"I Prefer We Not Talk About It"

For a long time I've been trying to rationalize and let things be but lately it's becoming more and more of a burden.

There is a very close person to me with whom I share a lot of mutual affection and even love, to an extent. I say "to an extent" because there is one thing he never speaks about, and it has to do with his ex-wife, and his life then before I came along.

Perhaps I feel I have to get this out somewhere and it's not necessarily me looking for a solution but more of having it out. Maybe there are others who can emphathize, maybe not.

We are not an official couple, we have not been open about our relationship to our friends and family. In many ways, it's very restrained, and for a long time it's suited us both. Neither of us wanted something that much more. We either lacked the emotional capability or just wanted to be in it for the comfort. That was all.

Why then is it starting to bother me that he is uncomfortable speaking about his past? It wasn't a girlfriend of some odd years. It was a woman whom he married, and had one child with.

I have asked him twice - once when we started getting to know each other and he firmly shut the door in my face (metaphorically speaking), and second, about a year later when it was almost like he was pleading with me to for me to please not force him to speak about it. He sounded very apologetic and afraid that he would be pushed into a corner or that it would upset me and he would have no choice but to tell me. Of course I did not push it, and I let it be. Some things should come out on their own, or maybe not at all.

I was also wondering, would this sort of situation be a dealbreaker for you?

There are some days where we enjoy each others' company and things are all right. And there are others where I want to crawl in a hole and not see him because somehow it seems like much of it is an illusion.

Does not officially being an item give me no right to know?

As a very good friend, does it give me a right to be upset not knowing?

Or is it my duty to be patient with this thing he can't speak about? It has been about a year, and I feel shut out from a very large part of his life. At times I wonder how he accept all my affection or lavish so much affection on me without at all questioning the way I have.

It feels at times that I'm a distraction and there is a great limitation as to how much he can give. There are too many bolts and chains on this door, and it feels draining, lonely, and plain peculiar being on the other side, having no clue. Perhaps I'm being selfish. But I've been unselfish and letting the matter alone for a long time. I'm just tired now.

Have there been instances where you have felt your patience was stretched to the max, where you were shut out completely, deliberately? Did it pay off to wait? Or did it end up being a dealbreaker because not knowing discredits your whole friendship or relationship?

 

Hi Hannah

Well I like to say little about some of my past.
( Strangely the girl youd just advised me about , always loved to nose about mine!lol)

The truth is a difficult thing.
Theres no obligation to tell the truth about your pre relat past.( and its best not to lie either)
But then theres no obligation to have a relat with someone.

4 things make people open up

drink , drugs , walking ( yes people open up more when walking - partly cos they can avoid eye contact , or make silences less noticeable) , and talking about similar things.

Maybe he thinks knowing about this will weaken your relationship , so that he thinks would make him daft if he discussed it with you.

Maybe saying " I dont wanna talk about it" means "I want you to find out".
Maybe it really means " Its absolutely a waste of time us discussing it because youd think so much less of me , unfairly"

So sure you maybe upset , but hes thinking "this'll upset her less".

DEFINITELY it shouldnt be a deal breaker.
Know him for what he is now.We all change.

Maybe he was a gangster ,undercover cop , spy ( does he wear cream macinitoshes
and read newspapers outside the museum: ) ??), or a love cheat , or a cross dresser ( LOL Imagine that !!!), , cokehead , or an alcoholic or whatever.

If I wanted to find out about someone , Id try and talk about parallel areas.
eg if you suspected hed been a gangster. Ask him when youre watching a cops programme , "were u ever tempted to go into that".
If he says "well some of my friends were into all that" , then maybe youve struck his secret!
PS if youre a cop , and do this , Im giving you very bad karma!lol
Next step ,go out , get him drunk and go for a walk .
But try and soften him up with the "parallel discussion" approach.

You have to be subtle and just slip questions into otherwise normal conversation , and dont think u can rumble him straightaway.

Somethings , it may be hes better keeping secret - for both of u.
I mean would you really wanna know if in a "moment of madness" he did something really weird.
We can all change.Thats what you have to believe.

Does this post make any sense?

Best wishes and good luck!

 

lol Thanks for that. I love your humour. Yes, I understand about some things better left in the dark. But this was marriage and a kid. How does one pretend that part of a good friend's or partner's life doesn't exist?

I don't insist on anything, and I would not ever demand an answer. I also know that all good things end and one day I want to remember all of this for the joy and laughter, rather than have what is short-lived be tinged with hurt, frustration or anyone being uncomfortable. There is too much good in this for me not to smile at the end of the day. But the thoughts still come back and I'm not sure if by not getting to the bottom of it, I end up lying to myself with an illusion. - that perhaps he's not the person I thought he was.

I guess it comes down to faith too, and trust. It's a pity he can't seem to do the same. I like your suggestions about being subtle but he's got a sharp wit. I don't want to trap him or coerce him. I don't think I would even want to spend that much time thinking about how to go about it. But it's still there. I may not feel comfortable doing anything about it, but neither am I comfortable not saying something about it. I'm just chilling out right now, and finding other distractions, living life. Anyway, I hope all that made sense.

 

Hi Hannah

Ok , personally I dont think u can even consider finishing it for him not opening up.
You might disagree , but I just think that would be very very cruel.
I dont think theres lack of trust , theres fear .

You think his past is relevant to your relat?
Thats a tough one.

As an example.
I have a friend who has 2 entirely separate circles of friends.He never lets em overlap.
One set is all white collar , navy suited lawyers and bankers.
The other prefers dark sunglasses , polo shirts , jackets and gold chains , as a method of attire.
Now should my friend tell any of his "other halfs" about the sunglasses friends?
In my view , only if she can handle the truth.

Back to the point,
You worry he was a bad husband / father.
Should he lie and say he was brilliant? No.
Should he tell you every thing he did wrong?No.
Charecter assassinate his ex wife when she cant say it was mutual fault or respond?No IMO

Can you accept him being unfaithful to his wife?Are you SURE if you said yes?

I think , you must accept that people can change after making mistakes.
Otherwise I dont think youre being fair with him.

At a good moment , why dont you should shrug your shoulders and say
"Its alright if you saw someone else when you were married. I wont think any the less of you.Its not like its some dark sinister secret"

Maybe thatll relieve a weight from both your backs.
But try not to drag up the details.Guys arent into relationship stuff like guys.
Hes not a page in a gossip magazine , and he hasnt commited murder ( well Im assuming so anyway !LOL)

And youre not trying to get him to sign a death warrant for your relat.
( Well I think thats right??!! lol)

Anyway best of luck with it
PS atleast youve got his bloody number !lol

 

Yes, some people change but it's rarely the one's that push everything under the carpet and avoid it all that do. The people that do change are strong enough to deal with their past because you can't truely move on until then.

If you're just good friends, then I wouldn't really push it. He's a big boy and can deal with his baggage how he likes. If he one day hands you a ring - then you can push him.

 

Selfstyled, Lmao.. You did it again. Crazy british blokes. Thanks also. (and you WILL get her number, I'm sure of it). I understand what you're saying, and I agree with you - it would be unfair to leave him high and dry, and I would not do that. I do cherish him as a friend, and there are other aspects to our relationship - lots to talk about, lots to do. This is just one part, however blotched out.

A little background: His exwife/wife/mother of his child is still alive, and when I asked if he was "once married", he replied with only a "yes". He was rather stiff lipped about it though, and I wouldn't take it entirely that they are divorced. Perhaps they are not, and are only separated. This possibility bothers me. I don't want all these shared affections if that's the case. I feel so strongly about it, I'm willing to distance myself.

And the fact that he may be still technically married, and yet he has the gall to come to me, makes me utterly sick. I would vomit. Yes, people make mistakes, but how about being fair to me or other women he has dated or would date? To be your own person without complicating someone else into your messy strings.

Fortunately (I think) I have a bit more faith than that. And thank you, Body Electric. I won't push it. However I still get twists in my stomach whenever he is sweet in a non-platonic sense or when we flirt. My blood runs cold.

 

I disagree. If I was going to be with someone, I want to know where they have been. This is more of a case perhaps of morals, interests and values, than anything. If he is still married, it's rather cowardly and selfish that he could make his moves on me without any thought for anyone but himself, and his own needs.

The thing is, his life IS my business when I'M expending time and energy to do things a normal friend would not do for him. Just as he has every right to know that I don't have other lovers on the side.

 

No, you do not have a right to know about his past.
You do have a right to socialize with anyone to whatever degree you want to. AND you don't need anyone's approval of the standards by which you choose the degree of your association.

To put it another way, he can tell you as much or as little as he wants to.
You can blow him off for whatever reason you want to.

Just because you do him extrodinary favors does not make his life your buisness. If you don't like it, stop doing the favors.

Your wanting to know does not obligate him to tell you.

 

While I don't exactly think it is your right to know, I can understand why you are curious and I would have to wonder why he is closing this part of his past off. Maybe it is something that he just hasn't been able to deal with yet himself.

My situation was something like this. I got married when I was 18, realized the mistake soon after. I got divorced when I had just turned 21. Honestly, I was extremely embarassed of my mistake, and because I stubbornly didn't listen to people who were trying to prevent me from making it. I just wanted the past behind me. I really tried to forget about it and pretend that it didn't exist. We had no children (I made sure that woudn't happen), and we had no assests, basically no strings at all whatsoever. So I never really saw the point to bring it up to people unless we were in a close relationship and I felt the person needed to know. But even then I wasn't as forthcoming with info. I mean to be divorced at 21 doesn't always conjure up the best images for most people. I really didn't want to be judged for it.

Actually, I've been with Jeremy for over 5 years now and it wasn't until recently that I felt like I could talk to him about it and he could understand. He never pushed this issue, but he had mentioned a few times that I never talk about my ex. See, it wasn't that I didn't want to talk about it, it was that most people don't understand my reasons for getting married in the first place. I didn't want to talk to certain people about it. I didn't get married for love. Most people don't understand why I don't have any feelings at all toward my ex. Aside from that, there really isn't much to say about the situation.

I'm thinking that your guy hasn't dealt with the issue yet and maybe doesn't know how to. Maybe he thinks he is protecting you, or his child, or himself by not letting you in on that aspect. If you really can't talk to him about it and get him to open up, then you have two options the way I see it: you can either wait and be patient like Jeremy was for me, or you can take a step back from this person because they are not being completely honest with you, as you would like for them to be.

Good luck.

 

Hannah , some people are married in paperwork only.

My friend is married but separated , and I asked him why the hell is he , after all the shit she gave him.Shes living in his house , and he lives 20 odd miles away from it , and his work , with his sister.
He said something about it being easier to divorce after 2 years.

I was a bit baffled but you do see it happen in England , and Id assume American common law is similar.
Maybe people think the financial side is easier when the heat has gone out of the split?I think there are other legal issues.

If its any consolation , hes probably really tortured himself over what secret it is
- and tortured himself over you.
If he is married ( and its surely in name only) he probably thought "I'll tell her on the weekend " , then it was "next weekend" and so on , til it got harder and harder , and just reached farce proportions.

Id say , hes carrying a huge burden.Why dont you try and help him with it?
At the moment he cant win , he most likely thinks you never speak to him again if he is married , and *maybe* youll go off him if he keeps quiet.
So what does he do ? Go for the "maybe" - and keep quiet - even if the burden gets heavier and heavier.

So why dont you offer to share the burden of his secret with you.
Promise him you wont get mad or stop seeing him .
Makes any sense?

Good luck

 

It sounds like he has a very healthy outlook on the past.
If he does not want to talk about it why would you not honor that if you love him?
Why is it that much a deal with you?
I avoid talking about my past relationships as much as I can since they are the past and over and have nothingto do with my current love.
If someone is talking about the past they are most of the time stuck there and far from OVER that relationship.
The past is the past and over-and as far as that being a deal breaker-honestly if I were HIM it would be a deal breaker that you keep pushing me to talk about something I don't choose to talk about.

 

I agree. But for me, it is different when there's a child and past marriage involved. Perhaps those things are mere accessories for you along the way? It certainly is not the case for me. Thanks for your input though.

 

Great point. Thank you.

 

I really appreciate that you took the time to share your own experiences. And your insight definitely helps. I don't see it as my right to know about his past at all, but at some point something feels funny. And I wish that posters would actually read my sentiments and understand that I'm not some subversive, controlling bitch. I won't bulldoze my way through.. but at the same time I do feel unsettled. You're very brave to withstand the criticism from others and I'm glad to hear about your new relationship.

 

Magnum, you're the only one who's given me advice on breaking through to him somehow. Thanks for the insight, and taking the time to read through my posts repeatedly! I'm going to try and be the patient person but also keep my distance. It's not in me to pry too much so I can't say I'll be comfortable working in subtle questions. As I said earlier, he does have a very sharp wit and the last thing I ever ever want to do is break his trust. Though I think for my own good, I'm going to keep things at arm's length.

I also can't make promises about not getting mad or stopping seeing him. That's to make false promises, and the reason I want to know is not just for the sake of knowing... it's because I want to know specifically if I can see myself being with someone who might not be who I thought he was. I hope this is a bit clearer. If it means feeling hurt or angry, and breaking things off, then that's what it'll be.

 

Hannah , maybe there isnt enough info here , but so far youre just friends , maybe friends who've "done things together".

Also , its not completely clear if he was married or that he might still be living with her , or in a relat with her.I'm reading that youre saying he was married in the past and may still be in name only.

At the end of the day , he hasnt lied to you.He said "Id prefer not to talk about it" and you acquiesed - carried on the same.
I dont think at your stage of relat he was morally obliged to tell you.And you never insisted he did.

What youve got ( like we all seem to have) is a breakdown in communication or breakdown of understanding.

Do you go round his house?Im assuming it doesnt look like a married couple's house with a child there?This is suggesting hes separated , atleast.

From what I see , I think it would be very cruel to finish with him just for not having told you of his , from what I see , past relationship.
After all , you arent a complete "couple" yet, correct?

If you havent had time to think about the possible facts ( eg the possib of him being married in name only) and you might make a snap (angry)decision , then it doesnt look a good time , from his point of view to tell you.
Why should he play whats effectively a form of Russian Roulette when he wants reassurance from you?

Why dont you try and accept the possibility he may be married in name only , then ask him to confirm that *when* you feel you can reassure him it wont destroy your relat.

I still think he's carrying a burden rather than someone deliberately trying to mislead you.
On what Ive read ,I honestly dont think hes intended to treat you badly.
I dont think what he hasnt done makes him a bad or untrustworthy person.
Im not condemning you , just think you shouldnt do anything rashly which might be hard /impossible to repair.
Best of luck!
Self Styled

 

LOL No they are not accessories and I have three kids who now have a step Dad who is really a great guy. We all even get along as friends since none of is INSECURE about it.
We talk about what's going on now in our lives.
It's important that everyone MOVE ON in their lives and not allow the past to taint what's going on now.
What would you like him to do? I'm sorry maybe I don't understand your OP?
Do you want him to sit down and tell you how much it hurt him?
What it was like?
How he is upset his kids are most likley hurting?
all by products of a divorce for all involved. You come to a point where you need to stop talking about it and move on in a healthy way. To me it sounds like he is at that point but you want to review it all with him?

 

Very true, thanks. I didn't mean doing anything rashly though you're right, I would definitely be angry. And you're also right again about the breakdown in communication. He's a great guy... a "safe guy", to be honest. Nothing like the rascals I've dated in the past, extremely responsible, considerate, affectionate. - Which makes this situation even more peculiar. I honestly believe that he's been holding on to this secret or hurt for so long it's become a kind of comfort for him. That's what I can't stand, in theory, but what I'm trying to be patient with, in practice.

The issue is, it's a big problem (to me) if he is married in any way - name only or not. I see where you're coming from but I don't think we agree on the matter that a "name only" position is "okay". For me, it definitely is not. If he sees things as being ok, I sincerely do not think it will work at all. No matter how wonderful a person he is, I cannot compromise my own beliefs for this. I've thought about it long and hard. It will not happen.

It's rather a catch 22 - We can't move forward because of this inbetween. And I "don't have a right" to demand anything because we're not officially a couple. Does this make sense?

As I mentioned earlier also, I'm getting tired, colder. My mind starts to wander more when I'm with him even though at the moment, I seem to still have residual emotions left.

 

No, I don't want a detailed description of everything. Some people are happy not knowing anything, but I am not. If I'm with someone, I want to know how something like a child or a marriage happened along the way, I want to know for myself so that I'm not a complete clueless dolt when I'm around family dinners. I want to know because I do not believe in loving someone blindly.

I'd like him to share it because honestly it doesn't even seem like he's capable of letting go of that kind of hurt. How can I start a life with someone, or a long term relationship, who is not in it 100%? Not the way I put myself in it.

Are you truly telling me I should go on, smiling and nodding like a bimbo, with not an idea about whatever dynamics are going on in the family? I may sound selfish here, but I'm not so blinded and lovey dovey to miss that he's being extremely selfish, even cowardly to an extent. I do not know what happened and there are many things that I do not understand - it's for this reason that I'm keeping it cool (on the exterior anyway) but also feel inclined to step away slowly.

 

Hey I havent started batting for the other side Freddie !! lol

What I thought was , he *does* want to share things , but only at the right time eg when he feels its not going to destroy everything for him.
Sometimes , Ive preferred to have some info coaxed out of me , rather than the "RIght tell me xyz NOW" approach.

I also think that he's being quiet about it to please you Hannah , but obviously his silence is causing you , and in a way , you both , difficulties.
___________
Why dont you just take a short while to reflect , try not to go icy cold on him in the meantime.

If I was in his situation ( and yes I only know some of it) , and someone finished with me because Id been quiet on something like this , Id be utterly astonished -partic if they hadnt really pressed to me how important they viewed it.

I know you say you cant make any guarantees about not wanting to finish with him , but I just think that to finish for that reason would be a huge over-reaction.

Try and reflect on your views of the suspected marriage for a few days or so.
Then maybe its time to move towards expressing your fuller views.
As things stand the situation is only moving backwards.