus probably intended.

Reason is that without 'original sin' the whole notion of a sacrificial death has no meaning. Fact is, christians just pick out the bits of the OT that suits them, and struggle, to say the very least, to justify the bits which really refer to the tribal war god of the ancient Hebrews.

 

Matthew 13:52
He said to them, "Therefore every teacher of the law who has been instructed about the kingdom of heaven is like the owner of a house who brings out of his storeroom new treasures as well as old."

The O.T. is about the system of law.

The N.T. is about the kingdom of heaven.

Both are Good in different ways.

 

The OT is for reference and the descriptions of the 10 commandments.

Christians follow the ten commandments.

And it's AWSOME reference...

 

Salvation is offered to all but not all choose to accept it.

 

the first (larger) part of the "Literal Word of God" is just a reference? Just something to check in on, time to time, to clarify you're preferred, later part? If it's God's Word, all of it, then it isn't something you can pick and choose from, or use as a casual reference.

 

This raises the issue of grace vs. law. The idea seems to be that christians were supposed not to need any external law, as the grace of Christ living within would be a sufficient and indeed a superior guide to right action.
And Jesus broke many of the OT laws - forgiving the woman caught in adultery, healing on the sabbath etc.
And the 10 commandments are adequately summarized in Christ's 2 commandments to love God and love thy neighbour.

 

A book of mythology.

 

Yup. The law is there to provide drama. Grace transcends the law, so we don't have to worry about the drama if it gets to intense. Jesus just showed up to reassure (dramatically via death on a cross) the kids who didn't get taught that- they were only taught the drama side of life "You need to vote, you need to fight for what you want, you need to follow laws or you are screwed, don't do drugs or other pleasurable things cuz you will die, Satans gonna get ya."

 

Obeying God and doing good doesn't make us saved. Having a daily personal relationship saves us and enables us to obey and do good.

Paul said "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me".

 

erhmm so your word over rides God's?

It clearly states some people (listed in my first post) cannot enter into Gods congregation.

 

Why dont you stop trying to save souls and do something useful like try and save the planet

 

If you attempt to follow the new testament and the old testament at the same time and claim both as the word of God then you will have BIG problems. Rarely is it stated in the OT that the laws are ment to be universal and eternal. Whether from God or not the OT laws were intened for specific peoples to adress specific problems. Not even Orthodox Jews follow all of the laws.

It seems more often that folks use various bits from the OT to justify preconceived beliefs rather than actually believing in the OT law itself. Anyhow, Jesus fullfilled the OT laws so they no longer apply as laws to be obeyed. There is much in the OT that is good advice that should be followed, but it is as an old contract, perphas good advice but not legally binding. There is also much in the OT that is just plain nasty and horrible.