Brexit

Mal

The main basis of my argument which I’ve explained at length and in detail is that Brexit isn’t likely to be good for the country and is likely to do it and many of its people much harm.

What I’m pointing out is that NO leavers seems able to explain in any rational or reasonable way why they think leaving will be good for the country.

 

So why do you bother replying to a Liar ?

 

Mal

As I’ve said before looking across the Brexit threads on the forum you can get a feel for the characters of the supporters on each side of the argument and I’m sorry to say that is a sad indictment of those on the leavers side who often come across as Il-informed, hate filled, mean of spirit and petty and like you seem happy to say barefaced lies.

Maybe being a liar is not important to you which gives even more insight into your character – You voted to leave (although you lie about voting remain) but in all the time I’ve know you, you haven’t put up any rational argument as to why leaving is a good idea.

Nothing you have presented as reasons has stood up to scrutiny even the thing you give as your reason for hating the EU (the carpet story) doesn’t stand up when looked at.

Again think about it you are quiet happy to publically lie to people here what does that say about your character and judgement?

It seems to me that many on the leaver side are happy to be lied at and to lie themselves and as explained before that is not a beneficial trend in politics

 

You mean Like when you said you understood perfectly that the Common market was going to turn into the EU when you were twelve years old at the time ?

 

Mal

LOL – are you saying you think a 12 year old is incapable of understanding anything?

Have you any children? Have you ever been around 12 year old?

Do you think they are all stupid?

I grew up in a house were politics was often discussed I’d already begun reading history books and the daily paper so what is strange about understanding the European Project, it is a pretty simple concept to grasp – the creation of lasting peace through ever closer union, anyone looking into it would know that the UK was signing up to the ‘European project’ and ‘ever closer union’ That the whole idea of the European project was for ‘ever closer union’ “It is found in the Preamble to the 1957 treaty that set up what became the EU [and] on at least six occasions the UK has signed up to it (firstly in becoming a member, and then agreeing to subsequent treaty changes)”

It has been the right wing (often neoliberal and wealth owned) media that have constantly pushed the idea that the EU was (or should) be only about trade and nothing more because they like neoliberal trade deals but don’t like what they see as social interference (like the EU's forthcoming anti-tax avoidance rules).

 

You Just cut and Pasted that Bet you would have been able to do that at Twelve years old as well !
We will get trade deals with the EU countries it is in their interests (that is if there is an EU in the future ) and This country Will prosper I know you dont like tho sound of that but it will happen and now we have a strong government Brexit wont be stopped !

 

Mal

Now lets us look at your lie I mean you have basically gone through three different stances –

First you claimed you were a remainer and voted remain until you ‘saw the light’ and realised how bad remaining was.

Second you said you were weak and voted remain and was afterwards felt ashamed – having us believe that you a fervent and even aggressive leaver got into the voting booth and in that second changed the whole of your opinion voted remain then left the both and changed the whole of you views back again?

Third you then claimed that you had made a mistake – that you, a fervent and even aggressive leaver, are so dumb that you got into the voting booth and made the wrong choice out of TWO?

I mean please I don’t think you had an instant lapse of long and deeply held beliefs or that you are dumb, but I do think you saw the value in claiming you had been converted – I mean it’s one of the oldest (emotional) arguments in the book for trying to win people to your side – ‘oh I was once a sinner like you but then I saw the light’

The problem was you never was a remainer

 

Mal

I ask again - Have you any children? Have you ever been around 12 year olds? Do you think they are all stupid?

I’ve already said that yes some form of Brexit is inevitable now but that still doesn’t make it a good ideas so AGAIN I ask what are your rational and reasonable arguments for believing the UK ‘will prosper?

 

No lets not Eh This is what you Do when You are proved Wrong ! Stick to the Fucking argument and not My morals !

 

True I was never a Remainer But I didnt realize that fact really until the day after the vote when the results were announced ! I never claimed (as you keep saying ) to have seen any kind of light only that if there was another vote i would do what I should have done ! YOU not me are the one saying all that "seen the Light" bollox Now I have explained my "lie" will you stop using it as your proof that Brexit is the wrong decision !

Oh I also said "I thought I was voting for Breakfast" if you want to make a big deal of that one ?

 

Mal

You don’t seem to have ever posted a remain post

You have posted a shit load of anti-EU posts

You have told us your anti-EU views are based on things that happen some 8 years before the referendum

And you actually say you voted OUT several times, even on the day of the referendum

And now you are trying to tell us that you were a remainer up to the point of voting then suddenly the minute after you’d voted you realised you were a leaver?

And then lied to your family and everyone here that you had voted OUT (and several times after) before beginning to claim you voted remain but regretted it and would vote differently

Oh come on man do you really think that floats?

 

Mal

OK I ask again - what are your rational and reasonable arguments for believing the UK ‘will prosper' because of Brexit?

 

No Have you read ANY of what I said (a 12 year old would understand) and I never claimed that I had anti EU views eight years before the referendum You asked me a Question about how it had affected me personally and I answered your Question !
Also where did I say I was a Remainer up to the point of voting I already said I was never a remainer I just made the wrong choice on the day How is that so hard for you to Get ??

Or does it not fit your agenda !!

 

Does seem certain now. I guess in about a year we'll finally know if the dire predictions about the economy were accurate.

Good luck UK friends!

 

I would refer back to the arguments given (you're already referring back to a lot of other stuff so it shouldn't be much of an extra effort) and try to go from there.

This convo could be worthwile/interesting if the arguments where actually discussed and expanded on, but maybe people are taking you the wrong way when you repeat again that no argument have been given. I agree its going in circles now mainly because you keep repeating the questions and no leaver is answering satisfactory, but hey. Let's give it a try.

Like, of course there are gonna be trade deals with the EU, but why does a leaver, like Mally for example, assume exactly that those will be better for the UK than what the UK had before? What's the lever there? Or is no lever needed?

 

Mal

So why say that I was lying when I said I understood about the EU when I was 12, when you admit I probably would have?

You said your views on the EU affecting you adversely (in the context of why you disliked the EU) were based on something that had happened 8 years before the election.

And you are saying that although you have never posted anything in favour of the EU you voted remain in the booth but then lied to your family and us here about it afterwards claiming several timers that you voted out. Really that is your story now, really? I mean however you look at it you were lying.

Mal posted jun 23 2016 THE DAY OF THE VOTE

I have Voted Out My Wife Has Voted The same Everyone I know Except one Has Said They Voted out, My Daughter asked at the polling station and they said The turn out was huge !!
I honestly Believe its A North South thing With London Wanting To remain and the rest of the Country Want out

 

Again Why the Fuck is This about ME ? are you really that Desperate ?

yeah you would have Understood at Twelve Because your a Fucking Genius (where Did I say that) You really are a Sad Fuck and Asmo wonders Why people dont give you answers

The Answers are there But YOU are not Listening !

 

Asmo

You have to understand that this isn’t a normal argument because it is already known that the leavers have no rational argument for Brexit not only in this thread but outside of it all object analysis of Brexit indicate the UK will be worse off if it goes through with a Brexit, it’s just a matter of how much under differing scenarios.

My questioning is to keep pointing out that reality.

What I’m seeking is why are people still in favour Brexit, even when there are no rational arguments for it.

Booze has given us the racist argument but I refuse to believe (as some do) that all leavers are motivated by racism so what other reasons do people have for still wanting it?

The problem is that many still seem to believe there are some rational reasons for Brexit (although they can’t find any) and that the UK will somehow be better off (although they don’t know why or how).

 

Mal

But you have never put forward any rational arguments for why you think the UK would be better off leaving, if you think you have I believe I can reassure you you haven’t, but I’d be very happy if you proved me wrong – so where?

 

Happy New Ranting Bulby my friend.
I must admit mate.
You do amuse the shit out of me!