Finally, an issue all good Americans can unite on

Well, apparently the Federal Reserve is (and has always been) an illegal entity.

Watch and learn (and when you're done, comment!):

http://video.google.com/videoplay?d...2198&q=America:+From+freedom+to+fascism&hl=en

 

I don't see the big deal?

Oh no, our government is trying to control inflation.

 

So you don't think it's a big deal that America has put its wealth in the hands of private bankers???

 

Everybody seems to already individually.

I was under the impression that there were no huge private banks in the US because of size restrictions.

*I'm Canadian, and assume the Fed acts somewhat similarily to the BoC.

 

Good grief! Canadian or not, all assumations aside, it ought to be disgustingly easy to see that the Federal Reserve is bad business.

Handful of Private Bankers "Let us hold your money, and make it work better for everyone. *taps fingers ominously like Mr. Burns*"

Sheeple "Okay, if the big shots say so. At this point we don't believe we can handle our own business"

Private Bankers "Hey, this is working out great. We have all this power! What can we do to get more power? Wait! Let's MAKE more! We'll print gobs money with nothing to back it, inject it into the economy, devalue the dollar, and make people work even harder for less!"

Sheeple "Hey, this sucks. But they are only trying to control inflation. And look, I can get a car if I promise myself into slavery the rest of my life. Golly what a deal!"

Private Bankers "*cackle maniacly* Damn straight we control inflation! We INVENTED inflation, and we control EVERYTHING you do by making your time worth more ar less at our whim, for our gain. Here, have a car, have a house, we are only chargeing you fourty years of your life for it! *BWA HA HA*"

Really... It's never a good idea to give ANYBODY that much power over ANYTHING. Let alone people who eat, sleep and breathe the bottom dollar an entire NATION'S resources. Do some research... This whole country became a sham some time ago. Canada works under the same principles. I wish I could site some sources... But any person with half a brain can feel the monkey on their back and do a little digging and find their own.

 

This theory is complete garbage. I've been trying to get someone to back it up for a long time. Go ahead, explain how it works. Try reading through this thread first though, I'd like to hear something new.

http://www.hipforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=225937&page=1&pp=10

 

Can we keep the discussion on the topic of the documentary? Did any of you guys even watch it?

 

i've seen it, it's ok but it doesn't explain everything

 

I don't think ANY documentary covers EVERYTHING. It would probably be a pretty long video.

 

I didn't need to watch the video to know what you are talking about... Not everyone needs a titillating and shocking documentary to open their eyes to the fact that this country functions around a corrupt system. I've done my own research. I did watch the larger part of the video after my post, having heard good things about it. It is far from completely comprehensive, but I am thankful that it was made. Maybe it will open the eyes of some people, and urge them to dig deeper themselves.

As for staying on topic... What was said off topic? The Federal Reserve IS illegal, IS unfair, DOES rule the country, and IS making the world a shittier place to live, day by day. What comment are you looking for? The best most anyone can do is agree with the documentary that the Fed IS wrong, assuming that they have done reasearch and know what they are talking about. Or you can have people come in here screaming loud and long about how that's all a bunch of fooey, and our country is the best on the Earth.

Do you want people to rise up and say they will bring it all down? That would take a monumental wave of spontaneous KNOWledge throughout the entire country... I pray for the day that revolution comes.

 

1) How would one eliminate the Fed?

2) How many people would think that that change improved things?

To put it another way, are you saying that the president's pictures I keep in my wallet are no good? If so, what do you suggest I use to buy beer and will my pot growing friend (or landlord) agree with your substitute for Federal Reserve notes.

 

Mike, your above reply is such redneck-style garbage that I won't even waste my time addressing you further.

Ivory, you make a great point and my recommendation is to just keep truth-jamming this information down people's throats until it becomes common knowledge. Sometimes you have to force the horse to drink.

 

You are talking about whether it is wise to overturn the money system of this country. Why don't you want to talk about the real effects on people. The Federal Reserve system is what we use to transfer money among each other. Whether it is legitimate or not is one question. That it is what has worked for years and that changing from it will cause uneasyness and pain to many is part of the question of what to do about it. The Fed may be illegal, imoral and fattening, but its what we used to buy all our groceries last year.

(Its also the system that your IP provider wants you to use if you want continued internet access.)

 

MikeE... There is no simple solution, and to eliminate the Fed would mean eliminating our entire system of government. That might put some people's panties in a bunch, but really, if this country is going to get any better that's what needs to be done. As for how... Again I say no simple solution. People would have to GET OVER thinking that, even though this government is unjust, it get's the job done for now. That's the weak and ineffective thought of someone who is afraid of change. If we ever want to get away from the monster that hovers over all of us, it's going to take REAL change in the way things are done, plain and simple. An honest government would not use dishonest money to finance it's nation, MikeE.

Before the "Federal Government" conned people into thinking they had jurisdiction over the entire country, it was up to each individual state to regulate their own economy... This was long before the Federal Reserve ever came into existence. Like someone said somewhere in that documentary, the country got by without them from the time America became America up until 1913. The federal government started pushing their limits outside of DC(the only place where they have true jurisdiction, mind you) and people didn't fight back, and now look at us... They managed to put the final squeeze on each and every one of our lives, taking ultimate control, by setting up the Federal Reserve.

There are alternatives to Federal Reserve Notes. There are institutions set up printing money that have actual worth, printed on paper inbedded with silver and gold. I'm not positive of how they intend for it to work, but at least they are trying to make a difference. You're right, though, that most people/businesses wouldn't honor them... They are just as scared to change as it seems you are. You could always barter... It wouldn't work at Wal-Mart, but you could try it in the areas of your life where it makes sense. And there have been movements to try and set up a second economy, one that runs without the use of FRN. Look into it, man. There are options out there, if you are only willing to step ouside the box they have you thinking you are trapped in.

 

If you want to change things, you have to make sure that people get their groceries during the transition. Otherwise you won't have the people with you.

"Ignore their pain. It's good for them in the long run." can easily lead to the kind of oppression that you decry. (This is in addition to the arrogance implied in the attitude that "redneck"'s attitudes can be dismissed and that the common folk (not us, we're not common) need to be led by us folk who know what's best for the sheepul.

Remember, Stalin's collectivisation of the kulaks was intended for their own good. It led them from a bourgesois mentality to the high ground of socialist collectivism.

People who can ignore the pain they cause in others and dismiss it as "nessesary for progress" are dangerous.

 

I understand your point MikeE... If, all at once, the system were to collapse there would be a lot of suffering people. And it's probably safe to say that the transition away from the way things are done now would NOT be an easy one... There would definitely be turmoil, and people having a hard time getting by. I am by no means ignoring the pain and suffering of those people. And have you taken into account the pain and suffering of the millions who, under the current system, don't get their groceries? The people who can't pay their utility bills? The children stuck in poor schools with underpaid teachers, who have little or no time to spend with their overworked and underpaid parents? And when those chldren do eat, it is bologna on white bread because it's all their mom or dad can afford?

I am very compassionate person, and I care deeply for the people who are effected by the way the sytem currently works. My family has always struggled. And my children and their children will struggle too, if change is not implemented. If anyone is ignoring the pain of the people at the bottom, it is our government as it stands. I agree... Casting aside the opinion of others and labeling them in a crude way is right along the lines of what needs to be avoided. I do not support Exposethetruth in his comment on "rednecks" that need not be paid attention to. My ultimate goal, and that of Exposethetruth I'm sure, is not to pretend like I know what is best for the "sheeple" and lead them by the nose to where I think they ought to be, but to show them information so that they can educate themselves and be better armed to decide FOR THEMSELVES where they need to be.

BUT, I will take a stand and tell people when they are letting their fear get the best of them. When the system so OBVIOUSLY isn't working, and people turn their face from the problem because, for the time being, they have food on their plate... I can't help but get passionate about what I know and believe, and urge those very people to look up, stare the problem in the face, and make changes or die trying. What kind of life will our grandchildren face if we don't? Caring only for our own asses in this one moment is selfish and weak. I'd gladly suffer for my babies, and their babies, and all babies that are ever going to be born in this world. People have a right to be free. If you think we are free now, I urge you to re-evaluate your stance and educate yourself, instead of saying that nothing can be done and getting defensive over whether or not you get your cheeseburger tonight.

 

To bring things back to the thread of the Fed. I don't think that it is as much a problem as some do. Carnegie, Rockerfeller, Mellon and DuPont did their thing on a gold standard. Historicaly oppressors have operated in all economic set-ups. It's people who oppress, not the system.

The governmental/economic problem I see as greatest is the court decision that corporations are "persons" and have the same rights as us meat people.

 

The people you stated are people who from the beginning, and still today, use the system to oppress. Initially they might have used the gold standard to get things running, but does it look like it's running that way today?

The problem you stated is intimately tied into the Fed... Again, I will urge you to do your research. In order for the Federal Reserve to gain complete power over the government, they had to have things function under their medium... Money. In the early thirties in came the Uniform Commercial Code/International Law Merchant... These are our laws today. Not the Constitution. And as you can plainly see... Uniform COMMERCIAL Code. Our laws are based entirely on us "meat people" being commercial entities. YOU are a corporation my friend, and they only see you as they money they can make off of you. It's not that corporations are seen as the same as people, it's that they defined us all under the same word... "Persons"... in order to make us all rulable under the same laws in order to suck us all dry. To them, you are the same as Wal-Mart... A venture to make capital off of.

From the UCC, Article One...

"Person" means an individual, corporation, business trust, estate, trust, partnership, limited liability company, association, joint venture, government, governmental subdivision, agency, or instrumentality, public corporation, or any other legal or commercial entity.

Do your research my friend.

 

I was thinking back to the Supreme Court decision that allowed JCPennys into a community that had restricitions that would have kept them out. 'Fourty's I think.

 

You neglect to see the bigger picture. Of course it sucks that JcPenny was able to move into a small community and mess up their economy... BUT THIS IS HAPPENING ALL OVER OUR COUNTRY, EVERY DAMN DAY!!! Because of the Federal Reserve and it's place at the top of the American foodchain. You'd have your fricken groceries, and those people would have their small town economy, and everyone would have more freedom if the Federal Reserve were gone. Good grief...