Why socialism?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Communism, Jun 16, 2005.

  1. Communism

    Communism Member

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    WHY SOCIALISM
    by Stephen Von Sychowski
    Communist Party of Canada, Prince George Collective.

    Are you tired of watching jobs disappear all around you? Are you tired of watching the social services, labour unions and rights that the people of Canada fought so hard for disappearing? Tired of the liars, cheaters and thieves in government, and their corporate friends getting rich off your work? There is an alternative! It's called Socialism.

    What is Socialism? Socialism is an economic and political system in which the people as a whole own the means of production. This means that the products you make and the funds generated by them all go to the people as a whole. The process by which this is achieved is called nationalization.

    What's the difference between Socialism and Capitalism? There are numerous differences between Capitalism and Socialism. In Capitalism the means of production i.e. factories, natural resources etc, are owned by a tiny minority in society. They hire workers to do the work for them, but they keep most of the profits. This means that a few people become very rich and the rest stay relatively poor in comparison. In Socialism there is no single owner of the factories, resources, banks etc. As a result there is no one person collecting all the profits for him/her, this means that they are more fairly distributed between all the workers. Each person is paid fairly for the work they do and according to what their needs are. Since the majority of money is not in the hands of a few individuals there are also more funds with which to provide universal health care, education, and all the other necessary public services.

    But isn't the N.D.P a Socialist party? Look at the mess they made! This is a very common misconception. Some people will tell you that the N.D.P is a Socialist party, or that Britain currently has a Socialist government. THIS IS FALSE! These people will say that the Socialists want to create a "welfare state" and that the N.D.P in Canada or the Labour Party in Britain are Socialist because they believe in Nationalization of some big industry and they believe in public welfare systems. The truth is that these parties have lost any Socialist beliefs they once had long ago. They only wish to put a pretty face on Capitalism, to make it seem as if it is friendly to its people by providing basic (and usually inadequate) services such as health care and education. And even these services were only given to the people of Capitalist countries after years of pressure from their people. And now even these services are being eliminated by policies of Privatization that are being adopted by the leaders in the Capitalist countries.

    So Socialism won't create a "welfare state?" No, it won't. This is because under Socialism all people have equal rights regardless of sex, skin pigmentation, disability, sexual orientation, appearance and religion. This includes the right to jobs. Under Socialism having a job is a right, and because the profit of a few private individuals is not the driving force of the economy, more jobs can be created. A goal of Socialism is to provide work for all citizens who are capable of working. Therefore the welfare system becomes almost completely unnecessary.

    But isn't Socialism a dictatorship? That couldn't be further from the truth; in fact Capitalism is more of a dictatorship than Socialism. In Capitalism all political and economic power is held by a tiny minority of people in our society. These people are the Capitalist bourgeoisie, or the "upper-class. All the biggest political parties in Canada are led by this upper-class in favor of the upper-class. And the upper-class corporations rule the economy. They say that we have freedom because we have elections but you can bet that even if the majority of Canadians voted for a Socialist party, they would use all forces possible to stay in power despite the will of the people. In Socialism everything including the governing body of society is owned and run by the people, there is no elite class to elect therefore the working class (majority) of people run the country through the government in the favor of the majority of people not in the favor of a small elite group.

    So why do we always hear such bad thing's about Socialism? That's because the education system, the media, and of course the government is run by the ruling class Capitalists. They don't want you to know the truth because it is a threat to their power. So they make up lies, or they manipulate the truth to be suitable for their causes. It's been the trick of Capitalist governments ever since the beginning of the struggle between Socialism and Capitalism.

    Need some examples of the success of Socialism? Let's take a look at how Cuba has progressed since it changed from Capitalism to Socialism.

    Racism When Cuba was Capitalist blacks were banned from many bars, restaurants, beaches, theatres and night clubs amongst other places. They were treated like second-rate human beings just because of the color of their skin. Almost no blacks could go to school, only the rich and white were permitted to become educated. Since Socialism began in Cuba these laws were removed. Now all people are considered equal human beings regardless of their color.

    Sexism Before Socialism women were also considered lower-class, they made up the majority of un-employed and illiterate people in Cuba. Since then women have gone from being 19.2% of the work force to 43.2% In the year 2000 62% of University graduates were women, as opposed to almost none under Capitalism.

    Homophobia Homosexuals had no rights before Cuba became Socialist. Now they are considered equal to the rest of society, all anti-homosexual laws were repealed by the Socialist government of Cuba. It has been striving to eliminate homophobia through education. In 1995 the May Day parade was led by Cuban drag queens in order to show Socialisms acceptance of all people, the parade was well received by the public.

    Education Under Capitalism only the few rich upper-class Cubans could afford education. Now there is free universal education for all in Cuba.

    Health care Health care also used to be a privilege of the rich and powerful in Cuba. But now it also is universally available for free. Cuba now has one doctor for every 175 citizens, this is better than the Capitalist countries. Canada has one doctor for every 1111 citizens. Britain has one doctor for every 845 citizens.

    Not to mention that Cuba is "Third World" country. Imagine what a "First World" country like Canada could accomplish!

    What can I do? You can protest again Capitalism, and fight for a better future. You can join the Communist Party of Canada-Canada's party of Socialism. They can be found at http://www.communist-party.ca You can vote for a Socialist future in the next election and you can campaign for one in your own town by spreading the word to other people in your community.

    We can build a better future, free from poverty, hunger, greed, war and prejudice. That's why we choose Socialism!
     
  2. Bassist

    Bassist Gate crasher!

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    What do you call a famous communist leader in history that resorted to capitalistic ideas to save the economy? Hypocrisy, for one.

    [Kudos to the first to name him].

    There is a simple explanation why communist nations have never been successful with "true" communism...it is ignorance towards basic human nature. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
     
  3. HonkyTonk

    HonkyTonk Member

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    sigh are you ever going to understand that communism will never work?
     
  4. m6m

    m6m Member

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    We lived as brave and Free Men for hundreds of thousand of years wholistically, Communally, before the deadly stress, of the great climatic shift ten thousand years ago, drove us into an hysterical and effeminate death-fear.

    Because of our effeminate death-fear, We the Civilized have been bending-over obediently too long to the Alpha-Male father-symbol of authority and security.

    Communism will never work amongst We the Civilized, because the anal-retentive grasping of Capitalism is the most efficient expression of the homo-erotic impulse of Civilized Man's latent homo-sexuality.
     
  5. Communism

    Communism Member

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    Why no constructive replies?

    A fictional character.

    Capitalism was not restored (in for example) the Soviet Union because the command economy did not work. No, it was restored because revisionist grabbed the government, and the real marxist-leninists were put in prison.



    There is no such thing as a communist nation.

    A smart thing to do, before starting to criticize and condemn something, you should know basics. Obviously, you do not.

    I don't want to condemn Einsteins theories, I don't want to condemn Energy equivalence, if I do not know what it means.


    Obviously, this thread was about socialism, not communism.





    Why don't you want a constructive debate, instead of resorting to childish and inane comments? Fear of what you "learned" in your childhood, was actually wrong?
     
  6. GraffitiSoul

    GraffitiSoul Member

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    what do u mean communism doesnt work, it worked for ussr, rose russia from a big open farmland to a world superpower, post and pre communist russia are capitalist look at them now...its a shithole. RUssia only failed when gorbachev came along and tried to convert their communist infrastructure to a socialist-capitalist one, he failed and for te past 25 years theve been cleaning the mess. capitalism doesnt work... worked masterfully 4 cuba...nationalized health care(with some of the best doctors in teh world, for nation that once allowed a large citizens to starve to death when there was plenty of food), in fact cubas life expectancy just passed ours, its works, cubas economy is shit b/c of us, 95% of their trade was with us before communism, they have a revolution we get scarred and slap an embargo on them, thats 95% of their trade gone, they were fully dependent on us, they then had to find other allies to trade with and found them in Russia, France, South Africa, and other countries who were inconvienently far away.
     
  7. GraffitiSoul

    GraffitiSoul Member

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    and by the way capitalism (private industry) doesn contradict democratic socialism, they are compatable
     
  8. Pointbreak

    Pointbreak Banned

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    If Bush shut down all political parties, cancelled all elections, closed all non state media, took away your freedom of movement, speech, religion, and assembly, but raised life expectancy, would you consider him the best president ever?

    In other words, why do you lower your standards to much to find some measure by which Castro can be considered "good"? How much freedom are you willing to sacrifice for a one year longer life expectancy?

    How would you like it if instead of Skip, Communism was the webmaster, and instead of occasional idiotic threads where he posts articles by written by communists for the communist newletters of communists political parties explaining the wonders of communism, ALL threads were about the wonders of communism and Communism could have you arrested if you didn't read them or if you didn't listen to four hour speeches on the fantastic success of Castro-beardism by the beard for life himself?
     
  9. Common Sense

    Common Sense Member

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    Probably because the article doesn't say anything at all, other than a few fun facts about Cuba. The article reads like a grade 8 English paper.

    "You think socialism is a dictatorship?"
    "Socialism's not a dictatorship!"

    "You think socialism will create a wellfare state?"
    "Socialism won't create a wellfare state!"

    The reasoning behind the wellfare state point is classic, too. "Why won't socialism make a wellfare state? Well, because under socialism all people are equal regardless of race, class, or creed" (which of course has nothing to do with wellfare). "And best of all, under socialism everyone will have a right to jobs!" I love how you can just make up a right to anything and if it sounds good people will buy it. Of course there's no mention of how new jobs will be created or where they'll come from, but I guess they want to work out the details later. I'm Canadian and if we went into a planned economy with that little of a plan, we'd be in a lot of trouble.
     
  10. m6m

    m6m Member

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    Because the idea of Egalitarian Socialism germinating and growing healthy from the mentally ill soil of our Hierarchical Civilization is too tragi-comic to consider.


    The best face I can put on such a forlorn question is this:

    That the journey to healing the mental health of Civilized Man's collective unconscious has to begin some where.

    Forget for the moment that the dielectical process of Euro-centric Socialism merely perpetuates the same fight or flight dualistic mind that has fixated Civilized Man for ten thousand years.

    Forget that this dielectical process is preoccupied with a crude Materialism that merely perpetuates Civilized Man's degenerate junkie addiction to the cozy effeminate comforts of materialism.

    Forget all these profound weaknesses of Civilized Man's pathetic attempt to regain our lost ancient Egalitarian Socialism, and look, instead, at this clumsy attempt as merely the first step, the first awakening from eons of Zombie slumber.

    Pathetic or not, it's about as big a step as the spineless weakling known as Civilized Man can take.

    That's Why Socialism, but that's also why it's so hard to be constructive or optimistic in these circumstances.
     
  11. GraffitiSoul

    GraffitiSoul Member

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    this his choice as an authoritarian ruler, with whom the people are very happy with, if there were elections, anyone whos been to Cuba(myself included) hed jsut be elected again...so yes i call it a success to make a slave like feifdom into a respectable country...
    if culturally we were used to authritarian rulers and had no objection to authoritarianism, then hell fucking yes, Id consider any improvement in society, with no negative reprecussions a success...and for the avg. cuban life expectancy increased by close to 40 yrs, they developed an amazing education system, they had their first civil rts movement, theyre more religiously tolerant(post revolution)...and lots of other pros. Im not a big castro fan, i wasnt saying hes an ideal ruler, all Im saying is anyone with any prior knowlege of cuba, pre-revolution, would call castros regime a success(relative)...unless ofcourse u measure success by the amount of private enterprise.
     
  12. Communism

    Communism Member

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    There not many political parties in Cuba, but the electoral system in Cuba has little to do with parties, anyways.

    There are elections in Cuba.

    Everyone from 16 and upwards have the right to vote.


    Of course. Cuba is against capitalism. Why should they allow it? That would be against the socialist nature of Cuba.

    What? Cubans can move wherever they want to.

    There are free speech in Cuba.

    There is freedom of religion in Cuba. You can believe in anything you want to believe in.

    Who says freedom has been lost?

    Cubans have a lot of freedoms.

    Freedom to study to become a doctor, without paying a penny.



    Freedom to read and write (before the revolution, over 23 percent of the population was illiterate. in a few years, everyone could read and write, because of a literacy campaign by the cuban people).

    Freedom to not work for a greedy capitalist who exploit your labor power. Instead, you work for the betterment of all people, not just a few.



    Freedom to have a house, without paying large sums for it (most people in Cuba live in a house for free).

    Freedom to live in a society that take care of every citizen, and protect the well being of all people.


    Freedom to live without the fear of being robbed or shot in the streets (like in the ghettos in the US, for example).
     
  13. communism only works in microcosms, as does barter, money institutionalized barter, capitilism made money make sense, communism, like barter cannot practically work on a large scale.


    capitilism can work for people, it just requires someone to make the effort, communism doesn't give you the option of an effort to help others, in communism there is a limit to how much an individual can do set forth by the hours in a day....
     
  14. now I'll take those two talking points.....

    http://web.amnesty.org/report2005/cub-summary-eng

    a prisonor of concience is a POLITICAL PRISONOR

    elections in cuba are fixed, why does fidel always win?

    even though people run every year from his regim, even though people hate it there?

    BECAUSE IT'S NOT AT ALL FRE, you live in a propagandist dreamland, I know you think we live in a propagandist dream land but really yor are out of your gourd, completly and totally, you are denying reality to a point that it is seeming that you need psycological help....
     
  15. Communism

    Communism Member

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    If you co-operate with an enemy superpower that has bombed, invaded, terrorized, and even biological weapons against your own country, and if you, being aware of that, help the superpower with destabilizing and destroying your own country, then you are a traitor, and you should be condemned.

    Proof?



    He doesn't "win". He is elected by the national assembly, which in turn, is elected by the people.




    People don't have to "run". They are free to leave Cuba any time they wish. In fact, Cuba has encouraged people who want to leave, to leave. It is not long ago Cuba sent criminals over to the US, but after a while, they refused to take in more Cubans.

    You claim Cuban people "run every year from the regime", and claim that there is no "freedom of movement" in Cuba, but did you know that North Americans are not allowed to travel to Cuba? They have to "run every year from the US regime" to either Canada or Mexico, and travel from there. The Cubans make sure there pass is not stamped, so the US government won't know. North Americans who have been found guilty in this act, can be punished with prison sentence and a large, large fine.


    I live in the West. I live under a propagandadist dreamland, but I refused to believe everything the propaganda say. I could say the same thing to you. The US is a master in propaganda. You wouldn't be so hostile against Cubans if it wasn't for the Western propaganda.

    But I am intelligent enough to believe what I want to believe. But hey, your way works, too. It's so much easier to make everyone think for you, instead to think for yourself. Listen to the news, listen to the president/prime minister/whater, and believe it to be the absolute truth. You're going to feel accepted, but at the same time, you are going to be a dumb shit.

    Make your pick.
     
  16. GraffitiSoul

    GraffitiSoul Member

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    cuban elections are about as fixed as american ones
     
  17. Communism

    Communism Member

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    I agree with you.








    The Cuban election serve to please people, just like American elections.

    The difference is that Cuba protect the working class, and the US protect the bourgeois (capitalist class). No elections, at least in class society, are neutral.

    To a large degree, though. But the Cuban democracy is not just about elections. People do actually have some major decision making to do, beside elections. But I still agree with you.


    Here are some links regarding the democracy (hate to use that word, but okay) in Cuba:

    http://www.quaylargo.com/Productions/McCelvey.html

    http://www.canadiandimension.mb.ca/v37/v37_4kw.htm

    http://www.leninism.org/stream/99/mll/0512-danchr.asp
     
  18. Bassist

    Bassist Gate crasher!

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  19. Communism

    Communism Member

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    That site contain quotes of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, the fascist who support the fascist government in Spain, Nazi Germany and latin american fascist states.








    What a "fair and balanced" source.


    Do you understand the difference between imprisoning persons because of expressing themselves through words, and imprisoning persons who have tried to topple the state, have actively co-operate and assisted the enemy, and has tried to terrorize the nation?


    Why are you so obsessed with attacking a poor nation suffering from a superpower who try to do everything to destroy it's people? Why?

    By the way, I am not going to discuss further with you, unless you stop your personal attacks. In a football field, that would have been a red card.
     
  20. Bassist

    Bassist Gate crasher!

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    Wait...what are you talking about here?

    It's hard when you blatantly ignore the facts and naive concepts of communism.

    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cuban+political+prisoners&btnG=Google+Search

    Here's a link of a google search. Find a website that is "fair and balanced".
     

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