Brexit

Only Labour will give the people a final say on Brexit | Jeremy Corbyn

Corbyn wants to extend all the fun through a general election, then a second referendum

Youd need a new labour leader with a personality for any chance of that working

 

VG

LOL - As I’ve pointed out every time you post you show you how ill-informed you are - you think Germany can do a trade deal on its own?

Oh hell you are so funny in your desperation to score a point any point

LOL how can it be JUST NOW if I said it on page one – READ THE FUCKING POSTS

And as I’ve pointed out to before trade is important, I’ve not said it isn’t

Honestly man – I can’t tell if you are just incapable of understanding what others say or you’re just been dishonest

Again that has been covered in the post about GDP falls under a no deal

What the fuck are you talking about?

Yes and so…what is your point?

READ THE FUCKING POSTS

Look what is the point of covering things twice, three times four times ten times if you are just going to refuse to read stuff or ignore it?

Oh man LOL what are you on about now?

 

Remember this was, and is, about the information coming from each side of the debate

As a remainer I’m not trying to be evasive or refusing to explain my thinking I’m very happy to answer questions and address criticisms.

But for the leavers that seems be the very opposite, they make up excuses why they can’t talk, they constantly evade or ignore, they out and out refuse to explain their thinking, they moan about even been asked questions and they dismiss criticisms without addressing them.

And they just repeat tings over and over that have already been debunked

And their leaders cheat, lie and try to limit debate.

To go back to the second-hand car story again

You go to one person who has the cars current MOT and log book, they can answer all your questions about the history of the car, clearly and distinctly, they let you look at the engine and anything else you want and are happy to give you a test drive.

And then there is another seller who has none of the paperwork (can give them to you later after you hand over the money) who refuses to answer any of your questions, will not allow you to look under the bonnet or check for rust, and says he doesn’t have the keys right now so can’t give you a test drive - but who keeps telling you very loudly that if you buy it it’s going to be a WONDERFUL because it’s a GREAT car, the BEST car, a FANTASTIC car’

Honestly which car would you most likely buy?

I mean many of the leavers here are trying to convince people that Brexit - even a hard Brexit - is going to be wonderful, great and fantastic, BUT seem unable to actually explain why.

But virtually all the evidence seems to be point to the fact Brexit is not a good idea even the government’s own analysis points to it not been.

So for no gains they can rationally explain and in the face of valid arguments pointing to a Brexit causing the UK and many of its people some considerable hurt they still want Brexit – WHY?

 

You say:

I say

Then you say

???

You are not saying anything, not going in to specifics, detail, hell not even posting any links

Hell, even I had to post the link to the Corbyn interview where he finally actually made a decision on something


I read the posts again

"long term things are likely to be bad"

Oooh, they are likely to be bad are? Whats likely to be bad, how bad

I could re read that 100 times, its still going to sound like Im arguing with a chimpanzee that learned sign language

 

VG

Look it has been explained many times why a Brexit is likely to be bad especially if we have the hard Brexit you seem to be championing - but as I’ve said you have either refused to read those posts or ignore them so what is the point of cover the same stuff over and over– I know they're there and anyone wishing to read this thread can find it.

And I can repeat them when needed.

But the fact is that I’ve asked you to explain why you think a hard Brexit will be good and you’ve repeatedly refused to answer - that makes it very clear that you seem unwilling or unable to answer that particular question so let me ask again for what seems like the hundredth time –

Why do you think a Brexit especially a hard Brexit will be good for the UK economy?

 

When you talk about page one, there doesnt seem to be much substance from you there either. One rather long winded post from Blackbill with stuff like this:

A unified human race, and lolz, europe is going to show us how its done. Lolz, what a wank

And a little speech from you about De Gaulle, the guy that ran away and hid in WWII

is this what you are referring to with the posts everyone should read? Have you gone the last 74 pages telling people to 'read the posts' and you are referring to posts you didnt even right?

 

VG

LOL so you’re considered criticism of what was said is ‘wank’ and insulting Charles de Gaulle.

You really are one of the world’s great intellectuals aren’t you?

Anyway I ask again - Why do you think a Brexit especially a hard Brexit will be good for the UK economy?

 

Well, what else am I supposed to do but laugh?

A unified europe is the path to a unified human race

Ha ha ha ha

 

VG

Sorry mate but that just comes across as mad and creepy

Anyway once again - - Why do you think a Brexit especially a hard Brexit will be good for the UK economy?

 

So, its not the - A unified europe is the path to a unified human race - part you find mad and and creepy

Its the ha ha ha fookin what part

A unified europe is the path to a unified human race

The Americans are like, dude, didnt we have to come save/kick your ass 75 years ago?

The Australians are like, dude, you sent us to the other side of the planet, where its warmer, theres more fish, and a lot more stuff in the ground to dig up

 

VG

Well first it makes it clear you had not read those post before now and second what has the US involvement in WWII and transportation and migration to Australia got to do with Brexit.

As said you do come across as ill-informed and increasingly as unhinged

Anyway once again - - Why do you think a Brexit especially a hard Brexit will be good for the UK economy?

 

Lolz, what does any of that first page have to do with Brexit?

 

VG

What the fuck are you on about now?

Anyway once again - - Why do you think a Brexit especially a hard Brexit will be good for the UK economy?[/quote]

 

Going global is fatal to Nationhood. A US WEXIT is strongly encouraged.

 

Short and sweet Nudist.
The last thing I want is to be part of and swallowed up by a bureaucratic costly conglomerate of shysters who are bleeding us dry to the tune of around 16 Billions pounds a year.
And now they want 39 BILLION POUNDS off us to allow us to escape the circus.
Piss off EU and go screw some other poor bastard country who fall for you and your dictatorship.
Very soon we will be FREE.
FREE AT LAST!

 

The first page of this thread.

You keep saying read the posts, or swearing and saying read the ****ing posts.

Which actual posts are you talking about

Please specify which posts FROM YOU contain any substance in regards to Brexit.

You went 20 pages with me saying read the post, then you said the magic happens page 1 of this thread, so I read page 1 and its rubbish. That kind of stuff from blackbill and some nuthugging about De Gaulle from you


????


Please point out the posts you are actually referring to when for the last 20 pages you have said read the posts

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/unification-not-no-deal-brexit-will-destroy-ireland/

 

A revised and edited copy of post 3 from page one

It was always meant to give the subject some context

*

It seems to me that De Gaulle was right when he famously vetoed Britain’s entry into what would become the EU. He didn’t think Britain as a nation thought of itself as European and so had little interest in the ‘European Project’ which was form the beginning the idea of ever greater union as a means and to the end of stopping the wars that had devastated Europe since the fall of the Western Roman Empire. De Gaulle thought that Britain would have to undergo a “radical transformation" before it would actually sign up to the project. I think that he thought that the only reason Britain wanted to join was to get into the market, all the easier to sell British goods to the French, Germans, Italians etc, but the common market was only ever a means to an end, the end been that ever closer union.

And many of the politicians that wanted into the European union sold it as such - as a market place - with very little said about the project and when we did get in the Little Britain nationalists and the wealth owned media have been railing against the ever closer union, using all the dark arts of spin, innuendo and often straight out lying.

But there were many that did know about the project and were in favour of it, but that voice was drowned out.

There was something on the BBC at the time of the referendum on what people from around Europe thought of the vote and a couple of comments from a German and a French woman are telling

German – “My feeling is that countries who do not believe in the values of the EU should leave the union. It will be better for the remaining countries, because only then can they create a real democratic, governed and socially united Europe”

French – “For me, Europe is about more than just free trade. It is also about sticking together and preventing another world war. It is about sharing the same democratic values and principles”

*

The EU isn’t perfect I have many criticisms of it but in a lot of ways it is a victim of its own ideals, its success and circumstance.

In many was the EU seems based on emotion not reason, of the heart overruling the head, coming as it did out of a desire to end wars, the EU often seems to take steps forward before really thinking things through (or in the hope that taking the step will produce the momentum to move forward) for example the Euro was a great idea, a common currency, but it needed a common financial policy.

The union began with six countries (Belgium, France, Germany, Italy, Luxembourg, Netherlands) and has grown ever since because countries wanted to join it. To me it probably reached its ‘natural’ size in 1986 with West Germany, France, Italy, the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Denmark, Ireland, United Kingdom, Greece, Spain and Portugal (although I think the UK wasn’t committed and Greece unready) it was a number that could be worked with so in my view it needed to stop there and consolidate.

The big tragedy for the EU was the collapse of Soviet Russia, West Germany was distracted by reunification with East Germany (creating a politically unbalancing of the EU) and lots of soviet satellites wanted to join the EU as protection against the Russian bear. And it seems to me that some also never had the project in mind or shared the ideals (so we have problems like Poland).

So we now have an EU with 28 members with others still seeking entry, it is much more difficult to weld that number of states together but not impossible (it has taken 58 years from the treaty of Rome today to get to 28 states in the US from the 1787 it took 58 years for it to reach 28 states although I’d be the first to say they are many difference)

*

I think it would be madness to leave, those that somehow think Britain could go it alone I don’t think understand the real world.

What would we gain and what would we lose?

We supposedly gain sovereignty our Parliament will be free to do as it wishes without ‘interference’ from Europe. But the world is interconnected and if we want to trade with others we have to follow their rules and regulations and the place we most trade with are countries in the EU, we would still have to follow their rules it just that from outside we just wouldn’t have a say in what those rules were.

Oh we could then not have to comply with the European human rights act but honestly when is saying you don’t want to uphold human rights a good thing?

So what would we lose well probably Scotland for a start possibly even Wales which would be even more devastated than it has been and so might even want to follow.

Things have changed in the UK once we did have a healthy manufacturing base but Maggie devastated that and a lot of industries and companies come here because the UK governments have been more ‘business friendly’ than other EU countries but also in the EU so they can sell their goods within Europe, with Brexit to attract such companies we would have to counter the fact we were outside the EU by being even more ‘business friendly’.

The selling off of the NHS, lower food standards, cutting of workers’ rights, zero hour contracts, cuts in public services, tax cuts for the already advantaged etc etc

 

VG

So you swore you had read the posts in the thread then it turns out you have NOT even read page one, and now you want me to point out what posts to read because you hadn’t done it before? LOL

Look why should I do the work for you because you are too fucking lazy to do anything for yourself, what are you a baby, so far all you do is evade and lie though your teeth at every turn.

A person of such critical depth that his rational and reasonable criticism of posts extend to calling them ‘wank’ and ‘nuthugging’

You are a perfect example of the type of intellectual giant that has been drawn to Brexit.

So once again - - Why do you think a Brexit, especially a hard Brexit, will be good for the UK economy?

 

That was a normal, even some what poetic post, until those last two paragraphs