Bible Questions? III

I'm not aware of what the law was [in regards to what was considered under age] back in biblical times. The passage that you quoted "obey those who rule over you" implies that a child could not say no to an adult .

PAX

 

It does seem like you want a strict quote saying so. The Bible is full of parables and a lot of things aren't said in a direct way. Yes, perhaps it means a child and an older adult, but the Bible does not mention anything 'pro child sex' from what I remember so it would be a little odd for it too mean that.

 

You're right in thinking that. The rulers of the nations are put in place there and taken out of place by God because "God has put it into their hearts to carry out His plan". So respecting the rulers is also an act of faith because we are putting our trust in God to do the battling for us. Also, apply what you said and what thedope said about 'offending' children and I think that helps to answer the questions people may have.

Rev 17:17
For God has put it into their hearts to accomplish his purpose by agreeing to give the beast their power to rule, until God's words are fulfilled.

Luke 2:1-7
Mary and Joseph participated in the census.

Romans 13:1-7
Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God...

Christians are also asked to settling their legal disputes quickly as to not get in trouble by the governing authority of their day.

 

You could also make the same inference regarding honoring you father and mother.
Now this causes me to say that these vague areas of interpretation and dispute are the very reason for the Christ teaching, that for judgment he had come, to undo this enmity between brothers.
It it said, start over, no one puts new wine in old skins. Leave the dead to bury the dead. No more retribution, no more arbitration, no more accusation, recognition of all persons equal inheritance in creation.

 

I think most of you people are reading too much into it. I already knew the answer to my question. I suspect that you have never had long and lengthy conversations with BORN AGAIN CHRISTIANS. I was hoping that I would get into a conversation with one, since this is supposed to be a Christian only forum. The point I was trying to make really did not have anything to do with sex or pedophilia. What I was attempting to do was to show that the bible is not perfect. B A C 'S take the Bible in it's most literal form . They don' t believe that there can be an error or mistake in the bible. To admit that there is one error then it opens the door to the complete interpretation of the bible which in their eyes THEY JUST CAN'T DO! They even dismiss evolution and believe in Adam and Eve. If you were to read the last paragraph in the Bible, it states that nothing can be added or taken away because it is perfect in it's form. And to show that this is not correct: and a dramatic mistake at that, makes BAC's refer to you as a servant of the anti-Christ. I've had this dispute with Christians since I can't remember when. It always ends the same way-hatred spewed upon me and all I ever do is wipe it off and throw it back at them. I certainly hope the point I am making is perfectly clear now. If not, we can discuss this further.

If any Christian fundamentalist has gone through the trouble of reading this, by all means: respond to my post- let's discuss this in greater detail.

PAX

 

I'm really not sure why you would want to repeat that contentious experience, do you imagine it might turn out differently next time? Have you refined your arguments to the point that you can restore mindfulness to the mindless? It would seem that if you were to derive any merit from a discussion on this issue, you would prefer to seek out a "reasonable" christian.

 

I guess I should tell you a little bit about myself. Ever since I can remember, I have always questioned authority especially when it involves blind faith. Having a debate with someone who has blind faith can lead to a lot of interesting ideas coming to light. Trying to restore mindfulness to the mindless is indeed a challenge which I enjoy greatly. The first experience that I can recall having a great debate was with the nuns and priests in the Catholic Church that I attended when I was young. It all started when I came of age to be confirmed. Needless to say, I did not confirm any beliefs in the Catholic church which outraged the people in authority. An eleven year old is supposed to just fall in line and not question anything. This laid the groundwork for how I have dealt with religion ever since. I guess if I was going to categorize myself, I would say that I am spiritual. I believe in the power of love and that it can overcome all adversities. When it comes to religion, I haven't found a niche anywhere. I know that a lot of people who are reading this will think that I'm a real arrogant bastard: everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I hope this gives a little bit of insight as to where I'm coming from.

PAX

 

So Pax, I see where you are coming from, and from what you have said you appear to want to be involved in some personal development. My question then is do you want to develop your debating technique or develop your understanding. Your early claim to fame was simply to be annoyingly inquisitive.
I tell you I've met mosquitoes that were very adept at that.

 

For the image of god similar to man question: who bets on Copeland; who bets on Benny Hinn? I'm still doeing (maybe on behalf of the Pope).

 

The Bible is perfect but in the sense of giving us what is needed to lead us to God, the pathways away from God are many and are not all included nor do they need to be.

As for pedophilia, the word porneia is used, in the Bible and is usually translated fornication, it covers almost any sexual act outside of Godly marriage.

 

If you mean that the Bible can not be understood intellectually because we can not understand how it does what it does, then yes I agree with you but if you mean that the Bible says, can not be understood intellectually, then I have to disagree with you.

 

The Bible says: But if anyone thinks he is behaving improperly toward his virginity, if that is past the bloom of youth, and this is the way it should take place, let him do what he wants; he does not sin. Let them marry. (1 Corinthians 7:36)

Please notice that the Bible recommends marriage only after the bloom of youth has passed and not at ten years old, which would not be passed the bloom of youth. Any other sex outside Godly marriage is not allowed.

 

The Bible as you said; is complete. Thus it needs no additions now from Holy Men in the world now.

 

So in other words you don't know. No one said anything about needing Holy men, I said are there Holy men in the world today? Are there prophets?

 

we agree.

 

1 Cor 14:5-6 suggests that there are. Not only that but that the prophecy is edifying to the church. Here is a spiritual gift to man that is equal to scripture in it's ability to edify.

 

You are correct, the Bible says "obey those who rule over you", as long as what they ask doesn't conflict with what God asks of us.

 

If your intent is to show the Bible is flawed, your example is a poor one. If one follows the principles laid out in the Bible, one would not commit pedophilia, so there is no need to directly forbid it. The Bible is designed to show us the way to go, not to tell us all the things we should not do and if we are headed the way we should go, we will automatically be headed away from the things we should not do, which would include pedophilia.

 

Christians are not to have "Blind" faith, the bible says: Faith is the assured expectation of things hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities though not beheld. (Hebrews 11:1), which is far from "Blind" faith.

 

I would really like to know what kind of Christian you consider yourself. Unfortunately, there are many types of Christians. There are fundamentalists who have been basically been raised in a Christian environment. There are Born Again Christians. There are even Christians who believe that Jesus was a hippie.

To discuss the passing of the bloom of youth : to quote a gross statement that I heard in my youth "if your old enough to bleed you are old enough to breed."
and who is to say a ten yr old girl can't start her period? In my eyes if an older gentleman gets married to a 'young girl', I think that makes him a pedophile. And if you think arranged marriages like this don't happen in this day and age you must be living in some kind of fantasy world.


PAX