If I have epilepsy...

Discussion in 'Exotic Psychedelic Plants' started by TheEnd808, Jun 30, 2009.

  1. TheEnd808

    TheEnd808 Member

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    Will I have any issues if I decide to try out some of the substances on a site like IAmShaman.com? Have there been any reported increase in seizures with the use of things like Kratom or Sinicuichi? The only substance I've used before besides tobacco and alcohol is marijuana, and I'm looking to have a new, hopefully beneficial experience with some other substances. Sorry for the possibly novice question, but I was diagnosed with epilepsy in the winter, although my case is rather mild compared with some other people (I've only had 5 seizures in six months). I take Keppra as a medication for my epilepsy if that matters at all.

    Additionally, as I'm sure many of you frequent the Psychedelics forum, will any of the stronger psychedelics (LSD, shrooms etc.) cause me to have seizures or provoke any mental problems since I have epilepsy?

    Some help would greatly be appreciated. I'd like to have some new experiences, but if it isn't in the cards at this point in my life, I'll just have to wait until, if ever, my epilepsy goes away.

    Thanks.
     
  2. NorCaliGreenFiend

    NorCaliGreenFiend Senior Member

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    I would talk to your doctor, but kratom isnt intoxicating, beyond the equivalent of a few drinks. I dont know how epilepsy works, though.
     
  3. peacegrow

    peacegrow Member

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    I think you might be better off looking into something like LSD, although it seems contradictory.

    I'm sure many people with epilepsy have taken LSD, so there might be more information about contraindications with medication and whether it causes seizure thresholds to lower. (I'm sure a lot have taken Kratom or Sinicuichi, but it may not be as well documented.)

    When you look at a wide variety of plants, there could be all kinds of issues. (Like, for instance, you definitely can't take a MOAI while on Keppra). All kinds of subtle things, like some herb being metabolised by the same liver enzymes as Keppra throwing you levels off.

    If you are specifically interested in Kratom or Sinicuichi, I would research one of those specifically.

    The main thing is to try not to get discouraged by people who will tell you, "You have xxx condition, so you can absolutely never do yyyy." Collect all the info you can and figure out yourself if you think you can do it.
     
  4. TheEnd808

    TheEnd808 Member

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    Thanks for the comments. Currently doing all the research I can, and will keep your suggestions in mind.
     
  5. nanamin

    nanamin Guest

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    Did you ever end up trying Kratom? I have epilepsy and used kratom for a long time without any significant effects, but I also had a tolerance to it before I developed epilepsy.

    Kratom primarily acts as a mu opioid agonist. Many people notice that there is an additional effect which deals with depression and they mistakenly suspect it is due to serotonergic action. Thing is, I've taken kratom with SSRIs and had no symptoms of serotonin toxicity or anything like that. What kratom does contain, however, are some delta opioid agonists. The delta opioid receptors have a powerful antidepressant effect, but the downside for people like you and me is that delta agonists can also produce seizures.

    The reason this caught my attention is that I'm looking to start back up on kratom and I'm worried about potentially experiencing problems due to the delta opioid agonism. It's hard to find people with epilepsy who use kratom, apparently.

    One thing I did come across in my research is this. Thai kratom has a much higher level of mitragynine than Malay kratom, which in turn may have a lot more mitragynine than Bali. Mitragynine, while primarily a mu receptor agonist, also hits the delta receptors. Furthermore, mitragynine oxidizes as a sample of kratom gets older, forming a selective delta agonist that doesn't hit the mu receptors. Thai and Malay kratom *have* caused problems for me, while Bali has not.

    Unlike mitragynine, there is another primary alkaloid in Kratom which is a powerful mu receptor and is pretty selective to this receptor subtype. It's known as 7-hydroxymitragynine, or 7-OHM.

    It's my opinion that people with epilepsy should consider sticking to cultivars of kratom with lower quantities of mitragynine and focus on those containing a ratio which favors 7-OHM as the active alkaloid. I'm guessing this means Bali and extracts, primarily. Enhanced bali has always been my favorite. If you do consume something with higher levels of mitragynine, you'll want to be sure the sample is relatively fresh so there hasn't been much time for it to oxidize *or* you'll want to see if there's a way you can get a hold of a delta opioid antagonist.

    If anyone with epilepsy is using kratom safely, especially if you have uncontrolled seizures or are not on seizure medicine, I'd like to hear from you. Additionally, if you are using strains like Thai and Malay without problems, that interests me. More importantly, if you *have* had problems with kratom and have epilepsy, I'd especially like to hear from you.

    Standard disclaimer: I'm not a doctor or researcher of any sort. I really don't know what I'm talking about beyond reading studies online and having first-hand experience of a few different things. I'm just some college dropout with epilepsy on the Internet. No medical advice was implied in the above, talk to a doctor before taking kratom, etc etc etc.
     
  6. Lorithehun

    Lorithehun Guest

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    2 days ago I had a seizure, and I'm pretty sure it was from taking too much Kratom. I quit Suboxone 2 weeks ago and had been using Kratom to ease the withdrawal symptoms. There's no way to know exactly what caused the seizure, but an educated guess would be that it was from the Kratom. Makes me sad because I thought I had found a miracle cure for withdrawal symptoms; the kratom made them non-existent. I'm not ready to say that I can't have any more Kratom, I think if I just take it easy with it and take my anti-seizure meds I should be ok.
     
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